This is well within the power of the METI, and I can see no flaw with your actions minister.
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well lets debate this idea.
ok in order to avoid the wait in voting in a speaker,
If following an election, the speaker from the previous term is re-elected to parliament, he/she not just organizes the vote on a new speaker but is allowed to carry on as speaker for parliament until a new/different one is re-elected, should that come true.
The election of a new speaker however must follow a strict, speedy process. giving the day of the announcement of the new parliament members, and 3 days after for nomination. and the next 7 days for voting. same rules apply though, need a majority of members who voted, to have voted on the speaker. if that does not occur and a second round is needed for the 2 most voted on candidates, that round is to last no more then 4 days. giving a period of roughly 2 weeks after the term begins for a new speaker to be elected at most.
just want to debate this, and except for the numbers given for the 2nd point i dont think there should be much of a middle ground. either a person supports the basic concept or doesnt.
ok in order to avoid the wait in voting in a speaker,
If following an election, the speaker from the previous term is re-elected to parliament, he/she not just organizes the vote on a new speaker but is allowed to carry on as speaker for parliament until a new/different one is re-elected, should that come true.
The election of a new speaker however must follow a strict, speedy process. giving the day of the announcement of the new parliament members, and 3 days after for nomination. and the next 7 days for voting. same rules apply though, need a majority of members who voted, to have voted on the speaker. if that does not occur and a second round is needed for the 2 most voted on candidates, that round is to last no more then 4 days. giving a period of roughly 2 weeks after the term begins for a new speaker to be elected at most.
just want to debate this, and except for the numbers given for the 2nd point i dont think there should be much of a middle ground. either a person supports the basic concept or doesnt.
An alternative idea that has been discussed is that rather than having one open time period for nominations, followed by another for elections, that parties would make their speaker candidate the first name on their parliament list.
Candidates not interested could simply bow out. This would mean that when the new parliament comes together you can open voting immediately and not have to wait through the nomination process.
I'm not sure if this is contrary to the idea Speaker Lundgren had, but I think it solves some problems his idea may not (the time wasted with nomination).
Unfortunately, I believe the architect of this idea does not have a seat in parliament, but I've tried to explain it the best I can.
If this seems like a worthy proposal, I will contact him with any questions you might have.
Jack Teano
Moderate Party
Candidates not interested could simply bow out. This would mean that when the new parliament comes together you can open voting immediately and not have to wait through the nomination process.
I'm not sure if this is contrary to the idea Speaker Lundgren had, but I think it solves some problems his idea may not (the time wasted with nomination).
Unfortunately, I believe the architect of this idea does not have a seat in parliament, but I've tried to explain it the best I can.
If this seems like a worthy proposal, I will contact him with any questions you might have.
Jack Teano
Moderate Party
well the 2 ideas can easily be combined. mine is mainly for stricter time guidelines, but most importantly, it allows parliament to immediatly begin its work isntead of waiting a week or 2.
Id rather the speaker be apointed rather then elected, it would save alot of hassle.
Who would appoint him? The President?
No, I think it's good to have a legislative leader independent of the president.
In a multi-party system such as ours, an elected speaker from a body with proportional representation does a lot to ensure the voice of minority parties in government.
If we eliminate the nominating period, and shorten the voting period we can get more done.
Although it's not like we've been doing a lot with the time we've had here, anyway.
In lieu of this remark...Originally posted by heagarty
Although it's not like we've been doing a lot with the time we've had here, anyway.
EUTOPIAN ANTI-TERRORIST BILL
By MDIA Dan Hartwell, Jacob Langley, and Charles S. Morgan
Article I
Creation of Counter-Revolutionary Operations Group
(Consisting of 4 officers [OOC: human players] and 20-30 soldiers)
1. Adequate funding for sophisticated intelligence gathering equipment and high tech arms as used by most counter terrorism units.
2. CROG to be charged with finding and bringing to justice members of the revolution and other terrorists in Eutopia.
3. Wide powers including; right to plant bugs on persons, to tap phones, to run surveillance on suspicious persons, to arrest persons suspected of terrorist activities or suspected of being involved in the planning of such activities or being involved with persons involved in terrorist activities. The power to arrest and hold persons without laying charges for up to 24 hours.
4. To be independent of other military units and would liaise with police forces, be under overall command of the President and responsible to the parliament.
[OOC: All actions from point 3 to be approved by GM in every case before being implemented.]
Article II
Foundation of National Department of Investigation
A National Department of Investigation will be created under the Ministry of Defense (as a civilian organization) with the purpose of identifying and stopping terrorist activities inside the nation of EUtopia. The Department’s goals:
-To arrest figures known to be or suspected beyond reasonable doubt to be terrorist leaders
-To stop suspected terrorist plots before they start
-To investigate acts of terrorism which do occur
-To identify organizations or businesses which support terrorism and to freeze these organizations’ money-flow
-To perform background checks on immigrants to the country
-To investigate nationwide crime sprees, ie., crimes in different regions of the country which are proven to have been committed by a single suspect or group
This department will have power to conduct espionage activities on suspects if the suspicion is sufficiently strong.
Article III
Judicial Consequences of Terrorist Actions
1. Any act of terror that results in the death of an innocent person shall automatically carry a death sentence.
2. Any act of terror that could have reasonably resulted in the death of an innocent person, shall automatically carry a life sentence in a super maximum security prison.
3. Any other act of terror, including, but not limited to, massive destruction of property, false bomb threats, death threats, and kidnapping shall be punishable by no less than 20 years in jail and no more than life in prison in a super maximum security prison.
4. Knowingly supporting or assisting terrorist operations or organizations by providing any of the following: information, financial support, shelter, cover, training, equipment, protection, or any other assistance shall be punishable by no less than 10 years in jail. In cases that result in the death of an innocent, the death penalty may be enacted.
Article IV
Petition of American Government
The government of EUtopia shall request the government of the United States of America to add the Most Enlightened Order of Socialist Revolution (MEOSR) to the globally accepted “State Department list” of terrorist organizations. Should the American government refuse the President has the right to request of the United Kingdom, if he so chooses, that MEOSR be added to the said list.
-----
Just to clear up confusion about 'Aren't I and II the same?': I is military, like an anti-terrorist special forces unit, whereas II is much like--indeed, based on--the American FBI.
By MDIA Dan Hartwell, Jacob Langley, and Charles S. Morgan
Article I
Creation of Counter-Revolutionary Operations Group
(Consisting of 4 officers [OOC: human players] and 20-30 soldiers)
1. Adequate funding for sophisticated intelligence gathering equipment and high tech arms as used by most counter terrorism units.
2. CROG to be charged with finding and bringing to justice members of the revolution and other terrorists in Eutopia.
3. Wide powers including; right to plant bugs on persons, to tap phones, to run surveillance on suspicious persons, to arrest persons suspected of terrorist activities or suspected of being involved in the planning of such activities or being involved with persons involved in terrorist activities. The power to arrest and hold persons without laying charges for up to 24 hours.
4. To be independent of other military units and would liaise with police forces, be under overall command of the President and responsible to the parliament.
[OOC: All actions from point 3 to be approved by GM in every case before being implemented.]
Article II
Foundation of National Department of Investigation
A National Department of Investigation will be created under the Ministry of Defense (as a civilian organization) with the purpose of identifying and stopping terrorist activities inside the nation of EUtopia. The Department’s goals:
-To arrest figures known to be or suspected beyond reasonable doubt to be terrorist leaders
-To stop suspected terrorist plots before they start
-To investigate acts of terrorism which do occur
-To identify organizations or businesses which support terrorism and to freeze these organizations’ money-flow
-To perform background checks on immigrants to the country
-To investigate nationwide crime sprees, ie., crimes in different regions of the country which are proven to have been committed by a single suspect or group
This department will have power to conduct espionage activities on suspects if the suspicion is sufficiently strong.
Article III
Judicial Consequences of Terrorist Actions
1. Any act of terror that results in the death of an innocent person shall automatically carry a death sentence.
2. Any act of terror that could have reasonably resulted in the death of an innocent person, shall automatically carry a life sentence in a super maximum security prison.
3. Any other act of terror, including, but not limited to, massive destruction of property, false bomb threats, death threats, and kidnapping shall be punishable by no less than 20 years in jail and no more than life in prison in a super maximum security prison.
4. Knowingly supporting or assisting terrorist operations or organizations by providing any of the following: information, financial support, shelter, cover, training, equipment, protection, or any other assistance shall be punishable by no less than 10 years in jail. In cases that result in the death of an innocent, the death penalty may be enacted.
Article IV
Petition of American Government
The government of EUtopia shall request the government of the United States of America to add the Most Enlightened Order of Socialist Revolution (MEOSR) to the globally accepted “State Department list” of terrorist organizations. Should the American government refuse the President has the right to request of the United Kingdom, if he so chooses, that MEOSR be added to the said list.
-----
Just to clear up confusion about 'Aren't I and II the same?': I is military, like an anti-terrorist special forces unit, whereas II is much like--indeed, based on--the American FBI.
Well, I'm sure there will be a lot of debate about this one.
Surely enacting a policy to aggressively fight domestic terrorism should be a priority of our state.
Not to take away from this important debate in any way, but I'd like to go ahead and introduce another piece of legislation, before our deadlines come to pass, and we can debate it whenever appropriate.
Fellow Members of Parliament, I'd like to present the product of the the MHSA's Commission on the Workers' Bill of Rights.
This was a very productive commission upon which ALL of Eutopia's political parties were represented and all contributed to the final product.
While I will admit that it is not, in my mind, perfect, I think a perfect solution is unattainable given the many different views on this subject.
What we have here is the best possible compromise which, fortunately for us, remains an excellent piece of legislation. We have generously provided for the safety, security, and prosperity of our workers for years to come.
I present....
Surely enacting a policy to aggressively fight domestic terrorism should be a priority of our state.
Not to take away from this important debate in any way, but I'd like to go ahead and introduce another piece of legislation, before our deadlines come to pass, and we can debate it whenever appropriate.
Fellow Members of Parliament, I'd like to present the product of the the MHSA's Commission on the Workers' Bill of Rights.
This was a very productive commission upon which ALL of Eutopia's political parties were represented and all contributed to the final product.
While I will admit that it is not, in my mind, perfect, I think a perfect solution is unattainable given the many different views on this subject.
What we have here is the best possible compromise which, fortunately for us, remains an excellent piece of legislation. We have generously provided for the safety, security, and prosperity of our workers for years to come.
I present....
Multipartisan Workers' Bill of Rights
As recommended by the MHSA's Commission on the Workers'
Bill of Rights...
The Eutopian Worker's Bill of Rights
I. Wages & Time Off
1. All workers are entitled to be made a minimum wage, as established by the government and indexed to inflation.
2. Workers are also entitled to two weeks vacation a year, after serving a minimum probationary period of 3 months. Paid leave may be awarded on an accumulated basis, based on time worked.
3. Employers shall make available to every employee an half-hour break at least once per 8-hour shift and a paid 10-minute break for each 4-hours worked.
II. Working conditions
1. Government will guarantee the institution of local representative commissions with effective powers for reporting health and security concerns workmates to state authorities without sanction
2 Government will ensure that sufficient government inspectors are employed to enforce health, safety, and labour laws in the workplace.
3. No worker shall be work more than 20 hours per week until reaching the age of 16. The government will provide exemptions for family-based businesses.
III. Workers Rights of Organization
1. Workers are guaranteed the union rights to organize inside the private sector, though the government reserves the right to replace workers in crises of national emergency.
2. Unions are guaranteed the rights to sue firms that don't respect labour laws
3. All workers over the age of 16 and in good standing of their unions shall be allowed to vote in professional elections.
V. Education and Training
1. The government shall commit itself to a program to develop industrial education that shall be made available in the secondary education system.
2. The government establish program to provide workplace training for the unemployed and shall give particular attention to retraining programs for those who have their lost their jobs in declining industries.
VI. Employment Security and Benefits
1. Workers are entitled to fair and reasonable unemployment benefits. Unemployment Benefits are to be 75% of the average of individual's last year's wages if this average is less than 500% of the minimum wage. Unemployment Benefits are to be 50% of individual's last year's wages if this average is greater than 500% of the minimum wage.; they are paid for one year, at which point they are replaced by Social Aid. Unemployment benefits will have a maximum yearly payout of $40,000 per worker.
2. Workers shall expect homogenization of the retirement rights across industry sectors, with a stronger state protection of benefits.
3. Workers shall be entitled to full retirement rights after 40 years of full contribution
4. Workers who can claim full retirement can claim the right to double pension payment one month out of the year.
As recommended by the MHSA's Commission on the Workers'
Bill of Rights...
The Eutopian Worker's Bill of Rights
I. Wages & Time Off
1. All workers are entitled to be made a minimum wage, as established by the government and indexed to inflation.
2. Workers are also entitled to two weeks vacation a year, after serving a minimum probationary period of 3 months. Paid leave may be awarded on an accumulated basis, based on time worked.
3. Employers shall make available to every employee an half-hour break at least once per 8-hour shift and a paid 10-minute break for each 4-hours worked.
II. Working conditions
1. Government will guarantee the institution of local representative commissions with effective powers for reporting health and security concerns workmates to state authorities without sanction
2 Government will ensure that sufficient government inspectors are employed to enforce health, safety, and labour laws in the workplace.
3. No worker shall be work more than 20 hours per week until reaching the age of 16. The government will provide exemptions for family-based businesses.
III. Workers Rights of Organization
1. Workers are guaranteed the union rights to organize inside the private sector, though the government reserves the right to replace workers in crises of national emergency.
2. Unions are guaranteed the rights to sue firms that don't respect labour laws
3. All workers over the age of 16 and in good standing of their unions shall be allowed to vote in professional elections.
V. Education and Training
1. The government shall commit itself to a program to develop industrial education that shall be made available in the secondary education system.
2. The government establish program to provide workplace training for the unemployed and shall give particular attention to retraining programs for those who have their lost their jobs in declining industries.
VI. Employment Security and Benefits
1. Workers are entitled to fair and reasonable unemployment benefits. Unemployment Benefits are to be 75% of the average of individual's last year's wages if this average is less than 500% of the minimum wage. Unemployment Benefits are to be 50% of individual's last year's wages if this average is greater than 500% of the minimum wage.; they are paid for one year, at which point they are replaced by Social Aid. Unemployment benefits will have a maximum yearly payout of $40,000 per worker.
2. Workers shall expect homogenization of the retirement rights across industry sectors, with a stronger state protection of benefits.
3. Workers shall be entitled to full retirement rights after 40 years of full contribution
4. Workers who can claim full retirement can claim the right to double pension payment one month out of the year.
I have two questions:
1 To Charles Morgan,
Can you clarify what you mean with an innocent?
2. To Heagarty,
This is a genourous bill, but I wounder how you will finance it, without a very good fininacial plan, which I doubt you have, this bill will completly bancrupt the nation and we will be forced to higher the taxes, and cut on other welfare sectors. So my question is how will you finance it?
- Baron Johan Banér CRE
1 To Charles Morgan,
Can you clarify what you mean with an innocent?
2. To Heagarty,
This is a genourous bill, but I wounder how you will finance it, without a very good fininacial plan, which I doubt you have, this bill will completly bancrupt the nation and we will be forced to higher the taxes, and cut on other welfare sectors. So my question is how will you finance it?
- Baron Johan Banér CRE
Mr. Baner,
How will this bill bankrupt the nation? It will not. Most of the requirements are for private employers, not of the government. Additional expenditures, such as the increase in unemployment benefits are covered by placing new restrictions on unemployment, such as LOWERING the rate for those making more than 500% of the minimum wage and capping unemployment payouts at no more than $40,000 per year. Thus, the proposal does a lot to REDUCE government spending.
The other increases in government programs, increasing industrial education and ensuring that we have adequate safety inspectors are negligible costs.
This is a generous bill, but it is less generous than what was sought by the Eutopian Congress of Labour. I think it is quite fair and would not be a burdensome program for the government, which seems to be doing well as far as tax revenue.
The CRE had a representative on the commission, Mr. Vilms, who was very helpful in crafting this program, and we appreciated someone from your party taking an interest in an issue other than the restoration of the monarchy. Perhaps you should direct some of your questions to him?
I must say I am a bit offended by your comment you "doubt I have a very good financial plan". However if we need to raise more money, I am sure that ending subsidies of the nobility would be appropriate.
Jack Teano
Moderate Party
How will this bill bankrupt the nation? It will not. Most of the requirements are for private employers, not of the government. Additional expenditures, such as the increase in unemployment benefits are covered by placing new restrictions on unemployment, such as LOWERING the rate for those making more than 500% of the minimum wage and capping unemployment payouts at no more than $40,000 per year. Thus, the proposal does a lot to REDUCE government spending.
The other increases in government programs, increasing industrial education and ensuring that we have adequate safety inspectors are negligible costs.
This is a generous bill, but it is less generous than what was sought by the Eutopian Congress of Labour. I think it is quite fair and would not be a burdensome program for the government, which seems to be doing well as far as tax revenue.
The CRE had a representative on the commission, Mr. Vilms, who was very helpful in crafting this program, and we appreciated someone from your party taking an interest in an issue other than the restoration of the monarchy. Perhaps you should direct some of your questions to him?
I must say I am a bit offended by your comment you "doubt I have a very good financial plan". However if we need to raise more money, I am sure that ending subsidies of the nobility would be appropriate.
Jack Teano
Moderate Party
Please forgive any sarcasm in my last remarks. I was surprised by the tone of the criticism on this bill.
Many issues were discussed in the commission set up by the MHSA and I specifically addressed many issues I felt might have made the bill too costly. People of ALL parties came together to work on this bill and though I am the one to bring it to the parliament, it represents the work of many Eutopians of different political philosophies.
I would encourage all members of parliament, who are concerned about the plight of our working class, to support this bill.
Jack Teano
Moderate Party
Many issues were discussed in the commission set up by the MHSA and I specifically addressed many issues I felt might have made the bill too costly. People of ALL parties came together to work on this bill and though I am the one to bring it to the parliament, it represents the work of many Eutopians of different political philosophies.
I would encourage all members of parliament, who are concerned about the plight of our working class, to support this bill.
Jack Teano
Moderate Party
I cannot support the anti-terrorism bill as it stands. Though I am generally favourable to the suggestions as to how to fight terrorism, the bill is now too open to abuse, it generates inefficiency and it splits the various aspects of counter-terrorism operations where these should be united.
I am also surprised that none of the authors of the current anti-terrorism bill consulted with the MHA before the proposal was created. An effect of this neglect is a piece of legislation which is frankly, a nightmare for any ministery to implement.
I am also surprised that none of the authors of the current anti-terrorism bill consulted with the MHA before the proposal was created. An effect of this neglect is a piece of legislation which is frankly, a nightmare for any ministery to implement.
Mr. Baner,
I assume you mean this:
Also, I am open for suggestions from the MHA, which apparently entered Parliament uninvited. [OOC: I know, I'm probably splitting hairs with you...]
I assume you mean this:
While this portion of the legislation was written by Mr. Langley, I think it's safe to say that an innocent person is one who is not part of the terrorist organization and is not part of the terrorists' target, if their target is known. (For example, in the CRE bombings, the deceased would be 'innocent' since they were janitors instead of CRE political leaders, which were, one would assume the target.) However, I personally feel that 'innocent' is a slightly odd word to use (a word which can disqualify many murders from the prison sentences above) and am open for suggestions.
Also, I am open for suggestions from the MHA, which apparently entered Parliament uninvited. [OOC: I know, I'm probably splitting hairs with you...]
[OOC: The current MHA also happens to be an MP, and as such needs no invitation to speak in Parliament.
]
Huh?
No, I think he means "anyone not associated with the terrorist act." That is, if they blow up fellow terrorists, who cares, but if they blow up their intended victims or bystanders, then they are guilty of killing "innocents". At least that's how I would read it. Otherwise we'd be punishing UNSUCCESSFUL terrorist acts, but letter SUCCESSFUL terrorists off with a lighter penalty, wouldn't we?
It might be helpful to pull some of the co-authors together, who are not in parliament, for some further discussion, to perhaps clarify some of their points.
I'm constantly thinking about how to set up this piece of legislation. I'll try to get my major concerns/considerations on paper as soon as possible.
[OOC:Splitting hairs is my intention../OOC]
I think I'm for the anti terrorist bill, but that about innocent and not innocent don't I like. It should be the same penalty both if for example I had been killed as the target I was, or the two so called innocent people employed at the CRE HQ. This will lead to the question, If you murder somone you have planned to murder, or by misstake murder someone else should you then get a lower penalty if you murder the one you had in mind to murder???
I other parts I like this bill.
Baron Johan Banér CRE
I other parts I like this bill.
Baron Johan Banér CRE