How about making Rurik and Dyre Norse/Slavic or Russian/Slavic with Norse looks? This could make situation a bit more historical and balanced in the east.
[TOG] Nerfing Norse - petition
- Thread starter CzokletMuss
- Start date
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This is anecdotal as hell, but I've run a few handsoff games from 867 to 1453 and in every one so is the Norse faith more or less extinct at the end of the game. They are very strong in the early game, but they fall off hard later on which seems to be the intended balance.
Happens with my games too, unless I'm playing Norse and reform it soon, the Norse faith gets crushed.
And historical too. Honestly Norse should be basically extinct by 1100s.
But the real question is: do they go extinct because they converted to Christianity/Islam, or because they got holy warred to death?
Leave the Norse alone. The Norse are very powerful at the beginning of the game, that is true, but give them a few generations and it all starts to fall apart. That's pretty historical.
The game has only been out for two days, give it at least a month before trying to rebalance everything.
The game has only been out for two days, give it at least a month before trying to rebalance everything.
I'm not saying anything against the Norse specifically (I don't have Old Gods) but some anti-blobbing measures need to happen.
I agree that it needs some nerfing. The game world looks almost looks the same in my game, and I've actually just started playing (10/15 years?). AI is spamming CB's like madmen (due to the Become King ambition), which means I - playing a Norse petty king - have to do so as well.
Rus and Norse powers are OP, and you can keep the empire going because of the Viking trait which just gives +20 I believe.
Also, I haven't seen the AI use concubines, which gives the player some advantage.
Rus and Norse powers are OP, and you can keep the empire going because of the Viking trait which just gives +20 I believe.
Also, I haven't seen the AI use concubines, which gives the player some advantage.
I agree the Norse should be nerfed (both religion/culture), their empires do crumble after a few generations, but the remaining states are all Norse/Norse which is not good. Some huge bonus should be given to pagan rulers who convert to their counties religion/culture or something. Didn't the Norse assimilate into the cultures of every place they conquered outside Scandinavia?
I'm sure the next patch will fix a ton of stuff like they always do anyway.
Also I was amused to see Amalfi take over Tunisia and convert it in a few years from start just like any other Italian republic before it, it's like it were scripted to happen.
I'm sure the next patch will fix a ton of stuff like they always do anyway.
Also I was amused to see Amalfi take over Tunisia and convert it in a few years from start just like any other Italian republic before it, it's like it were scripted to happen.
Still - where is Romuva? Wiped out by coastal Norse CB, rebelled and than eaten by Slavs I suppose. This is just wrong. Maybe not everybody knows that but:
And here they are exterminated in few decades. Although I have to admit that Romuva's position in 1066 start has improved a lot. That's what I saw last time when I was playing in 1066:
Pagan kingdom of Lithuania (AI), pagan kingdom of Pomerania (mine) and the last viking raiding the last free Slavs.
Something like this should be in a 867 start too, not massive Norse CB spam and blobing to the East. Maybe Rurik shouldn't be Norse? Or maybe he should get event in 10-20 years to the game which will force him to convert to Orthodox/Slav?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianization_of_Lithuania
And here they are exterminated in few decades. Although I have to admit that Romuva's position in 1066 start has improved a lot. That's what I saw last time when I was playing in 1066:
Pagan kingdom of Lithuania (AI), pagan kingdom of Pomerania (mine) and the last viking raiding the last free Slavs.
Something like this should be in a 867 start too, not massive Norse CB spam and blobing to the East. Maybe Rurik shouldn't be Norse? Or maybe he should get event in 10-20 years to the game which will force him to convert to Orthodox/Slav?
Exactly. Who cares they fall apart if in the process they kill Romuva and Suomenusko?
Don't forget that they always have the gavel succession law. Meaning their so called blobs can be turned into dust in a matter of minutes.
The Norse never touched anything other than Pommerania and bits of Finland.
At least Poland seems to be getting invaded and taken over on the regular now. That seems to very historical to me.
Wow.. This comment gave me cancer..
So they will be reconquered by other Norse rulers or holy warred by Catholics. It still won't bring Romuva back.
Czoklet, as soon as you hit play the game diverts from history. I don't know about you, but I sure as hell don't won't it to be impossible to attack Romuva heathens just because you think they should stay alive the entire game.
/signed, especially the parts about limiting Pagan CBs to your own religion. I don't have a problem with Sweden or Denmark uniting within the first 2 years, but there needs to be a way to keep them contained. They should focus on raiding, not conquest.
I know but they rarely can make it into 900 year! Probably without Norse conquests they will survive longer. They still are surrounded by hostile Slavs, so they have a really tough start. If you do not believe me, try play as a coastal Baltic ruler other than Catholic and Norse. I'm curious what the results will be.
In my game as Poland they almost created Lithuania but guess what - Sweden subjogation CB. 8000 Norse warriors ready to fight for some tribes lost in dark forest. Duchy of Lithuania had no chance.
So you want to nerf the Norse because one pagan religion is too weak to fight everyone else? How does that make sense? It's not just the Norse wiping them out.
Signed.
I don't like petitions in general, and I don't agree with all of the OP's suggestions, and I think any balance tweaks the devs do will probably cause even more issues (like how Muslim nerfing caused them to be extremely weak in the face of HRE/France/ERE onslaughts). HOWEVER, this doesn't mean this should not be addressed. Subjugation particularly as the Norse is way too easy and you can form a super-empire before 900 in less than half a lifetime. Raiding, while fun, gives you way too much free gold early on where you can buy gazillions of mercs even as a OPM that you can use to subjugate more people.
I don't like petitions in general, and I don't agree with all of the OP's suggestions, and I think any balance tweaks the devs do will probably cause even more issues (like how Muslim nerfing caused them to be extremely weak in the face of HRE/France/ERE onslaughts). HOWEVER, this doesn't mean this should not be addressed. Subjugation particularly as the Norse is way too easy and you can form a super-empire before 900 in less than half a lifetime. Raiding, while fun, gives you way too much free gold early on where you can buy gazillions of mercs even as a OPM that you can use to subjugate more people.
It has been my experience thus far that the Norse don't actually do much of anything without player intervention. What successes I've seen them have don't last long at all.
And thus far the defensive pagans seem to be doing just fine. That attrition loss and garrison(sp?) bonus they get is really good.
And thus far the defensive pagans seem to be doing just fine. That attrition loss and garrison(sp?) bonus they get is really good.