This Game is Boring the Hell Out of Me

[unmerged(371738)]

From another thread

I think I've pretty much burned myself out on this game. Europe is a cakewalk and everywhere else sucks. I don't know how people can stand playing in the Asian tech group...after twenty years I'm so bored of doing the same thing over and over (usually nothing) I just quit the game. All the Indian countries are exactly the same, all the Asian countries (except Ming and Japan, which are in themselves lame as Hell) are exactly the same, nobody ever techs up, just endless, repetitive wars with countries indistinguishable from the one you're playing.

Until there is as much detail to the rest of the planet as there is to Western Europe I'm pretty much done.

I've played as pretty much every country in Europe (except for a couple of the OPMs, who are themselves interchangeable), and most of the Muslim countries. I even managed to get through a whole game as Vijayangar, and back in Vanilla played some Ming. I just see nothing new or interesting to do. I know how to exploit the AI so well, I know what provinces aren't worth taking and which ones are, I know where everyone in the game is and what they're likely to do. I can beat countries 3x my size on hard. There's just nothing left. The low-tech countries aren't 'challenging', they're just flavourless and tedious.

I've played several mods, and some of them are quite good, but they don't change the main problem: Europe is the only developed and defined part of the world, and Europe is the only one that advances fast enough to keep my attention at all. You could replace all the countries in Asia with random squiggles and it would have Zero effect on the end game. Yeah, I can play as an Asian country, but all that's going to happen is that I'm going to turn into a European country, with an extremely long earlier period of watching the days click by doing nothing.

One thing I can say for the Total War series, at least the Huns are different than the Romans, instead of just being inferior and undetailed. With the battle system as it is (state-blocked and largely random) there really is no difference between fighting with any kind of army in any kind of terrain. Most governments in the entire world are Despotic Monarchies. Almost no one has unique missions or events outside of Europe and the Ottos.

There is absolutely zero content to culture and politics. You get a few generic modifiers. There simply is no such thing as internal political management, you're just a magical sorcerer king.

Until Terra Universalis comes out I've had all I can take of this game. I am just sick of staring at the coast of Normandy.

 

[Pewt]

So mod all countries into the Western tech group?

 

[unmerged(371738)]

So mod all countries into the Western tech group?

If you do that they can't see their own territory at game start. And they are magically in contact with Europe.

 

[Pewt]

If you do that they can't see their own territory at game start. And they are magically in contact with Europe.

Then mod all the tech group speed modifiers to 100%?

 

[Kull1]

I've read a number of your posts, and you seem like a fairly intelligent guy, but this is just whining. If you want something different, spend a few days reading up on some of the mods, and then play one or two of them. They were created by smart guys too, the difference being they saw things they didn't like and then took the time to develop something new and different.

 

[Shuriken]

The OP has a point, and it's made all the worse because DW was promised to be the patch that would make Asia fun. Instead they broke it.

Every game as a non-European country, the goal becomes "become like Europe", and while it can be quite well argued that any idiot should realize the game is Eurocentric based on the title, that doesn't mean it has to be so unbalanced in that direction.

 

[unmerged(371738)]

Then mod all the tech group speed modifiers to 100%?

Their units all suck past 1550 or so, Europe and the Ottos will stomp a hole in them (tech level 435Indian infantry will get annihilated by lower tech Europeans even if outnumbering them).

If you want something different, spend a few days reading up on some of the mods, and then play one or two of them. They were created by smart guys too, the difference being they saw things they didn't like and then took the time to develop something new and different.

I've looked at several of the mods, and many of them are great, but look at Europe: even some pissant country like the Hansa has tons of unique missions and opportunities. Now look at SE Asia - nothing. Some of the mods expand quite a bit on the Ottomans or Japanese (not interested on fighting on a little Island for 500 years, thanks), but I haven't been able to find one that puts the kind of events, decisions, religion and government variety into, say, India and SE Asia that Europe has. Doing so myself would take, like, a thousand years.

I understand why the game is like this - it is Europa Universalis. But once you get good at the game you can pretty much take over all of Europe and anything else you want with a OPM by mid-game.

I like the historical detail and variety, that you can play Holland a dozen different ways. You can't really do that outside of the West. You can colonize the Asian islands, or you can fight with a bunch of identical blobs.

Every game as a non-European country, the goal becomes "become like Europe", and while it can be quite well argued that any idiot should realize the game is Eurocentric based on the title, that doesn't mean it has to be so unbalanced in that direction.

Exactly. There is no hint of the chaos that was India, there is no differentiation in government types; they're all basically just painted with the same brush. There is no hint of the thousands of years of history in, ethnic disputes and religious changes. There is no indication of the fact that TIBET ALMOST CONQUERED CHINA, instead they're just crappy and irrelevant. There is no reflection of the fact that something like the Mughal Sultanate was a lot more like the Holy Roman Empire than a generic 'despotic monarchy' blob.

It's also silly that Europe's main advantage is technical, when it should really be wealth. The Indians had cannons on par with Europeans up into the 18th century, they rapidly adopted infantry guns, etc. They had tons and tons of money (gold and valuables), what they LACKED was a developed economy of real goods. The game's economic engine is far too blase to show this difference, so instead we get 'tech groups', and the only way to escape this criplling trap is to become European (it should instead be something like ' change your government policies so you're not such a caste-ridden, despotic Hell hole and let your peasants actually become burghers').

'Westernization' did not result in changing technologies, it resulted in a shift into a more European style social structure (the ones that haven't done this, such as Myanmar, can produce tanks and machine guns but are still basically primitive despotisms due to their lack of a developed economy. Capital accumulation and economic integration, not technology or ducats, is what makes the difference).

 

[Zlefin]

then you've gotten your money's worth. Games aren't meant to be infinitely replayable; it sounds like you've played it at least dozens, and more like hundreds of games. Congrats, you've played the game out; and probably played thousands of horus. So go buy another.

 

[Junuxx]

then you've gotten your money's worth. Games aren't meant to be infinitely replayable; it sounds like you've played it at least dozens, and more like hundreds of games. Congrats, you've played the game out; and probably played thousands of horus. So go buy another.

My thoughts exactly. Sounds like the game provided a pretty good amount of entertainment for its price. You don't go complaining about a movie you bought if the thousandth time watching it wasn't quite as enjoyable as the first, would you?

 

[unmerged(371738)]

then you've gotten your money's worth. Games aren't meant to be infinitely replayable; it sounds like you've played it at least dozens, and more like hundreds of games. Congrats, you've played the game out; and probably played thousands of horus. So go buy another.

It's been a ton of fun, but it would be a lot more fun if Asia wasn't an undifferentiated mass with a few freak nations like Ming and Japan. Or if Ethiopia had a chance to do anything but suck until it becomes European. Putting in historical, government, political, event and decision detail to reflect the enormous cultural history of India and SE Asia would have been far better than crippling the Ming with some dumb faction system.

As far as buy another, bleh, the only games I can play are made by Matrix and Paradox, and I've played all of them to death.

I'll be picking up the commercial Magna Mundi when it comes out, and hope that there is actually some relevant difference between Vijayangar and Manchu.

 

[thesodality]

Sounds like its time to start playing Vicy 2. By the time you get bored with that CK2 should be out.

 

[unmerged(371738)]

Sounds like its time to start playing Vicy 2. By the time you get bored with that CK2 should be out.

Victoria 2 would make my laptop explode. I need to replace the MB in my desktop before that's possible.

Also, I kind of don't care about the 19th century.

Victoria 2 has a really nice system for politics and technology, a lot of variety and such, I just wish that EU had that kind of political-cultural depth. This is the main thing that makes non-Europe in EU so generic; the system is built around European style centralized states in the early modern period, which doesn't fit anywhere else in the world at all.

 

[Freebot]

Victoria 2 would make my laptop explode. I need to replace the MB in my desktop before that's possible.

Also, I kind of don't care about the 19th century.

Victoria 2 has a really nice system for politics and technology, a lot of variety and such, I just wish that EU had that kind of political-cultural depth. This is the main thing that makes non-Europe in EU so generic; the system is built around European style centralized states in the early modern period, which doesn't fit anywhere else in the world at all.

CK has more political depth of the genre where you have to manage your vassals and courtiers so they do not stab you in the back. Literally. I eagerly anticipate the release of CK2. The only real flaw with the original was that military combat was trivially easy.

 

[unmerged(371738)]

CK has more political depth of the genre where you have to manage your vassals and courtiers so they do not stab you in the back. Literally. I eagerly anticipate the release of CK2. The only real flaw with the original was that military combat was trivially easy.

Crusader Kings was great, I really think many of its features (such as more independent vassals, non-unified armies) should have been incorporated into EU.

And, yeah, military combat was super easy in CK, especially if you were a large kingdom.

 

[James The 1st]

My thoughts exactly. Sounds like the game provided a pretty good amount of entertainment for its price. You don't go complaining about a movie you bought if the thousandth time watching it wasn't quite as enjoyable as the first, would you?

Yeah this. It is called Europa after all.

 

[DreadLindwyrm]

Just a suggestion: If you know what the history and unique opportunities for the non-European countries should be, then why not collaberate with some of the other mod creators and create a mod with these details?

Or, why not look at the mods and see what total conversion mods there are out there? I know for a fact there is a mod out there that works from the assumption that the Black Death wiped out Europe, leaving it wild and ready to be colonised by the islamic world. I have heard there was a mod being written to reflect the "Game of Thrones" world, but I don't know how far that has gone.

 

[unmerged(179469)]

Go play Vicky:R. Imo, better re-play-ability than EU3, nearly every nation is interesting and most of them quite challenging, much lower system requirements than Vicky 2, and last I checked (~1.5 months ago) quite superior to Vicky 2. It's only ~$5 too nowadays; I think they may even have sales where it goes down to $2 every now and then. Get the VIP:R mod too; the rails VIP sets for the player can make several nations far more interesting, and its little changes make many minors easier to play. Though of course you want to install it over a separate copy of Vicky because several fun things are modded out of the base game by VIP.

(personal hierarchy of Paradox games I've tried is Vicky R > CK > EU3 > EU2 > current patch of Vicky 2; I haven't dabbled enough in HoI 2 to rank it, but how much I've played it'd probably be up there with CK)

 

[unmerged(106498)]

You're bored playing the 'easy' countries and bored playing the hard ones because you don't do anything. If you want to start as a country in India and become HRE before 1700, you better get busy on day one. You set your goals as high or low as you want. Play Riga and form Germany. Be creative. Or bored I guess.

 

[eliphas8]

Just a suggestion: If you know what the history and unique opportunities for the non-European countries should be, then why not collaberate with some of the other mod creators and create a mod with these details?

Or, why not look at the mods and see what total conversion mods there are out there? I know for a fact there is a mod out there that works from the assumption that the Black Death wiped out Europe, leaving it wild and ready to be colonised by the islamic world. I have heard there was a mod being written to reflect the "Game of Thrones" world, but I don't know how far that has gone.

You are thinking of Misc Mods which has many alternate scenarios and awesome stuff, I would also recomend MEIOU though having read his comments on his graphics card that could cause probles, there is also OSC which is another one that makes playing more interesting.

 

[Tuominen]

Sure there is filling to do. For example Chinese expeditions to Idian ocean were limited there by only chance, not too much would have to have happened differently and history would look very different.

Zheng He and his fleet... great read.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zheng_He

Asia Universalis addition?