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TurtleShroom

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As for your compliments, I am flattered that you call me a theologian.
I have long dedicated my life to the study and apologetics (defense) of my religion. Though I technically got Saved at six (like many kids where I grew up), I Rededicated and accepted Christ by my own accord at fifteen, after a long struggle with doubt and my own secular knowledge. I ultimately made full peace between science and religion, and I consistently fight the notion that a man of God cannot also be a man of science. Science, to me, is what the Bible meant by "all Creation 'proving' God's existence".

A mixture of Pascal's Wager and the observation of the perfect precision of the universe, of evolution, and of the buildup of life on the earth to sustain man's dominance is, to me, evidence that stands behind the Bible as irrefutable proof that God is real and that He truly created the heavens and the earth.
In my interpretation, the start of Genesis to the Fall of Man is figurative poetry to be taken loosely. I never dispute that God made everything, but I hold to the theory that the Hebrew "yom" (translates to "day" in the modern Bible) referred to "epoch" because ancient Jewish culture (Moses, who lived in the Bronze Age, wrote the first five OT books) observed no day, only day and night cycles.

However, I hold most events in the Bible outside of the six days of Creation to either be literal fact or a parable. That is a matter of faith: by faith I see Adam and Eve and the Garden as a literal event, by faith I believe Balaam's donkey spoke, and by faith I believe in Christ's virgin Birth, Death, and His Resurrection for our sins./spoiler]

That's how I came to be so knowing of my own faith and that is what I can advise storytellers on when they RP Christianity.


Of course, my Protestant background means I can only explain Christianity by the lens of Sola Scriptura (literally "Only Scripture", which states that only the Bible has authority in the Church and all canon law is preferential opinions alone), Chalcedon, and the Enlightenment's Reformation.

In RL, Orthodox and Protestant Christians share almost all theological agreements except the structure of the Church and Apolistic Succession.
Itʻs why Orthodoxy and Protestantism in RL were chummy and supportive of their mutual opposition to the Catholic Church, which they both saw as decadent, heretical, and even idolatrous because of its treatment of the Virgin Mary and intercession of saints.

Nobody I know who has an Orthodox friend has ever seen them pray to any being or thing except God through Jesus, and in no circumstance has my research uncovered any support from
the mainstream Orthodox Church (except some parts of Russian Orthodoxy until the end of the Tsars) for prayer or Catholic-style pseudo-worship of saints and Mary.

When you depict characters praying to Markos or to Markos' icons, you are actually depicting a heresy in RL Orthodoxy! The same goes on declaring Markos to be equal to the Disciples and Apostles, the latter who Jesus declared would sit on thrones beside Him. That would be a grave heresy in both RL Orthodoxy and Protestantism.

However, you are right to state that they considered icons to be holy in the Dark Ages. To some extent, they still do, and a few of the oldest icons believed to be crafted by nature (supposedly at God's direction) and discovered or given to man. There's a name for these supernatural icons, but I can't remember it.

Perhaps one of the first icons of Markos could be alleged by the Angeloi to be crafted by divine ordinance? Those icons were so special that even all but the most extreme Iconoclasts spared them!
 

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I need to say a few more things, by the way. These pertain to storytelling rules in the Senate.

First, are we allowed to post actions of the Senate outside legislative debate? I saw several Senators speak to their Deme team, but nothing about Senators pulling aside and yel- talking to each other. Colombos' author took special interest in "debating" Bubba.

Second, is there a penalty for posting too many long-winded posts, or is everyone welcome to speak their mind and tell their story (within the confines or the rules, of course)? You have all seen thus far that I literally write books in given posts. I feel that the interactions between Bubba and Colombos alone will take up pages. Is that all right?

Third, this session marks the first time any Azizite man participated in any Senate hearing, because the dynasty was appointed to the Senate in 1525 AD (or whatever earlier year this session convened). Bubba's father, Marcosi, was killed by the Sky Lords HO mere months into his term as revenge against his House catalyzing so many Tengris to conversion.
Will I be allowed to describe Bubba's appearance and have him explain his full background and family history to the other Senators?

Fourth, when will the actual storytelling begin? I leave this Saturday for vacation and won't be back until the Friday after. If I miss the session, will I be at risk of being kicked from the Senate because of activity? I am declaring my vacation time now in hopes any absence on my part will be tolerated.
 

ThetrueColt

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Colombos' author took special interest in "debating" Bubba.
I'm afraid he didn't. The Colombos are not my children and thus I have no right to handle anything concerning them. I just thought that it would have made for an interesting discussion, my senators in the AAR are the Pylaei (hence my signature). You'll have to wait for @luciusmalfoy012 to comment on this, as he is the one in charge of the Colombos.

Apart from that, with all these elaborate explanations regarding heresy, does anyone else get the feeling that the line becomes a little blurry? This all seemed so clear in the beginning...
 

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Ah, I didn't know that wasn't your guy. Ah well, it'll still be a hoot all the same.

Apart from that, with all these elaborate explanations regarding heresy, does anyone else get the feeling that the line becomes a little blurry? This all seemed so clear in the beginning...
Welcome to the world of theology. I will be your guide. To assist me, I will have to direct you to the Fathers Architects of Rebirth down in Italy. Did you know they are rap addicts?
 
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ThetrueColt

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I will have to direct you to the Fathers of Rebirth down in Italy. Did you know they are rap addicts?
According to the lyrics, they are architects and no fathers ;)

But sure, cowabunga dude.
 
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TheAnguishedOne

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Not to derail the excitement of roleplaying or the hype of the next Senate Session, but am I the only one who things the upcoming Horse Lords DLC would have been perfect for the CK2 portion of This Is Madness?
 
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Leandor

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Oh my... that was a LOT of information. You are truly enthusiast with this topic, heh! As others before me, I welcome you to the great halls of the Senate of Rome (located in Konstantinoupolis), esteemed TurtleShroom.

Now calm down. Take a breath. Every question will be answered soon.

Saint Markos, that truly was a LOT of information! I see you have a well thought and developed character and family, I congratulate you, and what an interesting mix of races and customs. The next session is going to be good, even better than the last one (I hope).

About the supposed heresy in our very particular version of christianity... well, when dooms seems certain, and there is only one person (our sacred Basileus Basileon) between life and the doom of an entire civilization (talking not only about the roman civilization, but the christian-european one) its not that strange that some traditions and doctrines change, even more when the authorities of the church are afraid of loosing their lifes and faith. I really think that, since the Angeloi came to power, the orthodox church in TIM and TIM2 has evolved in a particular way.

I wonder if we should start calling our religion "Imperial Church" and maybe changing the orthodox cross for... uhm... the chi-rho one?

Phew...! First Enlil, now TurtleShroom... Some interesting people are gathering here. I think I'm going to sit on that corner, just writing some stuff... *goes crying* (?)
 
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varetta

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Oh my... that was a LOT of information. You are truly enthusiast with this topic, heh! As others before me, I welcome you to the great halls of the Senate of Rome (located in Konstantinoupolis), esteemed TurtleShroom.

Now calm down. Take a breath. Every question will be answered soon.

Saint Markos, that truly was a LOT of information! I see you have a well thought and developed character and family, I congratulate you, and what an interesting mix of races and customs. The next session is going to be good, even better than the last one (I hope).

About the supposed heresy in our very particular version of christianity... well, when dooms seems certain, and there is only one person (our sacred Basileus Basileon) between life and the doom of an entire civilization (talking not only about the roman civilization, but the christian-european one) its not that strange that some traditions and doctrines change, even more when the authorities of the church are afraid of loosing their lifes and faith. I really think that, since the Angeloi came to power, the orthodox church in TIM and TIM2 has evolved in a particular way.

I wonder if we should start calling our religion "Imperial Church" and maybe changing the orthodox cross for... uhm... the chi-rho one?

Phew...! First Enlil, now TurtleShroom... Some interesting people are gathering here. I think I'm going to sit on that corner, just writing some stuff... *goes crying* (?)
I would add some kind of Papacy and cardinall´s college (in this case they would choose the Patriarch or Constantinople.

Why? First, to justify Protestantism and Reform. And second, because I love RP option of Cardinal Collegue.

By other way, we could add member families to the "Curia", the advisors, generals, explorers, admirals... A lot of options too.
 
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Not to derail the excitement of roleplaying or the hype of the next Senate Session, but am I the only one who things the upcoming Horse Lords DLC would have been perfect for the CK2 portion of This Is Madness?
Definitely not the only one. What a shame they didn't release this DLC two years ago.
I would add some kind of Papacy and cardinall´s college (in this case they would choose the Patriarch or Constantinople.

Why? First, to justify Protestantism and Reform. And second, because I love RP option of Cardinal Collegue.

By other way, we could add member families to the "Curia", the advisors, generals, explorers, admirals... A lot of options too.
It's possible but 'm waiting with modding until "Common Sense" is released. Even if it indeed is going to break the save there is still a possibility of implementing some features from it manually - for instance, new trade map should be easily transferred to "Imperium Sine Fine" (there's basically 1 file to copy). I'll see what can I do and how much time would it take when the DLC is released.

I'm busy writing the next chapter so please forgive me not answering to your comments in the near future. I already edited all the screenshots and prepared the timeline, so I think there's a good chance for an update before Sunday :)

A little sneak peek:


 
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Definitely not the only one. What a shame they didn't release this DLC two years ago.

I'm busy writing the next chapter so please forgive me not answering to your comments in the near future. I already edited all the screenshots and prepared the timeline, so I think there's a good chance for an update before Sunday :)

A little sneak peek:


Time to bring civilization to the savages !
It surely will become the Roman Man's Burden :p
 
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TurtleShroom

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Not to derail the excitement of roleplaying or the hype of the next Senate Session, but am I the only one who things the upcoming Horse Lords DLC would have been perfect for the CK2 portion of This Is Madness?
Do I want the Horse Lords EP?
Answer:

I AM SHOVING MY HORSE THROUGH THE MONITOR, BUT NOTHING IS HAPPENING
(I love that meme.)
 
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TurtleShroom

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Fourth, when will the actual storytelling begin? I leave this Saturday for vacation and won't be back until the Friday after. If I miss the session, will I be at risk of being kicked from the Senate because of activity? I am declaring my vacation time now in hopes any absence on my part will be tolerated.
If the next story is going to be written this Sunday, I won't be able to reply until Friday becasue I leave for vacation this Saturday.
 

Attalus

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BTW will we have Faction Meetings before the next Session ?
 
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CzokletMuss

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If the next story is going to be written this Sunday, I won't be able to reply until Friday becasue I leave for vacation this Saturday.
Don't worry, it's not a problem. This week I'm going to release the next chapter, then each Demes is going to have its Faction Meeting and then (c.10-14 days from today) the Senate Session will begin, so your vacation shouldn't be a problem at all :)
BTW will we have Faction Meetings before the next Session ?
Yes - they are long overdue plus this will give me time to rethink the rules and see whether or not "Imperium Sine Fine" can be made compatible with "Common Sense".
 
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TurtleShroom

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True Blood, eh? Your senator just left me mentally scarred with this image of cat-hunting mongolian singer...:eek:
What? No, no. Bubba is a very old custom and term of endearment in my RL culture. Most longstanding families where I come from have or have had a "Bubba" somewhere in the family tree. Bubba is not an actual name of someone (except here, because it's funny), but rather, a title like "Nana" or "Papa" or "Cousin", etc., indicating familial ties and affection.

I'm thinking about making something up and saying that "Bubba" is actually Mongolian for "family friend". This is alternate history and there will never be a region south of the Mason-Dixon Line, so it'd make about as much sense as Aztecs sailing east and kicking butt up and down the Old World.
 

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I have an excessive amount of screenshots due to a lot of important things happening in this chapter, which means that some of the less important events won't be visualized properly in the chapter. Although today there is no strict limit on the upper number of screenshots in AARs, I try not to surpass 25 screenshots per chapter.

Considering this I decided that I'll be sharing one screenshot every day until the release - it's better than deleting them and hey, it'll give you something to speculate on ;)

First screenshot:

 
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DKM

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This should be fun.