Three Moves Ahead Podcast - 3 Games Journalists at the HOI4 Event Discuss their impressions

[Zoob]

Not only a great opportunity to shout about the Three Moves Ahead podcast which in the past have had shows dedicated to all the Paradox games, including a one on one interview with Besuchov about EU4. But also a chance to hear more about the Hearts of Iron 4 press event.

https://www.idlethumbs.net/3ma/episodes/hearts-of-iron-iv-preview

Paradox returns to World War II with the upcoming Hearts of Iron IV and a recent press event found Rob, Rowan, Fraser, and Gamers with Jobs' Sean Sands playing a preview build of the simulation. The results? Mixed feelings. Amidst glimmers of hope for an improved HoI on the order of the successful EUIV and CK2, the panelists found a confusing interface, a lack of direction, and plenty of room for improvement before the final build.

 

[Centurion1973]

repost:
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...essions-from-the-hoi4pressevent.860230/page-9

 

[PanzerwerferII]

i really think this deserves its own post though. It's very different from all the other links posted in the original thread since it doesnt just touch the surface like all the other previews that are targeted at people who have never heard of the game.

This is actual in-depth discussion from people who know what they are talking about and will get lost on page nine of that thread behemoth imo.

 

[Zoob]

After I had posted this thread I saw that you had got there first and posted this in the big thread.

Great to see another Three Moves ahead follower out there!

I think it's also good to bring to everyone's attention this great podcast anyway, as it's all about strategy and wargames, so as it's own thing I think it also warrants it's own thread.

 

[Uppslitaren]

I'm 45 minutes in and boy are they cutting down HOI 4 by the ankles. I think I heard 1 positive comment in the whole 45 minutes. The rest have been saying how bad everything is with the game. They are basically flushing HOI4 down the toilet.
That is very disappointing.

 

[fabius]

I'm 45 minutes in and boy are they cutting down HOI 4 by the ankles. I think I heard 1 positive comment in the whole 45 minutes. The rest have been saying how bad everything is with the game. They are basically flushing HOI4 down the toilet.
That is very disappointing.

1 hour 07... there's more criticism to come.

Worst- is they found some of the oddities hilarious; lack of purpose; long periods of nothing to do; poor interphase.

 

[Zoob]

I haven't listened to it yet, as I'm at work. But these guys are generally big big fans of Paradox's work. As the Three Moves Ahead founder and now regular panellist now works for Paradox, I imagine they'll be paying a lot of attention to any criticisms.

 

[grandad1982]

Several mentions of the switch from Goals to Focus (or visa versa?) as a negative due to the removal of the player actually having to do something to gain the reward and it being more like spending MP from EU4.

 

[Uppslitaren]

I haven't listened to it yet, as I'm at work. But these guys are generally big big fans of Paradox's work. As the Three Moves Ahead founder and now regular panellist now works for Paradox, I imagine they'll be paying a lot of attention to any criticisms.

If it is as bad as these guys are saying and Paradox actually listen to them I can't imagine this game will be released before spring 2016.

 

[adam_grif]

A lot of their complaints were caused by Multiplayer environment, such as the world tension going off the rails due to players being really silly and the game sucking if you get rolled early on but still have to keep playing coz theres 20 other people playing too. Those kind of things won't happen in single player, and are much less likely in "smaller" MP games. The players were also not that familiar with HoI, except one who played but wasn't that hardcore into it. So problems like it being too focused on a single make-or-break war and there being no room to really recover and strike back 50 years later like in other Paradox games are, IMO, not "really" problems since that's just the design of this series.

However they did also raise a lot of criticisms I felt were fair. And there were a LOT of criticisms. This podcast has single handedly convinced me that a delay was 100% necessary, and a substantial one at that. I'm feeling a lot better now that I kind of know why the game isn't coming out in 2 months time. Don't get me wrong, I'm still upset that it got delayed, and I think it does kind of represent a project management failure on at least some level (12 months of delays is a pretty severe setback), but I do appreciate that considering the current form of the game it was the right call. I just wish we could see the footage for ourselves now

 

[Hans_Schnitzel]

If it is as bad as these guys are saying and Paradox actually listen to them I can't imagine this game will be released before spring 2016.

Yeah, it won't. But that the game will not be released this year has been confirmed already.

 

[henzington]

A lot of their complaints were caused by Multiplayer environment, such as the world tension going off the rails due to players being really silly and the game sucking if you get rolled early on but still have to keep playing coz theres 20 other people playing too. Those kind of things won't happen in single player, and are much less likely in "smaller" MP games. The players were also not that familiar with HoI, except one who played but wasn't that hardcore into it. So problems like it being too focused on a single make-or-break war and there being no room to really recover and strike back 50 years later like in other Paradox games are, IMO, not "really" problems since that's just the design of this series.

However they did also raise a lot of criticisms I felt were fair. And there were a LOT of criticisms. This podcast has single handedly convinced me that a delay was 100% necessary, and a substantial one at that. I'm feeling a lot better now that I kind of know why the game isn't coming out in 2 months time. Don't get me wrong, I'm still upset that it got delayed, and I think it does kind of represent a project management failure on at least some level (12 months of delays is a pretty severe setback), but I do appreciate that considering the current form of the game it was the right call. I just wish we could see the footage for ourselves now

I have to agree EU4 also falls apart even with a small number of players if you group up versus the ai just watch the first arumba multiplayer

 

[Felrisen]

This begs the question of why have a HUGE multi-player game as a press event in the first place if the game is in this shape? Could it not have waited until later? Poor judgement on the part of the developers it seems to me.

 

[Zoob]

They did the same with Europa Universalis 4 and also with March of the Eagles. They seem to be fun events for those involved and of course, these criticisms would be worse if it was release day, as it is, it's valuable feedback from industry commentators.

Having Listened to the podcast, other than the concerns people have already raised, the thing I liked most was the, obviously jokingly said, comment that Paradox have enough money from Cities Skylines that financially it has taken the pressure off HOI4 somewhat, that they can leave the game in the oven until it's totally done and don't need to rush it in anyway.

Paradox aren't fools, they know how to make a great strategy game, and I want HOI4 when it is that game.

 

[Paglia]

I just finished listening to it (full length).
Well, some comments are pretty harsh.
Some stem from the fact some of those people ain’t playing wargames on a regular basis. So we can discard them.
While other are more relevant: aircraft interface, lack of purpose to play Minors and balance problems (the last 2 being important issues; the 2nd is a weakness of HoI3 that almost all MODs are trying to correct.... while the 3rd is the main reason why HoI3 was such a poor release at the time, beyond the instability, altough it became quite better overe time and expansions). I like HoI3 a lot to be honest, despite its weaknesses.

Bottom line, unless PI chooses to release a rough gem, this game won’t be here anytime soon. So Fall 2015 laready seems a bit optimistic. Lets prepare ourself for Spring 2016. Which would not be that bad either if the game could, with such a delay, be the gem everyone hope for.

 

[Gamer_1745]

I haven't listened to it yet, as I'm at work. But these guys are generally big big fans of Paradox's work. As the Three Moves Ahead founder and now regular panellist now works for Paradox, I imagine they'll be paying a lot of attention to any criticisms.

I sure hope they are as this sounds just like the target audience for HOI IV. And beyond any of the problems they are bringing up HOI IV should either move in the direction of EU in the 20th century or more of a WWII Wargame that EU players can access (UI type issues). Being stuck in the middle might be the kiss of death, not enough like EU or not enough WWII.

 

[Snow Wolf]

This begs the question of why have a HUGE multi-player game as a press event in the first place if the game is in this shape? Could it not have waited until later? Poor judgement on the part of the developers it seems to me.

20x feedback, 20x articles, 20x more ("free") advertising
20x the crucial chance to break the game (few people have this very ability )

Add balancing, sync/connection/internet stuff, game stability (!) and don't forget the shitton of fun.

 

[Cybvep]

Sounds like the game is a bit of a mess right now. TMA guys are not just random noobs and they usually know what they are talking about.

 

[zonkie]

It's Alpha.

 

[The Balbinater]

spent time reading/listening to all the content. agree that "three moves ahead" was only thing worth the time.