Status
Not open for further replies.

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
Don't know why people are disliking your post but it is a valid point.

Cosmetic outfits have little meaning in first person view. People care a lot more for the visual customisation of outfits in Assassins Creed Odyssey than in Far Cry 5.

Visual design of outfits will be meaningless in this game. Atrocious for an RPG which is, or used to be, known and loved for its stylised characters.

I agree with you on the points you raised and the fact that people are disagreeing with Midgar. The point is valid and "they're" not the only one voicing it. I mean, folks are free to disagree if they want, but it doesn't make the point less valid.
 
Last edited:

ComaPrison

First Lieutenant
107 Badges
May 10, 2012
222
0
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • VtM - Bloodlines 2 Blood Moon Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • BATTLETECH: Season pass
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Premium edition
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Season pass
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Sign Up
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • BATTLETECH: Heavy Metal
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall - Revelations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Victoria 2
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
one of you mentioned being willing to wait an extra year before release if it means getting 3rd person. i assure you that will not happen. production budgets and production schedules being what they are, that’s a total non-starter. your petition would need to be signed by half a million unique customers to change that.
 
Last edited:

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
one of you mentioned being willing to wait an extra year before release if it means getting 3rd person. i assure you that will not happen. production budgets and production schedules being what they are, that’s a total non-starter. your petition would need to be signed by half a million unique customers to change that.

You're probably right... Either way, the question remains, "Do you support the inclusion of a third-person perspective in Bloodlines 2?" If so, we would appreciate you signing the petition as well. It would help. At the end of the day this isn't a selfish request.
 

jwdazed

Recruit
Apr 6, 2019
2
0
So I just saw the advertisement for Bloodlines 2 - got super excited - saw the trailer and pretty much all first person footage and got worried. So I signed up for a paradox account, linked it to my steam in case that was just preview footage (heck it's not released until Q1 2020) just to find out more information.

I signed the petition. I can't play first person games - I won't buy it until it's able to be played in legit third person (not just for some action moves).
 

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
So I just saw the advertisement for Bloodlines 2 - got super excited - saw the trailer and pretty much all first person footage and got worried. So I signed up for a paradox account, linked it to my steam in case that was just preview footage (heck it's not released until Q1 2020) just to find out more information.

I signed the petition. I can't play first person games - I won't buy it until it's able to be played in legit third person (not just for some action moves).

Welcome and thanks for lending your voice! Like you, I'm hoping for a "legit" third-person addition to the game. Otherwise, it's a pass for me as well... Unfortunately.
 

Inkmancer

Recruit
Mar 26, 2019
4
1
A friend of mine was telling me about Paladins a Hi-Rez game, the same developers of Smite which I had skipped due to it being 1st person only. Even though I've been playing smite for years.

The reason why Paladins added a 3rd person view for the game, was because the character skins were not selling, since it's a free to play title Monetazation came mostly from the sale of skins the same as smite. However said skins were not selling, because people thought there was no point in spending money on them, since you couldn't even see your character.

Now that the game allows third person, people are buying skins for their favorite characters. I just thought this was hilarious, and something Paradox and Hardsuit Labs should consider, since they are also adding extra costumes and cosmetics for purchase for the Bloodlines 2, this is a great example of how sales suffer when you don't include 3rd person.


This is what will hurt them. If anything they might compromise and add more “moments” in which we are able to see our character in third person view.
 

Sh4ark

Captain
54 Badges
Feb 7, 2018
374
465
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Age of Wonders
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Premium edition
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Season pass
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Victoria 2
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall - Revelations
  • Crusader Kings III
  • War of the Roses
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
one of you mentioned being willing to wait an extra year before release if it means getting 3rd person. i assure you that will not happen. production budgets and production schedules being what they are, that’s a total non-starter. your petition would need to be signed by half a million unique customers to change that.

I'd rather they focused their efforts on fleshing out and expanding what's already there than adding one, two or all perspectives which wouldn't make the game better in terms of what it's supposed to offer game-play wise.

This is what will hurt them. If anything they might compromise and add more “moments” in which we are able to see our character in third person view.

Mm-hmm. Thanks for that. i hope they steer clear of third person now, if it means botching the sale of "cosmetics". Pfft cosmetics microtransations in a SP game.. who's bright ideea was that?
 

Carmilla

Queen of Vampires
145 Badges
Feb 28, 2012
1.570
722
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Magicka
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Sengoku
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Warlock 2: Wrath of the Nagas
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Knights of Pen and Paper 2
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Divine Wind
  • For the Motherland
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • 500k Club
  • War of the Vikings
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
Remember that they already confirmed that we have some situations were we can see ouir character in third person. One exemple were ladders. So we WILL see the outfits in some situations.
Not really good enough in my opinion as it's a far cry from proper 3rd Person, but each to their own. I'll just have to avoid using melee and doing platforming whenever possible.

EDIT: Incidentally the shaky cam shown in the trailer was... I hope that's not how it'll play and it's just exaggerations done for the trailer.
 
Last edited:

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
This is what will hurt them. If anything they might compromise and add more “moments” in which we are able to see our character in third person view.

With all due respect, that isn't really a compromise. It's just more of the same and doesn't really address the reason why folks want the third-person perspective.
 

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
I'd rather they focused their efforts on fleshing out and expanding what's already there than adding one, two or all perspectives which wouldn't make the game better in terms of what it's supposed to offer game-play wise.



Mm-hmm. Thanks for that. i hope they steer clear of third person now, if it means botching the sale of "cosmetics". Pfft cosmetics microtransations in a SP game.. who's bright ideea was that?

While I agree with your comments about "cosmetics", adding a third-person perspective isn't based on that notion. It's one of the reasons why people want it. I think that "not being able to play the game at all" is a bigger reason.
 

jwdazed

Recruit
Apr 6, 2019
2
0
While I agree with your comments about "cosmetics", adding a third-person perspective isn't based on that notion. It's one of the reasons why people want it. I think that "not being able to play the game at all" is a bigger reason.

Yeah, I'm clearly not alone in this (which is nice to know) but first person games give me motion sickness.

If adding microtransactions (via cosmetic skins, etc) provides the necessary financial motivation for adding a permanent third person view then I will absolutely buy a skin or something to help meet their predicted goals.

By the way, Ubisoft has been dishing out skins/cosmetic microtransactions in their last two Assassin's Creed games which were much more single player RPGs: Origins and Odyssey. Technically as far as I know they've been selling "skins" for your characters in most of their recent AC games, though the earlier AC games were far less RPG.
 

Strongreaction

Love, Peace and Harmony... maybe in the next world
4 Badges
Sep 12, 2009
52
0
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
@post author

Regarding the petition; have you posted anything similar to this post on any other sites? It might help to bump up the number of people signing. I posted a comment and a link in the unofficial BSN thread, in the VTMB 2 thread.
 

ComaPrison

First Lieutenant
107 Badges
May 10, 2012
222
0
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • VtM - Bloodlines 2 Blood Moon Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • BATTLETECH: Season pass
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Premium edition
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Season pass
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Sign Up
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • BATTLETECH: Heavy Metal
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall - Revelations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Victoria 2
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
I really feel for you guys who just can’t play first person games without motion sickness. I empathize, as I can’t play first person games without motion sickness when the FOV is too low (such as in some Metro games). The reality though is that we represent a relatively small group and the game does not have an unlimited budget so they have to prioritize. That being said, I really do hope they include a very generous FOV slider. It should be much cheaper and easier to do than third person mode, as far as I know.
 

jju_57

Field Marshal
On Probation
47 Badges
Oct 13, 2003
13.582
1.817
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • For the Motherland
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • Semper Fi
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
Not gonna happen. This says it all:

"I think at this point it might be a little late".

I support your position and all but reality is reality. What they wrote is marketing junk to not piss off people.

EDIT: For those that disagree wanna place a Paypal bet on it? Didn't think so.
 
Last edited:

Strongreaction

Love, Peace and Harmony... maybe in the next world
4 Badges
Sep 12, 2009
52
0
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
I know the weight a petition like this carries...The way Microsoft manages their complaints, or requests on forums is they multiple the number by 700.

I remember reading the The Tipping Point, and the exact quote eludes me, but it surmises that the people who actually take the time to fill out: surveys, customer complaint, feedback forms are super accurate representatives of a much larger group of people. Multiplying complaint forms by 700 is probably a conservative estimate.
 

Midgar

Sergeant
29 Badges
Mar 24, 2019
67
8
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Empire of Sin
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall - Revelations
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Steel Division: Normand 44 - Second Wave
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Tyranny - Tales from the Tiers
  • BATTLETECH
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Magicka 2
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Ancient Space
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • King Arthur II
I remember reading the The Tipping Point, and the exact quote eludes me, but it surmises that the people who actually take the time to fill out: surveys, customer complaint, feedback forms are super accurate representatives of a much larger group of people. Multiplying complaint forms by 700 is probably a conservative estimate.

The reason why it's calculated like that, is because PC players are the ones who are usually more vocal. Where as console players for the most part do not go to a forums to post, some do but not all and console's are still the number 1 sales market, though PC keeps growing. So it is a conservative number, but it's also somewhat accurate.
 

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
The reason why it's calculated like that, is because PC players are the ones who are usually more vocal. Where as console players for the most part do not go to a forums to post, some do but not all and console's are still the number 1 sales market, though PC keeps growing. So it is a conservative number, but it's also somewhat accurate.

Your statement about console sales explains a lot! I personally think it's a bullshit ploy that they put out for the sake of selling consoles. As a result, the quality of games on the PC platform has dropped due to "cross platform coding" (aka "porting"). On that note, I don't take issue with consoles... I do take issue with developers. Please correct me if I'm wrong!
 

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
Just here and steam pretty much, but I'm working with a content creator to get a you tube video ready by E3, since it's when exposure will be at the highest. There was hundreds of people asking for third person in the live stream reveal at least every 2 minutes you saw someone ask. I wish the petition had gone up that night it would be much higher.

But E3 will be a good time, since there will be millions more, that are not even aware of the game yet that will find out about it.

I know the weight a petition like this carries, because I have industry experience. I am not a developer but I've worked logistics, statistics, demographics and sales in the industry. I am not talking out of my ass, like many here think I do. The way Microsoft manages their complaints, or requests on forums is they multiple the number by 700 because not everyone is as vocal as the rest of us, that's why I mentioned it on the petition as hundreds of people, don't come to a forum or twitter nor facebook, to try to reach out to a company.

I've seen Microsoft change programs, games, features over less than 500 people. What a lot seem to be forgetting is that exclusion in this day and age is a huge deal. We live in a affirmative action, SJW, LGTBQ, and equality society, it looks extremely bad when a company decides to exclude a group of people because of mundane reasons. While some may want 3rd person because it's our preferred gaming perspective, there are millions who in actually would not be able to play otherwise.

The World of Darkness, is a beloved franchise is not a cookie cutter franchise like Call of Duty, or Battlefield to name a few, which many would just skip. The World of Darkness has millions of fans world wide who were fans before this was even a video game, and that is why when CCP bought white wolf and announced the MMO which was going to be a 3rd person game, the world went mad. People were offering CCP money during live events to help them develop the game. It is a fact that Paradox would exclude millions of gamers, due to this decision, be it because of preference or a physical disability. It's now an out of this world request, and by talking to actual developers who I worked with in the past, I was told that the only limitation would come with the game engine, and this engine should be very adaptable and uncomplicated since they will be allowing mods. This is not an out of this world request.

This is my recruiting letter.

Recruit%20Letter%20Microsoft2_zpsvisk5epd.jpg

I appreciate the inside information! With all of this in mind, it kind of reinforces my thinking in regards to PI needing to have erred on the side of caution when choosing a developer for this game. While development for the video games is relatively new, the IP is not an unknown and fans of the game most certainly would/will not let things slip. Again, this is why I've also said that perhaps Paradox didn't completely understand what kind of gem they were holding with the World of Darkness IP.

All concerned need to get this right!
 

Magister Tremere

Sergeant
Mar 26, 2019
76
20
@post author

Regarding the petition; have you posted anything similar to this post on any other sites? It might help to bump up the number of people signing. I posted a comment and a link in the unofficial BSN thread, in the VTMB 2 thread.

I haven't, but Midgar took the initiative and asked me to bump the Steam forum. So please, if you have a Steam ID, stop over there and lend your voice!

I'm not allowed to link to other sites (I've been warned), but I'm sure that with this being an issue, the forum won't be hard to find.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.