The Norwegian Issue

[SpecialSundae]

So, I did this.

Now, my problem is that England is Primogeniture whilst Norway is Elective. My firstborn son, Magnus, rebelled and attempted to depose me during the English conquest - I put him down and imprisoned him after I was done with Harold (who is now my Marshal, smartest AI on that character I've ever seen - he actually tricked me into giving him my old Marshal as a vassal to get the position).

Apparently, England is going to pass to my imprisoned rebellious first-born whilst the Elective Norway is going to Olaf, my heir and second-born. What would be the best way of getting England into the hands of Olaf? If I grant him the title 'Kingdom of England', civil war will break out and I won't be able to intervene.

 

[King of Men]

Oh boy, I love that the game can throw a problem like this one at you! This is looking better every day.

That said: Can you execute the traitorous one? Alternatively, can you free him and try for a reconciliation? Or perhaps you can try changing one of the inheritance laws?

 

[rashtrakut]

You are sort of running into the problem william the conqueror had. Normandy went to his rebellious oldest son Robert. England went to his favorite son William

 

[SpecialSundae]

Oh boy, I love that the game can throw a problem like this one at you! This is looking better every day.

That said: Can you execute the traitorous one? Alternatively, can you free him and try for a reconciliation? Or perhaps you can try changing one of the inheritance laws?

My best bet is to get the Norwegian inheritence laws switched to Primogeniture, then the succession for the Dual Monarchy will be safe and secure, but there is one huge problem.

Harald's age.

He's about 59 now. He could die at any moment. I do not trust him to live long enough to switch the succession laws.

I need to get Magnus out of the way, but he has high support from the Norwegian Counts and Dukes. I COULD execute him, but then I'd be a kinslayer. Banishment will result in civil war.

 

[KevUK]

OT, but I had a problem whereby I married into a matrilineal relationship as the Duke of Normandy with the Duke of Anjous daughter - so all my children were De Anjou...nearly lost the whole dynastical name if it wasn't for a lucky 'encounter' with a 'lowborn' single courtier who fathered me a daughter that I legitimised. Unfortunately (maybe I don't understand the succession mechanics that well) the only way I could change my inheritance and stop me loosing the game was to go elective and nominate first my half-brother (against the King of France..but it worked..he became a pretender), but he had too many bad traits and when my legitimatised daughter became of age, I nominated her seeing as I had educated her wisely and really had good traits, plus I married her into another matrilineal relationship and now I am getting my dynastic name back. Complex? Indeed. When I went elective...well...my wife and all my children from that relationship all went into the red in opinion..like a -50 hit. Heh.

 

[SpecialSundae]

OT, but I had a problem whereby I married into a matrilineal relationship as the Duke of Normandy with the Duke of Anjous daughter - so all my children were De Anjou...nearly lost the whole dynastical name if it wasn't for a lucky 'encounter' with a 'lowborn' single courtier who fathered me a daughter that I legitimised. Unfortunately (maybe I don't understand the succession mechanics that well) the only way I could change my inheritance and stop me loosing the game was to go elective and nominate first my half-brother (against the King of France..but it worked..he became a pretender), but he had too many bad traits and when my legitimatised daughter became of age, I nominated her seeing as I had educated her wisely and really had good traits, plus I married her into another matrilineal relationship and now I am getting my dynastic name back. Complex? Indeed. When I went elective...well...my wife and all my children from that relationship all went into the red in opinion..like a -50 hit. Heh.

I absolutely love dealing with succession crisis. My mindset just adores the puzzles it makes, having to piece everyone together to make the court fit right.

 

[Kablob]

..."15 April 669"?:blink:

 

[SpecialSundae]

Using the mod to extend gameplay.

 

[Ograv]

Kill him. I played as William the Holy in my first demo run (before I started playing with the bookmark). I conquered England and decided to get my firstborn out of the way. I excommunicated, imprisoned and executed him, and got the kinslayer trait - but as far as I could tell it only gave me a small relations penalty some of my own dynasty members. I only played a year or so after that - it turns out his wife was pregnant (doh), and I didn't notice his son appearing until I died. So while there could be some nasty events or something I dodged, it doesn't seem to be much of to fear from the kinslayer event, and it'll disappear with Harald anyway.

 

[fenwayb]

my biggest problem with trying either of the invasion countries is all of the people who then instantly declare war on you with their own claims. I had an incredibly successful invasion as Norway, using the "get a merc company, and then just assault all of the baronies" trick, and I was pretty successful with splitting the country up without any major problems (though I was flat broke. I moved my personal lands to the Duchy of York + Duchy of Lancaster, so I had no personal money/troops), however then Denmark, who helped me win the war in the first place (married the one unmarried daughter to his 2nd eldest son, who ended up inheriting, but still declared war on me), declared war on me with their claim. I was broke and only had the troops from norway proper...so it was a struggle (I should have beat them though, except they had this one mercenary band who just raped me over and over). Just after Denmark declared war, William the bastard thought he'd take another crack at me, but I was able to beat him down well enough (which admittedly wasn't all that well) for his son to peace out with me when William died. In the middle of those wars, the giant southern duchy of Scotland (Lorthian?) declared war on me, trying to place a godwin prince they had in their court on my throne. About halfway through the war I realized I was able to get troops from England, (I had a few saxon faux-dukes, from before I realized I could use my piety to buy courtiers instead of money), but at that point it was far too late. Oh yeah, this was all within less than 20 years. I imagine the England struggle will be an absolute favorite scenario of mine once this game is released.

 

[Roardk]

..."15 April 669"?:blink:

Was looking at that aswell lol

 

[xGhost4000x]

So, I did this.

Now, my problem is that England is Primogeniture whilst Norway is Elective. My firstborn son, Magnus, rebelled and attempted to depose me during the English conquest - I put him down and imprisoned him after I was done with Harold (who is now my Marshal, smartest AI on that character I've ever seen - he actually tricked me into giving him my old Marshal as a vassal to get the position).

Apparently, England is going to pass to my imprisoned rebellious first-born whilst the Elective Norway is going to Olaf, my heir and second-born. What would be the best way of getting England into the hands of Olaf? If I grant him the title 'Kingdom of England', civil war will break out and I won't be able to intervene.

Put your spy master in your capital territory to "Establish Spy Networks" and then assassinate your imprisoned son.

Alternatively have him Excommunicated then Execute him, you won't get your vassals angry but will still get the Kinslayer trait.

Also get better resolution/bigger monitor and make sure to buy the game next week.

 

[Johan]

Good Job.

When I was Norway in a MP game recently, Harald died 7 days in, in a battle near York..

 

[SpecialSundae]

Already pre-ordered, buddy.

 

[Nikolai]

Good Job.

When I was Norway in a MP game recently, Harald died 7 days in, in a battle near York..

That sucks.

 

[unmerged(12555)]

What titles does your first-born have if any? If he is stripped of titles, then set him up as a bishop somewhere. That should take care of the inheritance problem as clergy can't inherit.

Edit: Not trying to be exploit game mechanisms. Forcing someone into the church or a holy order was often used as a way to get rid of potential rivals.

 

[DarkieBabZ]

..."15 April 669"?:blink:

Modders and people with just a tiny bit of editing are playing the game for many many hours didnt you know ?? "hint hint"

But considering its a demo (not end version) chances are most should spare themselves from playing to much.

 

[unmerged(250188)]

Paradox should have trolled norway and put it as part of Sweden. I would have loved to have read the forum then.

 

[unmerged(436066)]

Good Job.

When I was Norway in a MP game recently, Harald died 7 days in, in a battle near York..

Quite unfortunate when this happens. I was so close to conquering England as Harald.. I had defeated William and Harold was down to his last three settlements, but then Harald died and the war suddenly ended.. It was tragic but I thought it was very neat that the war ended when he died, as opposed to his son continuing it.

 

[InnocentIII]

This is amazing stuff, and all the talk so far has been for the 1066 start, for obvious reasons. There's plenty more coming on top of that from other interesting dates.