Tips for being a warmonger?

[Garek Maxwell]

I'm sad to say this, but I have a nasty habit of sitting back and concentrating a bit too much on my own people rather than going out and bringing the magic of civilized living to those poor folks across the world living in absolute squalor. Now that's not to say that there's something wrong with concentrating on your own nation and how well it's doing. ...It's just a tad boring after the 20th time and it limits my nation's power all too often.

So are there any tips out there for war mongering? I do have some specific questions though...

- Conquering uncivilized nations. Is Africa better than Asia?

- How DO you support a huge army capable of taking large swaths of land? Or is that built up very gradually with every conquered nation?

- Technology. Are cultural techs that important when you're slowly becoming militarily more powerful than Britain?

I think that's it mostly... But any tips would be appreciated!
Oh, and if it makes a major difference then this is going with Victoria Revolutions. Off and on with VIP, but usually with VIP. The nations I play vary too much though, so I can't be specific there. o

 

[shasla6]

Is Africa better than Asia?

It's certainly easier. You don't know quagmire before you've attempted to conquer China. It gives me mild anxiety attacks. And of course Africa is more up for grabs overall.

How DO you support a huge army capable of taking large swaths of land? Or is that built up very gradually with every conquered nation?

Economy. But that of course is an entirely separate thing.

Technology. Are cultural techs that important when you're slowly becoming militarily more powerful than Britain?

Naturally that depends on your aims, but you'll want certain essentials such as ideological thought in all likelyhood. If you're playing vanilla, you can get plenty of prestige through colonization, and the cultural inventions are unreliable anyway. Prestige isn't really a must anyway.

 

[Garek Maxwell]

Economy. But that of course is an entirely separate thing.

I figured that was a pretty broad question. I thought it couldn't hurt to ask anyway though. o

Thank you! I appreciate the information and opinions on the subject.

 

[unmerged(63310)]

- Conquering uncivilized nations. Is Africa better than Asia?

- How DO you support a huge army capable of taking large swaths of land? Or is that built up very gradually with every conquered nation?

- Technology. Are cultural techs that important when you're slowly becoming militarily more powerful than Britain?

Africa or Asia... depends on what you want really. Asia is quite populous and has some good resources plus you don't share borders with lots of major powers who might DoW you. Africa is more sparsely populated so you can often turn many area's there into states and start building factories. You have to be prepared to defend your lands as I've never gotten thru a game with heavy colonization in Africa without at least one war vs a major power, more often several wars until their borders no longer touch mine.

A huge army requires first of all a huge population base before you even think about funding it. Some smaller nations it's simply impossible for a long time as you need either massive immigration over years or to annex lands and in Revolutions manipulate your politics to get certain parties into power. Once you have the population base you can then go about funding the military which is actually the easiest part once your economy is somewhat advanced.

It takes awhile to become militarily more powerful than UK unless you started as a major power so culture techs can greatly help you there. If you research some culture techs early you can get a lead which helps inventions fire quicker and also gives you better chances of more culture techs firing earlier which will raise your prestige and give you more diplomatic points to spend plus earlier access to certain key goods which can sometimes still be important even in Rev where you don't always feel in desperate need of machine parts.

 

[unmerged(61634)]

The way to fund that giant military you want is to use colonials, because they are much cheaper. Basically, just conquer an unciv, and then place a large order for infantry of that nationality (even if the colony only has a tiny soldier pop, your order can be as large as you want).

VIP seems to have changed this, however. I tried to raise a very large artillery-infantry army from my African holdings, and my budget went through the roof.

 

[RELee]

I prefer Asia, specifically SE Asia and the Pacific islands. Lots of population and RGOs to choose from.

Just remember that I'm playing VIP:R almost exclusively these days, so your mileage may vary a lot if you are playing without VIP.

 

[Corbett]

- Conquering uncivilized nations. Is Africa better than Asia?

I would have to answer an unequivocal 'no' to this question. Africa is certainly easier than Asia, but eminently less rewarding; the African countries are, on average, far smaller and far less powerful than their Asian counterparts.

Asian RGOs are better, chock full of rare goods like silk, dye, tropical wood, and rubber, and they have a population that is *far* larger than in Africa. Taking a single province off of China can be extremely profitable, and India is absolutely full of high-value provinces with great populations. African RGOs tend to have rather low value, at least in VIP. This is further compounded by the fact that the population is, almost without exception, small and non-national.

Certainly it is far easier to get African colonies to become states. However, this does not have a very large advantage unless you attract a lot of migrants that didn't come from your country, because you could have used the people now living in another country in your own country. Of course, it's a little less efficient, so keep that in mind. Asian colonies are virtually impossible to turn into states if they aren't that way already, and this can be a benefit because non-national cultures in colonial provinces tend to be very easy to please and cheap to support.

- How DO you support a huge army capable of taking large swaths of land? Or is that built up very gradually with every conquered nation?

Slowly and patiently. Remember that you get a bigger advantage against uncivs the longer the game progresses. Bigger economies mean bigger armies, and a corps from the early 20th century will have massive advantages in firepower, defence, mobility, and gas compared to irregulars.

- Technology. Are cultural techs that important when you're slowly becoming militarily more powerful than Britain?

I don't really know about culture techs. I find that they usually help keep people in line and don't really have any negatives toward researching, except towards the end game. But they don't have the same sort of benefits you might see from other techs.

 

[RELee]

Good post Corbett. And I certainly agree with slowly and patiently on the conquests. Never annex today what you can bite off in smaller chunks tomorrow. With each stage of warfare against an unciv, they convert more pops to soldiers which slowly add to your own country's manpower with each acquisition of land, so that you have plenty of manpower to fund a major war should you find yourself in one. While I never totally eliminate having national pops as soldiers, I find I can reduce them to a minimum when I play this way.

Using Siam as an example, I may take 3 or 4 wars before I completely annex them. If you take Siam, be careful how you play. Too much badboy and you may have the UK breathing down your neck before you are ready for them. So make sure you are ready for them, or don't let your badboy rise to highly.

 

[Corbett]

Good post Corbett. And I certainly agree with slowly and patiently on the conquests. Never annex today what you can bite off in smaller chunks tomorrow. With each stage of warfare against an unciv, they convert more pops to soldiers which slowly add to your own country's manpower with each acquisition of land, so that you have plenty of manpower to fund a major war should you find yourself in one. While I never totally eliminate having national pops as soldiers, I find I can reduce them to a minimum when I play this way.

Using Siam as an example, I may take 3 or 4 wars before I completely annex them. If you take Siam, be careful how you play. Too much badboy and you may have the UK breathing down your neck before you are ready for them. So make sure you are ready for them, or don't let your badboy rise to highly.

Absolutely, and there's a secondary advantage to high soldier concentrations in that native units require but a tenth the maintenance as their national counterparts. Certainly this comes with penalties in terms of organization and reliability, but that's easily overcome with technology, leadership, and sheer numbers. It is also not a factor in the slightest for garrison troops, for whom low cost is an absolute advantage. And it's much better to take some crummy non-national POPs out of a lousy Indochine RGO than a citizen POP from profitable enterprises like efficient factories or productive coal mines back at Home...

However, in defence of African colonization, in non-VIP games there is a good deal of prestige gathering involved. If you have trouble with prestige (for example, because you did not make cultural resource a priority) then Africa is a good place to pick it up in ways that Asia is not. Plus, the Belgian Congo and Katanga aren't that bad in terms of RGOs or population, so if you had to grab a piece of Africa, that'd be a good one to grab. German East Africa isn't that bad of a grab, either, if you want to avoid fighting Asian countries or don't think your armies are up to snuff yet. But please don't take anything from me on the finer points of African colonization, because my general rule for that is: "It was historically a part of x country I'm playing, so I'm aiming for it." This results in many acquisitions of Namibia, which is damned near useless.

I guess a good starter country to fight against would be a long, protracted war against Cambodia so that they have time to recruit a lot of soldier POPs, which would not be missed from the fields as their fields are really nothing to write home about.

 

[RELee]

Plus, I forgot to mention that after I use my national soldiers to get a toehold in Asia, I start using divisions made from native pops to continue my expansion. I then, typically but not necessarily, ship my national divisions back to the homeland, or I keep one stack of three divisions to act as a "reserve" corps for those difficult provinces.

 

[unmerged(77251)]

- Conquering uncivilized nations. Is Africa better than Asia?

Asian rapidly become an un-ending micromanagement hell. Especially india and china. Could bring you loads of money, but also hours of rgo's expanding. Alsom if u're playing Ricky and relay on laissez_faire, the chinese Aristocrats pops will kill your capis income. I would say: basically, unicivs are just good for BB points lowering when you release them. For real warmongering, start with europe minors like belgium, prussia and italy before unifications for industry. Plus American East coast. After that, you should have enough money to fund a HUGE army.

- How DO you support a huge army capable of taking large swaths of land? Or is that built up very gradually with every conquered nation?

Fastest way is going presidential dictatorship with a 'planned_economy' policy. Concentrated on steel/steamer factories, and luxury furnitures/clothes (they quickly make loads of money) + a decent weapon industry (canned food, small arms and some artillery)

- Technology. Are cultural techs that important when you're slowly becoming militarily more powerful than Britain?

All a matter of timing. If you go for WC, prestige wont be a prob, since each peace treaty will grow your point capital. I would say: first economy techs, to boost your income, and than, just befor the endless war starts, you trade most of them for military techs. After that, check out the military tech statistic to keep ahead of potential enemies.

 

[OHgamer]

VIP seems to have changed this, however. I tried to raise a very large artillery-infantry army from my African holdings, and my budget went through the roof.

Artillery and other brigaded unit costs were dramatically raised upwards in VIP:R 0.1 compared to Victoria:Revolutions, and may be further revised upwards in later versions.

 

[Enzo]

Artillery and other brigaded unit costs were dramatically raised upwards in VIP:R 0.1 compared to Victoria:Revolutions, and may be further revised upwards in later versions.

I think it's already very expensive, please boss don't raise it

 

[unmerged(86954)]

I think it's already very expensive, please boss don't raise it

I'd rather see their power reduced. The cumulative firepower and shock bonuses from the techs are insane + the combat bonus modifier AND the ability to dissolve forts...crazy. :wacko:

 

[Searry]

I'd rather see their power reduced. The cumulative firepower and shock bonuses from the techs are insane + the combat bonus modifier AND the ability to dissolve forts...crazy. :wacko:

It's just being realistic...
And yes, the cost is quite huge, but it's good.

 

[Enzo]

as it supposed to be I guess for the Queen of the Battlefield that artillery was in this time frame.

 

[Garek Maxwell]

Wow! This is a lot of great information! I didn't expect so many replies.

First off, I want to thank Ichon, Corbett, RELee, and qwerkus for all the incredible info. I already put to test a few of those tips and things were going great! (I admit, I got greedy and didn't pay attention to my badboy. Next time I'll pay closer attention, since France, Russia, and Britain were giving me a major beating. o )

Needless to say, I'm having a much more enjoyable time than just sitting around with little to do. Thanks again ya'll! This was much appreciated!

 

[Kagernaut]

One final thing from me: Watch. Your. Badboy.

This may have been mentioned, but I don't have the time to check.

YOu can reduce badboy from uncivs by not annexing them all at once, instead taking all their land in peace deals and then a second war to annex. Its fair enough, if you ask me.

Places to colonize, well, east africa is the only part of africa worth colonizing (save british south africa and the immediate provinces northeast of it, and Morocco) and namibia. The rest of africa except Massaua are largely useless by comparison, but you can take high population areas like Ethiopia and convert them all into craftsmen are use their soldiers.

Malay peninsula, is a great one; if you can get immigration there, the game is in the bag practically; if you can have it as a state and assimilate all the immigrants, then you're definately in good shape.
If you have a full citizenship party, and take some Chinese provinces and force the chinese out of their RGOs by splitting pops (if full citizenship you can also change the larger pops into the opposite of worker that provinces has whehter farmer or laborer, and then just use small pops to work the RGO, this will lower revolt risk as opposed to any other method), and watch as they migrate, you can either get hordes of inefficient laborers to your good provinces, or if you can convince them to move to a state you'll get a huge boost in national pops because of assimilation; some of them won't assimilate, but most will.

Utilizing the Chinese is sometimes key to success in many of my games, particularly my current game working as Japan where I'm forcing the Koreans and Chinese to migrate to Japan, and become Japanese. Total assimilation, yeah thats real nice ....

EDIT: Anywhere with Rubber, Precious Metal (which pops up as the game progresses, so some areas won't have it till they are controlled by a nation; Iron, or Oil is worth colonizing for sure. Egypt provinces near Massaua are heavy in population and are rubber provinces, so late game they become very useful.

 

[unmerged(63310)]

Certainly it is far easier to get African colonies to become states. However, this does not have a very large advantage unless you attract a lot of migrants that didn't come from your country, because you could have used the people now living in another country in your own country. Of course, it's a little less efficient, so keep that in mind. Asian colonies are virtually impossible to turn into states if they aren't that way already, and this can be a benefit because non-national cultures in colonial provinces tend to be very easy to please and cheap to support.

The advantage of turning Africa into states is that it has a much higher immigration attraction than Europe and often you can get majority national culture POPs in many states there, not just the minimum one province in a state to make it a state. Once you have majority nationals there, most immigrants will assimilate into your nationals and your national population can skyrocket and thus your industrial score also. Not to mention that some of the gold mines and other RGO in Africa attract immigrants nearly at rate USA does and you can split incoming immigrants and assign the right sizes to continually expanding factories while the RGO continues to draw more. I've a couple games made half of Africa majority Spanish culture and my spanish national population was about 120 million + the rest of colonial and annexed lands population. No possible way to get that much national population had I remained all my states within Europe.