- alot of which will no longer be unique? But anyway, its just a fluff. In terms of unique mechanics Germanics are now behind others. And certainly far behind Zun and Bon.
Things from the new stream
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Norse have been the only pagans with (a lot of) flavour.
This isn't about them being nerfed, it's about other pagans catching up.
They are the only ones that hardly need reformation with all the pre reformed features they have.
Lastly i guarantee that a viking game will still play largely different from a Zunist or Bon. That too brings uniqueness.
And you forgot Hellenic. Hermetics, hairspray (however that weird word is spelled), monastic order, access to Roman stuff, temple dedication, special imperial government.
This isn't about them being nerfed, it's about other pagans catching up.
They are the only ones that hardly need reformation with all the pre reformed features they have.
Lastly i guarantee that a viking game will still play largely different from a Zunist or Bon. That too brings uniqueness.
And you forgot Hellenic. Hermetics, hairspray (however that weird word is spelled), monastic order, access to Roman stuff, temple dedication, special imperial government.
You're making it sound like the Germanics have had all their features removed. In reality, it's that all the other forms of Paganism have the chance to have some of the same systems at the cost of neglecting others and abandoning some of their doctrines.
Ninja'd
Have the devs said anything about the imperial government?
Okay. What does Zun and Bon have for unique mechanics, what Germanic Pagans don't have? In which way are Bon and Zun way more unique?
- and? Can you show were i said that they are nerfed? I merely stated obvious that now norse are behind other pagans when it comes to unique mechanics. From hero to zero. From glory to dust. I think i was rather clear on what i meant when i listed base futures of other religions.
- ok, but what it has to do with what i wrote? I specifically mentioned in my post that im talking about unique base futures, not about geography or doctrines.
- i didnt count hellenic because of its unique nature of appearance on the map. And i think imperial government isnt hellenic future but roman/byzantine empire future. According to streams byz even start with it.
- im pointing out obvious, i dont making anything like you prescribing to me. Re read my posts. I didnt wrote - OMG PDX KILLING NORSE THEY ARE NORSOPHOBIC EUROPE IS DOOMED. They were most future heavy, now they behind everyone else.
- post number 515 at your service. Its not hard to read.
Don't forget the new unique Norse doctrine which gives both Prepared Invasions and Sea Raiding at the same time. Other pagans can also get Prepared Invasions and Sea Raiding yes, but the Norse can get these + another doctrine. That means they can keep these + get to play around with cool new stuff like Divine Marriage, Astrology or female rulers, without losing their core features.
Sons of Ragnarok: Prepared Invasions are Allowed ,Fleet can Navigate through Major Rivers. Ship Maintenance Reduced to 10%, AI Looter prefer coastal counties(Germanic Exclusive)
Sons of Ragnarok: Prepared Invasions are Allowed ,Fleet can Navigate through Major Rivers. Ship Maintenance Reduced to 10%, AI Looter prefer coastal counties(Germanic Exclusive)
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He specifically stated that he talks about religion futures that are kept regardless of reformation.
From what I have seen, every Pagan faith has one unique Doctrine that is worth two.
Why are you people arguing, anyway?
- Some religions get new unique features,
- Norse has more features now than all the other pagans combined,
- Other religions will be able to get some of the Norse stuff, but not all and they would need two doctrines to get the most, which would mean that they wold need to sacrifice their own unique doctrine to become a poor-man’s Norse,
- Stuff like the Blot or runestones are fully Norse-exclusive and others cannot get it,
- The only religion that gets and retains a lot of features doctrine-free is Hellenic. The rest keep only minor stuff if they don’t take their specific doctrine.
There are three things I have wanted for Pagans for a long time:
First, rename Pagan piety to Fervor (or something similar). Piety sounds too Christian to me.
Second, add the ability for Pagans to sacrifice "piety" to create a Skull Cup of executed enemies.
Third, add the ability for Pagans to perform "Utburd" (Norse name), that is putting crippled and deformed children out in the forest to die.
These would help set Christian and Pagan morality apart.
Many things that would give piety to Christians, aka fasting, mercy to enemies, sexual abstinence, sparing deformed Children, avoiding adultery etc, would be anathema to pagans. They should rather get piety/fervor from feasting (not fasting), performing ritual execution (aka Blood Eagle), participating in orgies and having many bastards (aka fertility) and fighting and raiding.
First, rename Pagan piety to Fervor (or something similar). Piety sounds too Christian to me.
Second, add the ability for Pagans to sacrifice "piety" to create a Skull Cup of executed enemies.
Third, add the ability for Pagans to perform "Utburd" (Norse name), that is putting crippled and deformed children out in the forest to die.
These would help set Christian and Pagan morality apart.
Many things that would give piety to Christians, aka fasting, mercy to enemies, sexual abstinence, sparing deformed Children, avoiding adultery etc, would be anathema to pagans. They should rather get piety/fervor from feasting (not fasting), performing ritual execution (aka Blood Eagle), participating in orgies and having many bastards (aka fertility) and fighting and raiding.
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And it has already been confirmed that even those unique features, like temple dedication can be modded into doctrines if anybody wishes to do so, and that creating custom doctrines is fairly easy.
How so? Care to elaborate?
What norse stuff? Why would you want to become "poor-man's norse"? What if norse would want to become poor mans Zun?
Blot is just standard pagan feast. Runestones are cultural, not religious. Everything else will be lost after reformation unless Sons of Ragnarok is taken. Than for example Zun retains its access to Hermetics, this is essentially Astrology for free, an important stuff. Bon has patron gods and Gurus, has access to Sky Burial which is essentially a piligimage event series, unique government for Tibetan cultured characters and male concubines.
Rest keeps access to patron gods, ancestor worship, male concubines and Sky Burial. Want to tell about Tengri and Zun polygamy? Or Zun divine marriage? Or Slavic river travel and ability to improve atributes by spending piety? Or African Jizya and monks? Or you cant because those doctrines provide unique mechanics that those religions otherwise dont have? Unlike Norse which looses identity unless Sons of Ragnarok is taken.
Just think for a moment about build like this but based on different religions for example on Norse and Zun:
Proselityzing Nature
Hierocratic Leadership
Haruspicy Doctrine 1
Animistic Doctrine 2
One that based on Zun has access to Hermetic society, one that based on Norse has what?
It's been said, by Silfae I think, that Norse will have access to the Blot no matter what (which I don't quite agree with, but w/e) and I can imagine Shieldmaidens as well. So at the very least they're keeping those two things no matter what.
Blot is just a feast and Shieldmaidens are accessed via new warrior society, they are no longer Norse exclusive.
Norse were the top pagan religion ever since ToG came out, without any other form of paganism to compete.
And now that the other pagan religions are brought on par (not better, they just finally catch up), of course you have some people crying.
And now that the other pagan religions are brought on par (not better, they just finally catch up), of course you have some people crying.
Oh nice! Shield Maidens are for everyone now?
And well...if the Blot's "just a feast", ignoring the bonuses, gameplay and flavour it gives, then the Hermetic society is also just a few events and a couple artifacts that sit in your treasury...
I prefer the Bon overlords thank you very much.
Edit: Why are people complaining about other pagans getting flavor in the first place. Germanic still has a vast majority of the artifacts, events, and a large early advantage over all other pagans. And before anyone mentions Zunism as being rich in flavor all they got is a unique feast and the ability to put out prisoners in the desert and they cannot raid, not as great as a unique feast with sacrifices, over 2/3s of TOG events devoted to them and had the majority of pagan flavor until now.
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