The plural of ethos is not ethoi

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jcd000

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Since i am Greek, i should comment on this:

In New Greek its :
ethos = ήθος
ethoi/ethe/what_have_you_plural = ήθη

In Ancient Greek its:
ἦθος
ἦθη
(basically the same, but the syntax rules were siplified later)

Now, it all depends on what you are translating? Phonetics? Plural sounds 'ithi' in New Greek, certainly not 'ethe'
But in Ancient Greek (quite a difference in pronounciation) it should sound like 'eethee'

But if you are just mapping η (=εε in Ancient Greek) to e, its ethe. That sounds wrong of course.
Also it is wrong to use the 'οι' for plural, since in especially for such words, the ending of plural is 'η', just as the OP says.

So, to conclude, imo its either 'ithi', or 'ethe', (eethee is sadly too weird). Or even ethoses, to 'British-ize' it.
I'd think that even glossologists might argue on that, to be sure.
 
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Where does Ethics fit in?
It's the plural of ethic; both 'ethic' and 'ethics' have been part of the English language for centuries, so they take the regular plural -s. Ultimately it does go back to a derived from of ethos, but that's a few languages and millennia between. Ethos, on the other hand, is a direct loan from Greek.

Not that that means much; there's nothing objectionable about using regular English plurals for foreign words (not that I've ever heard of). However, anyone who uses foreign plurals at least ought to use them properly. That doesn't have to include conjugation, but at least use the proper nominative word ending.
 
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blakh

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Since i am Greek, i should comment on this:

In Ancient Greek its:
ἦθος
ἦθη
(the difference being that the Ancients signified a 'h' before the η, so this could be written as h-ήθη)

That's a spiritus lenis right there (or ψιλή), signifiying the lack of an 'h'. (Otherwise the English version would be Hethos.) Wiktionary agrees with me on that: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ἦθος
 

Person012345

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No language has rules. Languages have structures and patterns, but those change constantly and can be changed intentionally by an appropriately plural force of will. All the plurals mentioned are valid because they are all understandable.

Personally I prefer ethoses.
Not true. It's true for english, but there are other languages with authorities and codified rules. English is one where the language is dependent on how people use it, but not all are.
 
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Yenzen

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deer - deer
boar - boar
ethos - eth... ethics

call them ethics

But a people can have an ethos, but they can't have ethics. They might *act* in an ethical way, but they can't act in an ethoical way.

Ethics, ethical = The field of discussing what is moral, or the adherence to what is considered moral.
Moral = That which is agreed by the pervailing ethics to be good.
Ethos = A system of belief regarding morals which prevails for a person or a group.
 
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jcd000

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Just forget about the clearly wrong 'ethoi' already. The devs should amend it if possible :)
They act in an 'ethical' way of course.
What wikidiff points out is that ethics and 'ethe'/'ethoses'/'ithi' do not have the same meaning.
Ethical has one meaning though. That something follows the 'ethics' or a specified 'ethos' or even set of 'ethi' (throwing another candidate here :))

Based on the wiki it is ethe or ethea or ethoses. I am greek and in greek we use ηθη so i consider that ethe is the most accurate.
the problem with this is that 'e' in English sounds in many many ways different than our 'η'. Phonetically, 'ethe' is wrong, and 'ethea' too. (but syntactically 'ethe' may be a sound choice)
 
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Just forget about the clearly wrong 'ethoi' already. The devs should amend it if possible :)
They act in an 'ethical' way of course.
What wikidiff points out is that ethics and 'ethe'/'ethoses'/'ithi' do not have the same meaning.
Ethical has one meaning though. That something follows the 'ethics' or a specified 'ethos' or even set of 'ethi' (throwing another candidate here :))


the problem with this is that 'e' in English sounds in many many ways different than our 'η'. Phonetically, 'ethe' is wrong. (but syntactically it may be a sound choice)

Well yeah, one could say that one acts ethically if one follows ones society's ethos. However it falls apart when one's ethos is in conflict with everyone else because ethically doesn't just mean acting according to one's own ethos, it means acting in accordance to one's society's ethoses. Ethoses can be more loosely associated with the individual or the group, while ethical refers to the group and ethics is more about the overall debate.

Ethos is much more similar to 'morals' than it is 'ethical', though again there are differences. One might say that 'personal morals' and a 'person's ethos' are basically the same, and that so is a society's morals and a society's ethoses. You can't act in an ethos way, though. You can act in a moral way, or in an ethical war, in in that case morals and ethics basically mean the same (positively charged).
 

GarnXCII

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But a people can have an ethos, but they can't have ethics. They might *act* in an ethical way, but they can't act in an ethoical way.
based on how i feel about this emotionally, i'd say they can now.

how about ethics always followed by an asterisk and a long, drawn-out explanation clarifying that the game means the differing collective ethical codes followed by different peoples followed by an asterisk explaining that in this game the word peoples is a coverall term for all sentient beings in the galaxy and not only human beings? that sounds aesthetically pleasing to me.
 

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Can a single group have multiple
based on how i feel about this emotionally, i'd say they can now.
The Pathos in this thread has appealed to my emotions about this subject, but my logical thinking makes me question whether a single group can have multiple ethos(es) at all.

I think even comparing different ethos to each other would be sufficient, as it used as a collection of something already.
 

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I really, really prefer Ancient Greek to Modern Greek. It's way more simple (even though generally Greek is pretty hard), modern Greek has all those weird pronuciation stuff, like beta not being pronounced as 'b', but always 'v'. Preposterous!
No offence to Greek friends.

And I always thought ethos was plural. Hm.
 

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As long as this doesn't become another "Bonus - Boni" - gate.

Im always confused by how greek/latin names and words are spelled in English.
Until we can get more people to learn the word 'malus' as a tidy opposite to 'bonus', then I'm not even going to fight the plural-of-bonus battle.
 
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I really, really prefer Ancient Greek to Modern Greek. It's way more simple (even though generally Greek is pretty hard), modern Greek has all those weird pronuciation stuff, like beta not being pronounced as 'b', but always 'v'. Preposterous!
No offence to Greek friends.

And I always thought ethos was plural. Hm.

To be honest they keep changing the grammar in Modern Greek every few years to make it simpler but the result is that i can never be sure my spelling is correct anymore.
 
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