The Tannenbaum Blitz

[bbasgen]

I'm curious how many folks have used Operation Tannenbaum as a substitute for the Low Countries? Although historically only considered after the fall of France, PI has created a nice design where the Western portion of Switzerland is plains, and thus perfectly suited for an armored spearhead!

In my current game as Germany, I started the war in May. Poland fell by the end of May, and I had all my units re-deployed and ready for a Tannenbaum blitz by the end of June. Here is my OOB:

Switzerland was essentially a byproduct of the endeavor, and by July 2nd the Blitz began:

After the first week, two armored corps began exploiting behind the French lines, while my four infantry corps rushed to keep up.

On July 18th, just 16 days after taking French territory, Paris fell. Unfortunately, the AI decided not to defend Paris. It was odd -- there was a garrison there, which I had Rommel attacking. When I saw he was doing poorly, I stopped the attack, planning to wait on infantry reinforcements... no need, as soon as my attack stopped, the garrison left the capital city! Rommel walked right in.

By August 3rd, just 31 days after the Blitz began, France surrendered.

It sure is fun to use a different method to breach the Maginot! How many others are using the Tannenbaum blitz, and what you your results?

 

[GrafKeks]

Nice

To be honest I never thought of using it, I always attacked through the north or sometimes simply break the maginot.

I might give the Tannenbaum Blitz a try

 

[Darkrenown]

Nice. Although you run the risk of the Benelux nations deciding to join the Allies and invading you from the north.

 

[bbasgen]

Nice. Although you run the risk of the Benelux nations deciding to join the Allies and invading you from the north.

Actually, the moment I DOW Switzerland I also DOW netherlands. Netherlands is best fought with infantry anyway, and three corps did the trick. Actually, Netherlands still has one final province left when France surrendered. :rofl:

Belgium has stayed out of it so far, but, well, their situation is quite hopeless at the moment!

 

[EnDSchultz]

I did do Operation Tannenbaum, but I'm a lazy bum and so my army was totally AI-controlled. Took a while to take Swizerland itself since a good number of Frence divisions went on the defense in the forts there... but ultimately the AI did manage to swing around the southern flank of the Maginot quite effectively and quickly defeat France thereafter.

 

[Jagad]

Oh Tannenbaum, oh tannenbaum

Tried an operation tannenbaum as Germany. The Swizz mountains have always discouraged me from doing such thing. But with open ground I gave it a shot.

1 Armygroup going thrue Schweiz, 1 to the low countries and 1 holding the maginot line. Battle of France have never been easier. Felt gamey, cause the swizz armygroup reached the Belgian border without resistance and the french army was surrounded.

Guess its only Barbarossa that you can look forward to now.

 

[bbasgen]

Yes, the Tannenbaum Blitz is great fun. I'm afraid I don't draw the same conclusion as you, however. Using the Tannenbaum Blitz together with an invasion of the low countries is gamey imho. Now, I agree that the blitz itself is imperfect -- Switzerland should be mobilized, see Germany as a threat, and thus be tougher.

That being said, it is a wonderful, refreshing change of pace. It is nice to have a new invasion route as a *replacement* for the low countries.

 

[FNK_Drake]

Guess its only Barbarossa that you can look forward to now.

Sorry to inform you its all downhill from here...

I dunno what it is but the soviets just dont put up a fight. Next time im not going to encircle them until the start of 42' just to give them a chance..

I heard theres a problem with them losing most of their leaders in the purge and auto-assign doesn't work.

But I think they need more units or IC to build units as they have 1000 manpower and are on the no training law with +10 unit production speed.. Even so they hardly put up a fight.. too easy to encircle since they didnt have a good defense in depth..

Or maybe some more leadership so they could have more up to date doctrines..

 

[gunter_viezenz]

It has been tradition for a long time that every [almost] military age, able bodied men be armed in Switzerland, a tradition which is being challanged today. The majority of Swiss man had arms and ammunition kept at home as part of their reserve military service. Thus incase any invasion was to occur, everyone is already armed for the fight. Thus the Swiss would easily mobilize not to mention along the entire front partizan units would already exist from the resevists who are already armed.


The mountains, perfect partizan terrain, along with the fortification would give a massive edge to the Swiss. This dosent happen in HOI, I easily steamrolled Switzerland with Italy :rofl:


That and historically speaking the Swiss were fully mobilized from 1939 - 1945. Took them a whole 3 days to mobilize.

 

[Jazumir]

I *think* that in switzerland, today, you dont get a licence to build a house, if it doesnt have a bunker built in.

I dont think that a ´new invasion route´ is something refreshing. It´s bogus. Could as well have a landbridge to London for a new ´refreshing´ invasion route. MHO.

 

[reis91]

It has been tradition for a long time that every [almost] military age, able bodied men be armed in Switzerland, a tradition which is being challanged today. The majority of Swiss man had arms and ammunition kept at home as part of their reserve military service. Thus incase any invasion was to occur, everyone is already armed for the fight. Thus the Swiss would easily mobilize not to mention along the entire front partizan units would already exist from the resevists who are already armed.


The mountains, perfect partizan terrain, along with the fortification would give a massive edge to the Swiss. This dosent happen in HOI, I easily steamrolled Switzerland with Italy :rofl:


That and historically speaking the Swiss were fully mobilized from 1939 - 1945. Took them a whole 3 days to mobilize.

Besides that, they got a plan to isolate themselves by blowing off key passage points in the event of a DoW. I think they should be like Com Chi was in HoI2 (now it's relatively easy to conquer, though). And probably the only feasible way to conquer them (in the WW2 time period) without massive losses would be with Para divisions dropping at key locations and cutting communication lines.

 

[silenced]

Switzerland today is a Fortress, you can siege them, but that's all. =)

 

[Jagad]

Sorry to inform you its all downhill from here...

I dunno what it is but the soviets just dont put up a fight. Next time im not going to encircle them until the start of 42' just to give them a chance..

True that. My first campaign in SF I let the AI take control of the german army to see that it could do and to give the Russian ai a better chance. The AI pushed outside Leningrad and close to Moscow the first summer.

Halted for winter. As spring came 42 I took manual control as the manpower was down to 200. Had no problem to encircle most of the red army and then there was no challange left in the game

The ai managed to encircle a few divisions but mostly pushed them back. And in such warfare I would run out of MP long before the Soviets...

And I always build alot of navy with GER so I had not superior divison numbers :wacko:

 

[GrafKeks]

Switzerland today is a Fortress, you can siege them, but that's all. =)

There are no fortresses Bolsheviks can´t storm ;P


I´m still not customized to the Tannenbaum I alwas think IF I´ll do that the Swiss will push back together with the french but it never happened up to now and yep I really think the Swiss should be harder to break.

5 Mountain divisions mor at the start of the game should be a good beginning, or not?

 

[FNK_Drake]

True that. My first campaign in SF I let the AI take control of the german army to see that it could do and to give the Russian ai a better chance. The AI pushed outside Leningrad and close to Moscow the first summer.

Halted for winter. As spring came 42 I took manual control as the manpower was down to 200. Had no problem to encircle most of the red army and then there was no challange left in the game

The ai managed to encircle a few divisions but mostly pushed them back. And in such warfare I would run out of MP long before the Soviets...

And I always build alot of navy with GER so I had not superior division numbers :wacko:

Hmm, interesting... In my game its November 41 and I have taken Moscow, Leningrad. but thin supply lines and only 1 base in the med to supply southern Ukraine has stalled my siege of Sevastopol. I also pushed forward to Stalingrad and almost to the VP provinces around the Urals. Also closing in on the last VP provinces around Baki, but I dont know how long the supplies and fuel will hold out for my panzer divisions.

Interesting observation about the supply system. It seems that the most forward panzer division took most of the supplies/fuel with it. The ones I sent back to cover the supply lines against the odd disorganized soviet division mostly all are out of fuel for the time being.

On the subject of Switzerland I definitely think it should be a much harder undertaking.. But the problem is they lack the leadership, IC, and manpower to put up a decent defense.

 

[unmerged(65128)]

There are no fortresses Bolsheviks can´t storm ;P


I´m still not customized to the Tannenbaum I alwas think IF I´ll do that the Swiss will push back together with the french but it never happened up to now and yep I really think the Swiss should be harder to break.

5 Mountain divisions mor at the start of the game should be a good beginning, or not?

Well personally i have "monkeyed" around with the starting years for the Swiss giving them a fighting chance.

 

[AdmiralB]

"Territorial Pride" could be a solution: A Bonus of -say 20 % - for Switzerland while fighting on "core" territory should be a good way to strengthen them in a reasonable way.

 

[Schmeisser]

Sounds interesting, so I could try it out... But usualy I prefer the war to be fought historical.

 

[peryskop]

I think DOW Switzerland shuld push USA to join Alies much quicker

 

[krieger11b]

The problem with that is that if you get bogged down there the French will reinforce it and you will never get through, however that does mean that those troops are leaving somewhere else less defended