This Is Madness 2 - Imperium Sine Fine (Interactive Mega Campaign)

[TurtleShroom]

{{

@CzokletMuss , if this world is so constructed that the Ecumenical Patriarch has the authority to override a bishop's excommunication of someone within their diosce, then by all means, do what you wish. Just remember that siding with a corrupt official who did a Godless act like that has consequences, as you clearly noted. Lifting a just punishment of someone who did an unspeakably un-Christian act that he had no authority to perform would greatly anger the lower bishops and the peasantry.

Even though this world has the Patriarch with unsually high powers, remember that Orthodoxy formed itself on the Original Timeline until the arrival of the Aztecs. Much as nobles pine for the days of old when their powers were more significant, so too does the Church remember when autocephalacy had teeth and the local bishops' decisions were final.

Please do not think that I am trying to tell you how to do your job or trying to make you do something: I'm just talking here, giving unsolicited advice, that's all.

}}

 

[zenphoenix]

Senator Alexios von Hohenzollern (unaffiliated):

Senator Nikephoros II Salamis (Blue Demes):
*As Von Hohenzollern approaches the Blue section, Nikephoros greets him*
Ah, Senator Von Hohenzollern! It is good to see you.
I would like to inquire... Does the fact that you came to the Blue meeting mean you sympathize with us? If so, will you ally yourself with us this session and vote together? To fill you in, it seems that now the general agreement in the demes is, of course, supporting the policy proposed by Speaker Colombo and approved by the Red speaker, and acquiring money for the Aererium by confiscating church lands.

"Senator Salamis,
I found myself agreeing with many of the points your faction supports. However, while confiscating Church lands would give us some immediate profit, I fear that it would make it harder to increase the Imperium's stability and keep up its technological advantages in the next few decades."

Senator Marius Serapis of the White Demes

"Oh, but you can vote, my dear colleague. Just like any other senator. Your lack of a Demes limits you in some ways, but not that much." Marius smiles reassuringly. "Expropriating the church would bring us only chaos, costing us far more in the long term. Expropriating the Jews is a matter of conscience. It is rational, in that its only negative effect is a higher cost for loans, which the expropriations themselves would prevent. But some might find it immoral." He shrugs, "Morality is more complex that though. Mothballing the non-trading fleet should have been done a long time ago. If war comes with Pisa or the Xenoi if can swiftly be put to readyness again. Taxing the exarchates can be done, but only a few times. For now they should realise the immensity of our need and accept. Weaponising the plague... Well that is an intriguing idea. I believe our merchants are already using it as a weapon against friend and foe alike." He winks.

{{Let's assume this conversation is not simultaneous to the one you are having with Parrotguy. I only just came home from work.}}

"Thank you, sir, for clarifying this to me. Yes, seizing the properties of the Church and the Jews would have major consequences for all of us, but the other options are just common sense."

 

[Serpent]

Senator Marius Serapis of the White Demes

Senator Alexios von Hohenzollern (unaffiliated):

"Thank you, sir, for clarifying this to me. Yes, seizing the properties of the Church and the Jews would have major consequences for all of us, but the other options are just common sense."

"I believe we are in agreement, my friend. Now, if you will, I would be very interested in hearing of your House. I understand you are now fully Roman with lands around Thessalonika, but you clearly have some German roots. Do you maintain some connections to the Germanic lands? I understand the Germans brew the most excellent beer, and House Serapis finds itself in need of a reliable trading partner. Syrian beer, no matter our efforts, is sadly inferior."

{{
@CzokletMuss , if this world is so constructed that the Ecumenical Patriarch has the authority to override a bishop's excommunication of someone within their diosce, then by all means, do what you wish. Just remember that siding with a corrupt official who did a Godless act like that has consequences, as you clearly noted. Lifting a just punishment of someone who did an unspeakably un-Christian act that he had no authority to perform would greatly anger the lower bishops and the peasantry.
Even though this world has the Patriarch with unsually high powers, remember that Orthodoxy formed itself on the Original Timeline until the arrival of the Aztecs. Much as nobles pine for the days of old when their powers were more significant, so too does the Church remember when autocephalacy had teeth and the local bishops' decisions were final.
Please do not think that I am trying to tell you how to do your job or trying to make you do something: I'm just talking here, giving unsolicited advice, that's all.
}}

{{Well, the Bishop in question was a Mongol advocating taxing the Church, which pretty much makes him an enemy of the Church. No Priest, Monk, Bishop or faithful peasant would oppose punishing him, especially not those whose lands were just overrun with raping, looting, pillaging and slaving mongols.
Also, your character is a Senator and the President of the Senate clearly has powers to punish him. He should be grateful he did not share the fate of Scipion and Mandromenos. The only reason he didn't was that he is a member of the Church.}}

 

[CzokletMuss]

{{

@CzokletMuss , if this world is so constructed that the Ecumenical Patriarch has the authority to override a bishop's excommunication of someone within their diosce, then by all means, do what you wish. Just remember that siding with a corrupt official who did a Godless act like that has consequences, as you clearly noted. Lifting a just punishment of someone who did an unspeakably un-Christian act that he had no authority to perform would greatly anger the lower bishops and the peasantry.

Even though this world has the Patriarch with unsually high powers, remember that Orthodoxy formed itself on the Original Timeline until the arrival of the Aztecs. Much as nobles pine for the days of old when their powers were more significant, so too does the Church remember when autocephalacy had teeth and the local bishops' decisions were final.

Please do not think that I am trying to tell you how to do your job or trying to make you do something: I'm just talking here, giving unsolicited advice, that's all.

}}

{{ No worries, there will be consequences for House Dalassenos. }}

 

[Attalus]

{{ No worries, there will be consequences for House Dalassenos. }}

{{ I feel like the sudden rise of the Dalassenoi won't do them much good. They gain the Komnenoi as enemies for one, and if the Black Plague has a similar effect than OTL then the nobility will see a lot of its power reduced. I can't wait to see the Angeloi heretics in action too
Basically the aristoi got screwed this Session but I think we will be able to maneuvre in all this to get a better position. }}

 

[CzokletMuss]

{{ Okay, since the voting starts soon: @luciusmalfoy012 what is the the Durability bonus swapped for in the end?

Senator Alexius Colombo (Speaker of the Blue Demes):
I also hereby propose the following Senate Policy in the name of the Blue Demes, for the purposes of "Reducing expenses and increasing revenue of the Imperial Treasury".

{{ +15% Trade Efficiency, -10% Army Maintenance }}"

Senator Alexios Este-Ravenna (Red Demes Speaker):
I will therefore support the policy proposed by (then) speaker Colombo: for the purposes of "Reducing expenses and increasing revenue of the Imperial Treasury".
{{ +15% Trade Efficiency, -10% Army Maintenance }}.}

Please give me the name of the proposed policy if you have come with one - Latin is preferred though "Something Something Act" will be alright too }}

 

[ThetrueColt]

{{ The policy was just called "Reducing expenses and increasing revenue of the Imperial Treasury" after the category it was supposed to fit in

@luciusmalfoy012 You can give it a fancy name if you want to! }}

 

[CzokletMuss]

{{ Yeah but it's just a category - we need a fancy name! }}

 

[Attalus]

{{ Lex Negotiatores Armorum ? (Law for the Merchants of Weapons if my Latin is not too rusted) }}

 

[CzokletMuss]

{{ If neither Red nor Blue Spekear show up before 9:00 PM I'll use the default "Lex Colombo"

Also @ThetrueColt after 9:00 PM I'll post everything as always, so don't worry about that.

BTW is there anyone who reads this AAR and would like to join the Senate? I've been thinking about adding 2-4 more seats. If you do, please let me know here or via PM.}}

 

[Ponce_The_Great]

{{So because this was proposed by Colombo shortly before he was dragged off does this mean we'll likely have a Blue in power? Or is this a Red policy so we can get the Red's bonuses?}}

 

[CzokletMuss]

{{ What counts is who proposed the policy. We shall see what the results of the voting will be - I have to decide before I load the save and start playing the campaign but there's plenty of time. I probably will play the next 10-20 year this weekend though it depends. We'll see }}

 

[CzokletMuss]

SIXTH SENATE SESSION - VOTING

IIllustrious Acting and Interim President of the Imperial Senate Decius Pylaeus hereby announces that

THE DEBATE HAS ENDED
***​

BALLOTS
The noble Senators shall vote using the following ballots:

SENATUS CONSULTUM
(1) Reform of the imperial administration (National Focus)

”Reformatio de Administratio Romanorum” Act

The Imperial Senate, excersicing legislative power it was given by His Imperial Majesty Markos III Angelos and confirmed in Edictum de Senatum Imperialis by His Imperial Majesty Basileios III Angelos, acting on authority of His Imperial Majesty Theodoros I Angelos and with His approval, decided what follows:

1. That in this dire hour the very foundations of the Imperium are threatened due to consequences ofthe Black Death, barbarian invasions and the Soulless.
2. That to preserve the Imperium the Administration has to be immediately reorganized to collect taxes, govern imperial lands and dispense justice in the name of His Imperial Majesty with greater efficiency.
3. That in order to achieve this goal special powers have to be temporarily granted to Megas Logothetes.
3. That therefore all Senators agree that the Reform of the imperial administration (Administrative Focus) is of the utmost importance for the prosperity and stability of the Imperium.

Bill adopted by the Imperial Senate on 1 January 7068 Anno Mundi and submitted to His Imperial Majesty for approval on the same day.

• „House <NAME> votes AYE.”
• „House <NAME> votes NAY.”

RESOLUTIONS
(2) Imperial Navy – mothballing all fleets (budget )

Shall the fleets of the Imperial Navy be mothballed effective immediately in order to ease the burden of the Aerarium?

• „House <NAME> votes AYE.”
• „House <NAME> votes NAY.”

(3) Exarchates – raising tariffs (subjects)

Shall We raise tariffs for Exarchate of Abyssinia and Exarchate Africanus?

• „House <NAME> votes AYE.”
• „House <NAME> votes NAY.”

(4) Expropriation of the Jews (decision)

Shall We punish the Kristos-killers for spreading the Black Plague by expropriating them and banning them from all imperial offices?

• „House <NAME> votes AYE.”
• „House <NAME> votes NAY.”

(5) Enlisting privateers (decision)

Shall We order Megas Droungarios to enlist privateers to raid fleets of Pisans and Westerners with greater efficiency?

• „House <NAME> votes AYE.”
• „House <NAME> votes NAY.”

(6) Seizure of lands of the Holy Church (decision)

Shall We issue a decree by which some of the lands of the Holy Church shall be taken by the Imperial Administraion, thus increasing the revenue of Aerarium?

• „House <NAME> votes AYE.”
• „House <NAME> votes NAY.”

POLICIES (VANILLA)

(7) Provincial taxation system

• „House <NAME> votes FOR the enactment of the policy.”
• „House <NAME> votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.”

(8) Lex foveretur Production Commercia

• „House <NAME> votes FOR the enactment of the policy.”
• „House <NAME> votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.”

(9) The Naval School Act

• „House <NAME> votes FOR the enactment of the policy.”
• „House <NAME> votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.”

(10) Streamlined Galley Production

• „House <NAME> votes FOR the enactment of the policy.”
• „House <NAME> votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.”

SENATE POLICY
Policy proposed by Blue Speaker senator Alexius Colombo and supported by Red Speaker senator Alexios Este-Ravenna.
(11) Lex Colombo (+15% Trade Efficiency, -10% Army Maintenance)

• „House <NAME> votes FOR the enactment of the policy.”
• „House <NAME> votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.”

OBLIGATORY FACTION MEMBERSHIP STATEMENT
Every Senator must include a statement in a post in which he votes using one of the following templates:

• „Senator <name> STAYS IN the <name> Demes.”
• „Senator <name> LEAVES the <name> Demes and JOINS the <name> Demes.”
• „Senator <name> LEAVES the <name> Demes and BECOMES UNAFFILIATED.”
• „Senator <name> REMAINS UNAFFILIATED.”
• „Senator <name> JOINS the <name> Demes.”

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION
GENERAL

• Every Senator has 1 vote.
• You vote only in this thread and only in-character.
• You vote by posting a single post („voting post”) which includes (1) your character's name and Faction, if he is a Faction member (2) your vote in a form of ballots (3) obligatory Faction membership statement.
• Your voting post may also include (4) closing argument no longer than 5 sentences.
• Making other in-character posts during the voting makes your vote invalid.
• In case you are not sure what to do, please PM me.

HOW TO VOTE - TEMPLATE

[size=4][b]Senator Simplus Exemplus (White Demes)[/b][/size]
This is my closing statement: I'm here to show you how to vote. I have nothing more to say. Glory to the Angeloi!

[size=4][b]BALLOTS[/b][/size]
[b](1) Reform of the imperial administration (National Focus)[/b]
House Exemplus votes AYE.
[b](2) Imperial Navy – mothballing all fleets (budget )[/b]
House Exemplus votes NAY.
[b](3) Exarchates – raising tariffs (subjects)[/b]
House Exemplus votes AYE.
[b](4) Expropriation of the Jews (decision)[/b]
House Exemplus votes NAY.
[b](5) Enlisting privateers (decision)[/b]
House Exemplus votes AYE.
[b](6) Seizure of lands of the Holy Church (decision)[/b]
House Exemplus votes NAY.
[b](7) Provincial taxation system[/b]
House Exemplus votes FOR the enactment of the policy.
[b](8) Lex foveretur Production Commercia[/b]
House Exemplus votes FOR the enactment of the policy.
[b](9) The Naval School Act[/b]
House Exemplus votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.
[b](10) Streamlined Galley Production[/b]
House Exemplus votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.
[b](11) Lex Colombo (+15% Trade Efficiency, -10% Army Maintenance[/b]
House Exemplus votes FOR the enactment of the policy.

[size=4][b]OBLIGATORY FACTION MEMBERSHIP  STATEMENT[/b][/size]
Senator Exemplus Simplus STAYS IN the Red Demes.

THE VOTING STARTS NOW AND LASTS UNTIL 9:00 PM TOMORROW (22 SEPTEMBER)
***​

{{Senator Alexius Colombo is not present in the Senate but he's still a senator – he will be allowed to cast a vote from his cell. You got that @luciusmalfoy012 ? }}

 

[House Doukas]

BTW is there anyone who reads this AAR and would like to join the Senate?

{{ I love reading through this thread, but I'm afraid I have not the experience nor the technicalities to do so. Serving in the army means no PC to check up the policies, and things have changed since last time I played (15 months ago).

Once I am in a more relaxed position, I will think about it }}

 

[Teutonic King]

{{Fancy Name Generator Activate!!!! Senatus Reformatione Stabilitatem, there you go a fancy Latin name}}

 

[Mach Twelve]

{{Do Dead Senators, who obviously cannot vote, need to make a declaration of Demes?}}

 

[CzokletMuss]

{{ Considering that they are dead, not really. Your House was spared though in case you missed the decision of Pylaeus. }}

 

[Teutonic King]

Senator Zeno Urbicus Mojmirid (Red Dems)

SENATUS CONSULTUM
(1) Reform of the imperial administration (National Focus)
House Mojmirid votes AYE

RESOLUTIONS

(2) Imperial Navy – mothballing all fleets (budget )
House Mojmirid votes AYE

(3) Exarchates – raising tariffs (subjects)
House Mojmirid votes AYE

(4) Expropriation of the Jews (decision)
House Mojmirid votes NAY

(5) Enlisting privateers (decision)
House Mojmirid votes AYE

(6) Seizure of lands of the Holy Church (decision)
House Mojmirid votes NAY

(7) Provincial taxation system
House Mojmirid votes FOR the enactment of the policy

(8) Lex foveretur Production Commercia
House Mojmirid votes FOR the enactment of the policy

(9) The Naval School Act
House Mojmirid votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy

(10) Streamlined Galley Production
House Mojmirid votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy

SENATE POLICY
Policy proposed by Blue Speaker senator Alexius Colombo and supported by Red Speaker senator Alexios Este-Ravenna.
(11) Lex Colombo (+15% Trade Efficiency, -10% Army Maintenance)
House Mojmirid votes FOR the enactment of the policy

OBLIGATORY FACTION MEMBERSHIP STATEMENT

Senator Zeno Urbicus Mojmirid STAYS in the Red Dems

 

[ParrotGuy]

Senator Nikephoros II Salamis (Blue Demes):
May the Senate unite for the good of the Imperium, may we pass this hard times with the devine guidance of the Lord and his regent on earth, Holy Emperor Angeloi. The Angeloi Protect.

BALLOTS
(1) Reform of the imperial administration (National Focus)
House Salamis votes NAY.
(2) Imperial Navy – mothballing all fleets (budget )
House Salamis votes AYE.
(3) Exarchates – raising tariffs (subjects)
House Salamis votes AYE.
(4) Expropriation of the Jews (decision)
House Salamis votes NAY.
(5) Enlisting privateers (decision)
House Salamis votes AYE.
(6) Seizure of lands of the Holy Church (decision)
House Salamis votes AYE.
(7) Provincial taxation system
House Salamis votes FOR the enactment of the policy.
(8) Lex foveretur Production Commercia
House Salamis votes FOR the enactment of the policy.
(9) The Naval School Act
House Salamis votes AGAINST the enactment of the policy.
(10) Streamlined Galley Production
House Salamis votes FOR the enactment of the policy.
(11) Lex Colombo (+15% Trade Efficiency, -10% Army Maintenance
House Salamis votes FOR the enactment of the policy.

OBLIGATORY FACTION MEMBERSHIP STATEMENT
Senator Nikephoros II Salamis STAYS IN the Blue Demes.

 

[Mach Twelve]

{{@CzokletMuss I saw that. Just wondering if I had to commit to a Demes now, I am busy with RL stuff and wanted some time to think over my families actions since half of their wealth got appropriated for the good of the Imperium. I do get to decide which half gets taken though, right?}}