To all players from Warsaw!

[Orthank]

So I guess we should try to play each Saturday with a minimum of 4 people otherwise there would be no games this month...

F

With YOU .

Welcome Sigi,
as you can see it's hard to find one day even in september(but we try), so ofcourse if there will be game fixed for October i'll give you a message.

 

[unmerged(12303)]

With YOU .

Welcome Sigi,
as you can see it's hard to find one day even in september(but we try), so ofcourse if there will be game fixed for October i'll give you a message.

yes well you can play without me of course - just a minimum of 4 players I would say would be needed.... As I said I can play this Saturday - so we need three others

F

 

[Orthank]

yes well you can play without me of course - just a minimum of 4 players I would say would be needed.... As I said I can play this Saturday - so we need three others

F

I can play this saturday as well. Two more needed.

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Overall the Germans have a slight upper hand in the East by July 41 - but the Russians are not defeated, as the Germans are low on manpower, units, and new Russian tanks and air force on the way. In the West, UK has retaken Spain and most of France, and a stalemate is achieved with the UK slowly taking the upper hand (new tanks on the way too).

Some comments:

1) paratroops are an exploit - a side that has air superiority can decimate a wide front with them. Paratroops are very powerful since 1.06, when front troops travel times were increased. The Germans used paratroops to take loads of provinces, break encirclements etc. I think this is a bit too much, and is not reflective of history and their use should be restricted to once a couple of months or so. (Maybe editing transport org is a good idea).

Apart from general overview of situation which i think is Soviet Union near collapsing (well, i'm two or three provinces from Magnitogorsk and SU is about to lose 100 IC

I want to say that i used paras mainly to take undefended provinces at the frontline, and used it once to finish an encirclement (Saratov paradrop, and Saratov shouldn't be left empty in such situation, when almost all Soviet armor was trapped afterwards), and never to recover from encirclement-Vitebsk one was relieved by land battle in Kaluga (motorized forces).

 

[unmerged(2833)]

I believe that Starfire addresses the dogpiling issue with planes as well - so bombers would not be bombing smaller infantry units to hell as it is now. I

We can always mod Starfire to achieve the desired effect, if some things don't work out.

Unfortunately Starfire, last time i checked it out, only eliminated dogpiling on land, not sea or air. Also, i think its not compatible with latest patches...

 

[unmerged(2833)]

But that the way it is airborne division can secure large territory very quick. You just drop some batalions here some there and if there is no resistance territory is secured.

Question is why there is no resistance?

Well, because when enemy has Air Supremacy (as it was the case on eastern front, I-15 vs Focke Wulfs ), its hard not to get killed by Ju-88 when you have only one unit.

12 would be better, but it would mean severe reduction on number of tanks produced. Still, you can have 12 vanilla inf for the price of 1 brigaded tank.

 

[boromir]

Apart from general overview of situation which i think is Soviet Union near collapsing (well, i'm two or three provinces from Magnitogorsk and SU is about to lose 100 IC

I want to say that i used paras mainly to take undefended provinces at the frontline, and used it once to finish an encirclement (Saratov paradrop, and Saratov shouldn't be left empty in such situation, when almost all Soviet armor was trapped afterwards), and never to recover from encirclement-Vitebsk one was relieved by land battle in Kaluga (motorized forces).

Hmm, I don't think SU was near collapsing. I still had more IC than you put in the production, and had much more effective use of IC than you did (thanks to UK supplies), and an army larger than yours. When would I have lost 100 IC more? A couple of months? Never? Sure, you had the upper hand, but I still had enough to hold on. Magnitogorsk would have been difficult to take, not to mention your logistics distance penalties, zero manpower etc. And even if you did, what then? Your Western Front was close to collapsing, OTOH Still, we will never know ...

And yes, I made a few mistakes - and I'll gladly repair them as the USSR next game - but so did you - if you wanted to attack early you should have prepared for it much better, I would have been dead in 6 months.

You used paras to break an encirclement at least once, that I remember.

 

[boromir]

Unfortunately Starfire, last time i checked it out, only eliminated dogpiling on land, not sea or air. Also, i think its not compatible with latest patches...

On air as well. Dunno about sea. Anyway, afaik it is compatible, at least Mithel thinks so, and there have been a few versions out recently. Still, its a mtter of testing.

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Depends on the scenario. Quite possible in 1939 scenario, especially with Japan in the game. Germans start with an excellent air force, the Brits have too little, the Soviets have pre-war junk and are way behind in air techs. Together they can carve up the Soviets with air superiority and paratroops, not much the Soviets can do about it in 1939.

Had i attacked you 7 months later you would probably have 30 basic fighters and not those bi-planes.

Germany starts with 10 basic fighters, btw. Or 8 basic and 2 pre-war.

In our game, Brits had two times more fighters-25! With the fact i had to keep 6 in the east, it was 4:1 odds on western front, and only the fact Brits didn't invest in bombers enough i did not have much trouble with British airpower. Contrary to Germany, which had more bombers (24) than fighers (12)

 

[unmerged(2833)]

By the way, when we play next time?

I suggest, 1936, vanilla-i think Starfire is not upgraded and still has air dogpiling:

Germany-Orthank
Japan-Maur
USSR-Boromir
UK-Fiendix
USA-Halibutt (So he can now play something with more than 100 IC )

By the way, i'm free.

 

[boromir]

Had i attacked you 7 months later you would probably have 30 basic fighters and not those bi-planes.

Germany starts with 10 basic fighters, btw. Or 8 basic and 2 pre-war.

In our game, Brits had two times more fighters-25! With the fact i had to keep 6 in the east, it was 4:1 odds on western front, and only the fact Brits didn't invest in bombers enough i did not have much trouble with British airpower. Contrary to Germany, which had more bombers (24) than fighers (12)

So the Brits produced more, the OOB however is in favour of the Germans ... you started Barbarossa not preparing for it. If you had focused production/reduced on an early Barbarossa you would have won the game.

 

[unmerged(12303)]

Unfortunately Starfire, last time i checked it out, only eliminated dogpiling on land, not sea or air. Also, i think its not compatible with latest patches...

Mithel says it should work.

Dogpile on air is also eliminated due to the high defence values of units.

F

 

[unmerged(12303)]

By the way, when we play next time?

I suggest, 1936, vanilla-i think Starfire is not upgraded and still has air dogpiling:

Germany-Orthank
Japan-Maur
USSR-Boromir
UK-Fiendix
USA-Halibutt (So he can now play something with more than 100 IC )

If you can play this saturday we would only need one more player. I think Maschadow was free - maybe Halibutt.

If we have 4 players then we should have a go with the 39 scenario IMO. I can play italy if needed.

F

 

[unmerged(12303)]

So the Brits produced more, the OOB however is in favour of the Germans ... you started Barbarossa not preparing for it. If you had focused production/reduced on an early Barbarossa you would have won the game.

Its a moot discussion of what IF - true the germans were beating up the russians - but in 2 months the russians would have had around 40 more divisions whilst the germans did not have anything new for a longer time. IMO it could go both ways...

F

 

[boromir]

By the way, when we play next time?

I suggest, 1936, vanilla-i think Starfire is not upgraded and still has air dogpiling:

Germany-Orthank
Japan-Maur
USSR-Boromir
UK-Fiendix
USA-Halibutt (So he can now play something with more than 100 IC )

By the way, i'm free.

I am out of 1936 vanilla HOI games.

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Hmm, I don't think SU was near collapsing. I still had more IC than you put in the production, and had much more effective use of IC than you did (thanks to UK supplies), and an army larger than yours. When would I have lost 100 IC more? A couple of months? Never? Sure, you had the upper hand, but I still had enough to hold on. Magnitogorsk would have been difficult to take, not to mention your logistics distance penalties, zero manpower etc. And even if you did, what then? Your Western Front was close to collapsing, OTOH Still, we will never know ...

And yes, I made a few mistakes - and I'll gladly repair them as the USSR next game - but so did you - if you wanted to attack early you should have prepared for it much better, I would have been dead in 6 months.

You used paras to break an encirclement at least once, that I remember.

100 IC-Caucasus, Stalingrad, Magnitogorsk and few strategic bombardment raids. All in a month-two. I had plenty of manpower in production queue-about 500 i think. After that, i would either switch to western front for a battle with Fiendix, or try to take Moscov with concentrated assault of 72 divisions. (or, surround it since it was only one province from this).

Ah, and after you would lose all that divisions in encirclements, you wouldn't have much of offensive capability so i could leave few bobmers in the east and redeploy most of my army to the west.

 

[unmerged(12303)]

I am out of 1936 vanilla HOI games.

I would suggest we have a go with starfire for our next 6 player game - if we dont like it we can mod some of the files or go back to vanilla 1.06c and mod that a little.

No need to make up our minds up now.

F

 

[boromir]

100 IC-Caucasus, Stalingrad, Magnitogorsk and few strategic bombardment raids. All in a month-two. I had plenty of manpower in production queue-about 500 i think. After that, i would either switch to western front for a battle with Fiendix, or try to take Moscov with concentrated assault of 72 divisions.

Sorry, you couldn't take Stalingrad with 4 divisions in it (yes, that's all that had org) Moscow and Leningrad were beyond your reach imho ... 100 IC, not that great a loss - even if I lost all my IC, I would still have more armies than you - no chance for an easy victory.

*sigh* this is why we should finish games, instead of just talking about them.

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Sorry, you couldn't take Stalingrad with 4 divisions in it (yes, that's all that had org) Moscow and Leningrad were beyond your reach imho ... 100 IC, not that great a loss - even if I lost all my IC, I would still have more armies than you - no chance for an easy victory.

*sigh* this is why we should finish games, instead of just talking about them.

Yeah, one of us is obviously out of contact with reality now

Well, most of them were Romanian, and there is no chance of Stalingrad beign relieved, anyway...

Actually, you're down to 110 infantry divisions, and i have 90. And few of SU divisions are already encircled...

Yeah, apparently we should finish a game finally

 

[boromir]

I would suggest we have a go with starfire for our next 6 player game - if we dont like it we can mod some of the files or go back to vanilla 1.06c and mod that a little.

No need to make up our minds up now.

F

The thing I dislike the most is the hyperteching. It should not be so bad in Starfire, because there is less IC in the game in general, and tech times are
increased for some trees. For vanilla HOI, it may be reasonable to increase gold tech times by 30% (not doctrines though) - but then again, it will
impact those with less IC at the start (Jap, Ita, USSR).

Other stuff that bugs me:
* dogpiling
* nightflyers
* nightfighting
* minors being gobbled up (Hungary, Switzerland ?!?)
* Italy reduced to a minor
* UK is way overpowered
* Germany unable to threaten the UK with subs (possible in Starfire I believe)
* Overpowered paras