The Liege Levy Space Warp Wormhole

[BonSequitur]

So, here's the set-up: As the Canossan kings of Italy, I managed to land my heir on the throne of Greece (Which had been conquered by the Fatimids then subsequently the target of a successful crusade won by the king of Sweden). When I finally get the relevant personal union, I form the Latin Empire and start expanding with my empire title.

Cut to 300 years later. I've fought several wars against Sweden to get rid of their remaining holdings in the Mediterranean region (The old Swedish kings were assiduous crusaders). There are two kings in the Latin Empire, and one of them is the king of Jerusalem. So, the Duke of Ascalon, because of some dynastic entanglement, inherits the County of Livimaa.

Because of liege levies, I can now make 16,000 Italian soldiers (The liege levy of the king of Jerusalem) appear right in Sweden's backyard.

I think this is a problem, seriously. It's not just kind of an exploit, it can happen entirely by accident. Emperors with a single powerful king vassal can give them holdings all over the empire so they can make a doomstack teleport magically anywhere in their empire. I like liege levies, but this needs to be fixed. Maybe have liege levies raise the levies from just a contiguous group of counties?

 

[tuareg109]

Aaaaaaaaand this is why I play 1.06
Stuff like this makes absolutely no sense; it doesn't make the game easier (the EXACT opposite, in fact), and doesn't add to gameplay or enjoyment at all. Fix it, please.

 

[EmperorBobman]

Aaaaaaaaand this is why I play 1.06
Stuff like this makes absolutely no sense; it doesn't make the game easier (the EXACT opposite, in fact), and doesn't add to gameplay or enjoyment at all. Fix it, please.

Aaaaaaaand count me on the opposite side. Although this is obviously an imperfect solution, it's a heck of a lot easier when playing with a big realm to be able to summon all levies at once. It eliminates what used to by far be the most tedious part of the game (raising levies and waiting for them to move into position. Less micro is, IMO, a good thing in this regard and I think they've found an adequate solution to the whole problem.

 

[Hackworthy]

Liege levies are a lot better than the previous system. I'm sorry if you enjoy the exceptionally strenuous and tedious task of drawing together every single small army from across your empire. Most people don't.

 

[SchwarzKatze]

The real problem is: why can't we have both? One button that raises the entire army of a direct vassal, and one that raises levy county by county.

 

[tuareg109]

But it's so realistic!

I'd actually also like to have a delay between when something happens and when it shows up on the map (for character and AI, of course).
If your king is sitting in Glourious Tech-savvy Capital while his marshal is leading the army in the Forests of Hickville 2000 km away, he should get the news days, if not weeks, later.

 

[SamStarrett]

The real problem is: why can't we have both? One button that raises the entire army of a direct vassal, and one that raises levy county by county.

"The vassal of my vassal is not my vassal." Those counties are run by counts whose obligation is to their Duke, not you (unless you happen to be the Duke in that particular area).

 

[unmerged(488308)]

With the last version of the game, you can choose the county where you want to have your levies.

In that case, if his armies appear in Scandinavia, just disband them, select a county he owns, preferably a coastal one, then raise his levies back from that area.

I wonder why some people are still complaining about that feature.

 

[Ciaphas Cain]

I wonder why some people are still complaining about that feature.

Because you can basically teleport their whole army to anywhere on the map by giving them a single county anywhere near where you need them.

I never played anything other than 1.08 and really can't see what's so good about having to draw every single unit manually, but there should be at least some geographical constraints on where you can draw your vassals army. Balkanizing them should result in having to draw only the part of their army from the separated pockets.

 

[SlackBladder]

I'm with most other people here: it's better than raising each levy individually, but there should be something like a distance modifier. Something like "Cannot raise liege levy in this province - too far from vassal's capital"

 

[The_Blind_One]

as far as I am concerned

the current system is the best.

But...it needs one fix.

you should only be allowed to summon complete liege levies from continious vassal demesne connected to the capital. Any single counties seperated from the main body should raise single county levies.

 

[Stratagyfan101]

How about levies can only be raised in a province with a direct land connection with the vassals capital. Also, seeing as the game uses distance calculations, in some manner, limit the distance from the capital as well. Thus, no snakes, and no random territories across the map.

 

[BonSequitur]

I like liege levies - rolling back that change would be bad. But it introduced a new problem that also has to be fixed.

 

[Sir Tornado]

I think there should be a time delay between raising the levies and the levies assembling to the designated county.

If I were designing this, I would put 5 options along these lines:

"Raise Levies in 3 days"
"Raise Levies in 1 week"
"Raise levies in 2 weeks"
"Raise levies in 1 month"
"Raise all levies"

In first 4 cases, only the levies that can travel to designated county in the amount of time selected will be raised... in 5th case, the levies will be raised only after all the levies have travelled to the designated county.

 

[tman144]

I think the new system is a step in the right direction, but I think they need to go further. I think all levies should be raised in your capital, with a delay depending on how far away your vassals are. So vassals next door would be raised in a few days, vassals farther away could take weeks to arrive. Maybe make the time equivalent to twice the time of diplo messages. So if it takes 5 days to send a marriage request, it takes 10 days for troops to arrive at my capital. It doesn't make any sense to me that it takes two weeks for a marriage offer to arrive, but my "raise troops" message arrives instantly.

 

[Muskeato]

Imho the only people who see this as an exploit are those that don't care about perfect borders. Think of the borders!

 

[unmerged(599111)]

I'd rather raise each county individually than have to wait 4 in game weeks for my armies to be raised, while I'm getting smashed by Mongols who don't have to send their armies home to declare wars.

 

[tman144]

I'd rather raise each county individually than have to wait 4 in game weeks for my armies to be raised, while I'm getting smashed by Mongols who don't have to send their armies home to declare wars.

Well, the mongols are special, everyone else would have to play by the same rules as you. Besides, it takes time to move those troops manually anyway. It's not like the 400 guys you raise at the edge of your kingdom are going to do anything against the 60k mongol doomstack.

 

[Revshawn]

Let me get this straight. You are complaining that a bunch of soldiers are spawning in a group too near the enemy of the Kingdom you oppose in land that you own. You would much rather wish that you raise them up county by county and spend several more minutes grouping them together all across your large empire and dealing with the massive strains and slowdowns that it puts on your computer system.

Uh huh~ Yeah I like the way it is right now thanks. ^^

 

[unmerged(599111)]

Well, the mongols are special, everyone else would have to play by the same rules as you. Besides, it takes time to move those troops manually anyway. It's not like the 400 guys you raise at the edge of your kingdom are going to do anything against the 60k mongol doomstack.

Either way the system will be imperfect and people will complain. That's why the system was made easier in the first place.

Edit: And I never said I didn't like the current system. I love attacking the enemy from far away. I was just saying that I didn't like the idea of a timed system. Timing wouldn't solve anything you'd still get a random doomstack by your enemy. If you wanted to be more realistic the old way was better.