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stnylan

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I fear my namesake's life expectancy might be about to plummet, if it gets out he is a confidant of both the King and Regent. :p

What I like about this though is one interpretation is that Brother Nylan keeps telling Eadward to, in effect, do his job. Several times. Eadward, for his part, does seem to listen.
 

JabberJock14

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Eadward not considering becoming king? The thought had to cross his mind, unless he's simply lying to himself. He is in the greatest position to do it, if he so chooses. (Or propping up his son, if he really wished to, claiming bloodlines from both House Wessex and Godwin, which covers the Houses anyone on the island would care about).

I would not want to risk elective succession though. The Godwins would be in prime position to reclaim the throne then.

I am curious to see Oscytel when the time does come. I think Brother Nylan proposes a situation that would not truly happen though. I understand the belief that England was backwater - so that it was more appealing to rule on the continent. But turning down the English crown? That, I would find hard to believe, if for no other reason than it is a title, and a title that comes with prestige and resources. Oscytel could use it to further his ambitions in the Empire. It's one thing to decide you're going to spend most of your time in your continental lands - but it's another to say "nah, I'll pass on England entirely. Someone else can rule it."

Not long after this date in real life, Henry II fought to claim the English crown, and his potential holdings from his father in Anjou and Normandy far outstripped Oscytel's. And that required a war which could have cost Henry at least Normandy, given Stephen's potential claim on it, if not his life - Oscytel would get the crown by simply showing up.

And while King of England wasn't the most prestigious title, it wasn't anything to scoff at. I mean, Philipp II's son, Louis, had no connection to England (besides his wife) and was the heir to the now much stronger French crown. But when the English nobles offered him it, he still tried to take it, and probably would have, had King John not died. (An interesting potential alt-history there - what if Prince Louis united the French and English crowns in the 13th century?)

I know that happened some 80 years after this, but it suggests that the English crown was not nothing. So I would not think that Oscytel would simply turn it aside... and if he was that thickheaded, that his brother wouldn't take it to further his ambitions. They may neglect England, but when the time comes how can they refuse it?

Eadward certainly might be in a position where he could justify seizing power, and do it successfully. But he should expect the need to seize it, either by force or convincing his brother to change the succession - his nephews should demand the crown and fealty regardless.
 

TheButterflyComposer

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I am too much of ASOIAF nerd to let this go. ;) The Lannisters are (were) the richest House but not the strongest. Anyone that has played the scenario/mod knows that the North is the largest and most strong. Yet your point does remain - there would be some representation of their interests. Thankfully, no one loses their head over it. ;)

This is why I said if they were the richest and the strongest. It is made reasonably clear from the start of the series that they aren't quite the power they make themselves out to be. Even so, they have fingers everywhere. Mercia would be the same. Normandy or Flanders now I suppose, is probably the same in many of the shattered French courts to the south,
 

coz1

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Fb-fb:

Brother Nylan is such a tease! ;) Is there a move afoot to re-adopt an elective succession!? All that ‘Saxon tradtion’ - but who would win such an election? Or will Oscytel come through after all even with the years of silence and seeming indifference? Or Eadgar comes through to save the day?

Then again Uhtraed will probably live to 100, incapable and confined to a darkened room. Perhaps Eadward needs to let Agatha have a ‘private audience’ with the King, with plenty of spare pillows left lying around. The guards could then spring to action, find her feather-pillow handed, off with her head quickly in true patsy style. Eadward becomes Lord Protector of the realm, fights Beo in a civil war, etc etc. anything but this slow agony of indecision! :eek:

Seriously, we’re all in suspense here, something must surely break soon. :confused:
That's the first time the good Brother has ever been called a tease. ;) I can say that I am not moving back to elective though I did consider it. I got a little more "creative." Your scenario might be highly enjoyable but it is also not what happens. However, I promise that something does indeed break fairly soon. The guessing game is about to end.

I fear my namesake's life expectancy might be about to plummet, if it gets out he is a confidant of both the King and Regent. :p

What I like about this though is one interpretation is that Brother Nylan keeps telling Eadward to, in effect, do his job. Several times. Eadward, for his part, does seem to listen.
Indeed, I very purposefully had Eadward really answer his own questions with just a little help from Brother Nylan. And come now...I could not kill off such an important character. :D

Eadward not considering becoming king? The thought had to cross his mind, unless he's simply lying to himself. He is in the greatest position to do it, if he so chooses. (Or propping up his son, if he really wished to, claiming bloodlines from both House Wessex and Godwin, which covers the Houses anyone on the island would care about).

I would not want to risk elective succession though. The Godwins would be in prime position to reclaim the throne then.

I am curious to see Oscytel when the time does come. I think Brother Nylan proposes a situation that would not truly happen though. I understand the belief that England was backwater - so that it was more appealing to rule on the continent. But turning down the English crown? That, I would find hard to believe, if for no other reason than it is a title, and a title that comes with prestige and resources. Oscytel could use it to further his ambitions in the Empire. It's one thing to decide you're going to spend most of your time in your continental lands - but it's another to say "nah, I'll pass on England entirely. Someone else can rule it."

Not long after this date in real life, Henry II fought to claim the English crown, and his potential holdings from his father in Anjou and Normandy far outstripped Oscytel's. And that required a war which could have cost Henry at least Normandy, given Stephen's potential claim on it, if not his life - Oscytel would get the crown by simply showing up.

And while King of England wasn't the most prestigious title, it wasn't anything to scoff at. I mean, Philipp II's son, Louis, had no connection to England (besides his wife) and was the heir to the now much stronger French crown. But when the English nobles offered him it, he still tried to take it, and probably would have, had King John not died. (An interesting potential alt-history there - what if Prince Louis united the French and English crowns in the 13th century?)

I know that happened some 80 years after this, but it suggests that the English crown was not nothing. So I would not think that Oscytel would simply turn it aside... and if he was that thickheaded, that his brother wouldn't take it to further his ambitions. They may neglect England, but when the time comes how can they refuse it?

Eadward certainly might be in a position where he could justify seizing power, and do it successfully. But he should expect the need to seize it, either by force or convincing his brother to change the succession - his nephews should demand the crown and fealty regardless.
Whether Oscytel would pick it up or not is really only told by what they assume he means to do and since he does not write or show any concern for the throne, their assumptions are they he will not. It is taking Eadward longer to come to this conclusion however. There are a great many reasons why I have traveled down the road I have and part of that requires me to place Oscytel where he is. I agree, it may not be entirely realistic though I hope the way I plot this out is understandable and believable. We are getting very close so it won't be too long before you all can have your say.

This is why I said if they were the richest and the strongest. It is made reasonably clear from the start of the series that they aren't quite the power they make themselves out to be. Even so, they have fingers everywhere. Mercia would be the same. Normandy or Flanders now I suppose, is probably the same in many of the shattered French courts to the south,
Well, Robert of Normandy does have his influence as he sits on the council. I would presume that if the Lord of Mercia was a man, he too would sit on the council. It's one of those game issues that is harder to show in story terms without making a ton more up.


To all - And I thought that releasing Agatha was a controversial decision. Who knew that the friar might spark some question? It makes me wonder what will happen when we get to the really big doings coming up. And speaking of, one of the first steps happens very soon and might make some of those questioning a page back reconsider. I will post it immediately after this to get us moving in that direction. You might be surprised by our boy Eadward here.

Of course, thank you all so much for your excellent readership and amazing comments. I hope that everyone had a Happy Easter (if you celebrate such) truly thank you once again to all that participated in the recently finished voting in the Year End awards. I am already starting to roll some of the winners out and the first two are readers of this very work! Congrats to you @markkur and @stnylan! I hope to get the History AAR of the Year up today but it takes time to find all of the works (especially when there are a lot included.) Stop my the main general discussion area to see the victory threads. :)
 

coz1

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The Heavy Crown


Gainsborough, England – October 1133


Eadward sat at his desk in his private chambers making some notes to himself. The year’s yield had been hefty even with so much unrest, and his brother still had wish for building projects though he knew not the worth of them at this heavy moment. There was so much more to consider and the many pages before him told the story. Each was dedicated to one aspect and the more he thought, the longer each page filled with thoughts, notions, ideas or even just his mark of disgust.

He was slightly startled when a soft knock came from a private door to his back, but was happy for the reprieve as his man moved into the room and offered a full bow, “My Lord...you work late into the night.”

“I do...” Eadward turned to Wulfnoth with a sigh, “...many leagues yet before I might find my rest.”

The spymaster gave grin as he pulled down his cowl and showed his neatly shorn face, “You should use better light of candle, my Lord. The more that you may see.”

Eadward gestured for him to take a stool, “Wulfnoth, I am now over fifty years in age. If I do not see it at this late date, then I think to never do so. Come and sit and tell me of what you have found.”

“Where to start?” the wily man took his stool with a pensive face, “…Among all other places, I might ask of you where be the conversation with your brother, the King?”

“It is had often, and that is not why I pay you,” Eadward stood to pour them both some ale, “Your concern is not mine, but mine own is yours. You will then give over what it is that I seek.”

Wulfnoth accepted the cup with a happy nod, “Fair enough, my Lord. I may do more in your service with full knowledge, but here is what I have to say...two things, mainly. One, I think not to worry over your nephew to Wareham nor his help from Kent. The Duke Eadweald does remain young and full of spirit but seems to have no idea where to spend his energy. He gains no true help from Kent as your Duke Æthelmær the Younger does keep with his father’s practices.”

“It was not like Æthelmær the Elder to take to factions,” Eadward frowned as he stood tall with drink in hand.

“Nay, my Lord...” Wulfnoth held up his own with a smile, “...yet I think the Duke of Kent to be a naive and unlearned with the ways of plotting.”

The Prince took his seat once more across from Wulfnoth and held up his cup to knock, “Let us hope that this be true.”

“He continues his time at his father’s pursuits. Building works would be his thing,” the spymaster answered before taking a healthy pull.

Eadward looked to him with a skewed eye, “And my nephew to Wareham?”

“You may ask your sister, my Lord...” Wulfnoth set his cup down, “...but I do not think to find cause for worry in that place. As I say...he is young.”

“I do not have such luxury to be so confident, sir,” Eadward kept a stern brow, “While I think that the war for Glamorgan is soon to be finished, we remain with unrest abounding. Mine own wife was called to put a force out to quell the rebellion within Bedford. And Mercia marches around with their own to counter Derby once more? It is a hot bed and with no slumber to be found.”

Wulfnoth took another slow pull from his drink before calmly placing it down once more, “It is known. I did say to you that I had two things of interest, my Lord. I would save the worst for the last. Your Lady in York...she does try to rise again.”

“What has she done now?!” Eadward asked with a great sigh.

“I did tell you that I thought it wrong to release her, my Lord,” Wulfnoth answered immediately.

Eadward leaned forward, “What is it?”

“She does seem to win her struggle against the Prince Bishop of Durham...” Wulfnoth too sat forward and put his arms to the desk, “...and now, I am told that she would wish the man of Normandy...or Flanders...whichever it is...that is her new goal.”

“Robert of Normandy?!” Eadward stood with shock.

Wulfnoth looked back to his drink, “...or Flanders, if you wish.”

“By God!!” the Prince slammed his hands to the desk and looked up with great frustration, “Would no one rid me of this troublesome woman?!”

The spymaster was quick to rise with his hand upon his dagger, “It could be accomplished with great ease, my Lord. You must only say the word.”

Eadward swiftly raised his hand, “I do not mean that! She is a true born Lady of this realm and surely there is some other way to put her into place!”

Wulfnoth let go of his dagger but looked the Prince squarely in the eyes, “She was at a place, my Lord. And then she was not. If she may plot still, then there is...a remedy.”

“No!” Eadward stepped away from the desk to look out a window at the darkness of the night, “I say again...no. She may be tamed...in some way...somehow.”

“I would then not know it, my Lord,” Wulfnoth answered to his back with a sure eye.

Eadward turned swiftly, “I do not take to murder, sir!”

“You need not...” Wulfnoth offered a serious face, “...others may. It would be clean. Nothing to trace back to you. As you have always done...leave it to my hands.”

“I say to you once more...no!” Eadward stepped closer and Wulfnoth turned round the desk to stand in his face.

“If you do not, my Lord, this Lady will be your death. She will spite you at every turn as she does already and when such time may come she will be your mortal enemy.”

The Prince stood back in some shock, “You are a cruel man, Wulfnoth of Flint!”

“Aye...” the spymaster kept close, “...and I be yours in every way. What then would you have me do?”

Eadward looked to him with some sadness, “Is this how it is done?”

The spymaster took a step back with a more sympathetic eye, “If you wish a strong England, my Lord...if you would wish to find a better place when the time does come...if you think to look after this realm...then this is it.”

“The murder of a great Lord?!”

“Let us not call it murder, my Lord...” Wulfnoth offered a brief bow, “...there are other ways to cause the effect that you may wish. There is reason that you hold me in your employ and I would do as I always do. There shall be no trace that you had anything to do with it. And besides...did this child not already take from us her own father?”

Eadward turned back to look out onto the night, “That has still seen no proof.”

“Her actions since do not seem the likes of an innocent woman,” the spymaster offered.

The Prince kept his mind to the darkness outside for some time, “It is an abomination and whether I do the deed of mine own hand or no...God will know it true.”

“Do you wish security or salvation, my Lord?” his man asked with a flat tone.

Eadward turned quickly with a pained face, “I would wish both, sir! Besides, I do not know that such a thing may provide such security. This would seem to play right into the hands of Mercia, would it not?”

“The Lady does have her young daughter at the now...” the spymaster suggested, “...and the sister still lives. You have said that you get on well with her husband, Duke Gerbert. Mayhap he may be more pliable as regent of that place as he was when his Lady wife was away.”

The Prince Regent looked back to the night and remained silent for a long while before finally allowing an answer, “Then I give you action, sir, but I like it not. Do what you must but make it clean. I should not like this on my conscience more than it already remains. This is a terrible business.”

Wulfnoth offered a deep bow with his reply, “My Lord.”

 

Idhrendur

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I'm with Eadward. I don't like it, but it's necessary. But it seems that this family is cursed to take actions they feel are stayin on their souls. Maybe that's the nature of ruling, or maybe this is a rough time period.
 

stnylan

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Mmm.

You know, you could join this third of the tale togehter with the previous one and re-title them "The Education of Eadward" and not be wrong in doing so.
 

TheButterflyComposer

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Well, Robert of Normandy does have his influence as he sits on the council. I would presume that if the Lord of Mercia was a man, he too would sit on the council. It's one of those game issues that is harder to show in story terms without making a ton more up.

Woman are not allowed on council in the base game? A shame. The most powerful lord in Albion for a very long time was the duchess and later queen of Sicily, a commanding presence on my council whilst she was alive. The duchess of Brittany too was a power house in her time. It is strange that the more gender equal society of the Saxons would view women as their French cousins did (most of this no women inheritance stuff and women not allowed to do anything stuff in England anyway came about after the Norman conquest. This shouldn't be the case in this time line, therefore).

“By God!!” the Prince slammed his hands to the desk and looked up with great frustration, “Would no one rid me of this troublesome woman?!”

Well...yeah, loads of people I'd imagine. I'd ask Mercia but they'd probably hold it over your head forever. Get a southerner to do it.

The spymaster was quick to rise with his hand upon his dagger, “It could be accomplished with great ease, my Lord. You must only say the word.”

There you go. That should suffice. If he thinks this is conduct unbeffiting if a king, he needs to talk to his brother about what his father did to get that crown.
 

JabberJock14

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Tonight the part of Wulfnoth will be played by @TheButterflyComposer :).

But he/they are absolutely right. They had Agatha, and they let her go, to immediately cause trouble again. York and Normandy/Flanders alone are enough to give the current crown problems. I can't imagine what will happen when there's actually a change over in power and the realm is further destabilized. She needs to be removed, and after the easy way has gone, they must do it the hard way. I do find it funny though that Eadgar did so much worse in his time and these two brothers simply cannot bring themselves to take down legitimately bad people. I understand honor but... we saw how that worked out for ol' Ned Stark (not that these characters know anything about that)!

Eadward is 50 though? Egads, where does the time fly?

Woman are not allowed on council in the base game? A shame. The most powerful lord in Albion for a very long time was the duchess and later queen of Sicily, a commanding presence on my council whilst she was alive. The duchess of Brittany too was a power house in her time. It is strange that the more gender equal society of the Saxons would view women as their French cousins did (most of this no women inheritance stuff and women not allowed to do anything stuff in England anyway came about after the Norman conquest. This shouldn't be the case in this time line, therefore).

Even post Conclave women can only be on the council if you have some level of status of women. (And it's higher depending on the position - Spymaster is first-tier and it goes up from there) So it's rare that I see women council members unless they are the wife/mother of the ruler. The best you could do is give the duchess an honorary title or two, which understandably makes it hard to write her in court.
 

Asantahene

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Well well well-2 scenes that depict starkly the intrigue and problems facing the Regent. Personally I am with Wulfnoth: Agathe needs to be put down like the rabid dog she is

Well written scenes
 

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Excellent! It has taken a while - and much provocation - but at last Eadward gets down to the business. The headsman (perhaps a Frankish swordsman, Boleyn style) would have been quicker and more ‘noble’. But a dagger or whatever in the dark if the night, fall from a high tower etc will do when needs must! :)

And whether troublesome, turbulent or meddlesome, Agatha ain’t no Thomas a’ Becket! No sainthood for her. o_O

But, there are always consequences... :eek:
 

markkur

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The Prince Regent looked back to the night and remained silent for a long while before finally allowing an answer, “Then I give you action, sir, but I like it not. Do what you must but make it clean. I should not like this on my conscience more than it already remains. This is a terrible business.”
Well, not complete security for any King but something wicked this way comes?
 

TheButterflyComposer

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Tonight the part of Wulfnoth will be played by @TheButterflyComposer :).

Indeed, the return of a minor character to voice similar to forum comments about their lacklustre management skills is amusing. I have no idea whether this was written before or after all that though so...partial credit?

But he/they are absolutely right.

As you'd expect. ;)

Even post Conclave women can only be on the council if you have some level of status of women. (And it's higher depending on the position - Spymaster is first-tier and it goes up from there) So it's rare that I see women council members unless they are the wife/mother of the ruler. The best you could do is give the duchess an honorary title or two, which understandably makes it hard to write her in court.

Ah yes, I think I remember getting conclave in George's realm and immediately having to invest a ton of resources into raising women legally because I had waaaayy too many powerful women in the realm that needed to be on the council...including the regent. I guess this means Albion will be divergent from quite a few Conclave games then? Is this not something people usually do in their games?
 

coz1

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Fb-fb:

I'm with Eadward. I don't like it, but it's necessary. But it seems that this family is cursed to take actions they feel are stayin on their souls. Maybe that's the nature of ruling, or maybe this is a rough time period.
It was indeed a harsh time, but I agree with you that it seems this family does tend to do certain things they find hard to live with. Not so much Uhtræd, but now Eadward joins Eadgar in this.

Mmm.

You know, you could join this third of the tale togehter with the previous one and re-title them "The Education of Eadward" and not be wrong in doing so.
He is learning quite a lot and good thing too. One should always learn from their mistakes. ;)

Woman are not allowed on council in the base game? A shame. The most powerful lord in Albion for a very long time was the duchess and later queen of Sicily, a commanding presence on my council whilst she was alive. The duchess of Brittany too was a power house in her time. It is strange that the more gender equal society of the Saxons would view women as their French cousins did (most of this no women inheritance stuff and women not allowed to do anything stuff in England anyway came about after the Norman conquest. This shouldn't be the case in this time line, therefore).



Well...yeah, loads of people I'd imagine. I'd ask Mercia but they'd probably hold it over your head forever. Get a southerner to do it.



There you go. That should suffice. If he thinks this is conduct unbeffiting if a king, he needs to talk to his brother about what his father did to get that crown.
Even with Saxon views vs. French views on women in power, I think it would still be odd to have a woman on the council in this time period. I don't recall too many from OTL and even the stronger ones we know of - Mathilda was caused to put her son forward and Eleanor of Aquitaine was basically put in a prison (a very large and ornate one, but still.)

As for the Agatha solution - I thought you might like it. A long time coming.

Tonight the part of Wulfnoth will be played by @TheButterflyComposer :).

But he/they are absolutely right. They had Agatha, and they let her go, to immediately cause trouble again. York and Normandy/Flanders alone are enough to give the current crown problems. I can't imagine what will happen when there's actually a change over in power and the realm is further destabilized. She needs to be removed, and after the easy way has gone, they must do it the hard way. I do find it funny though that Eadgar did so much worse in his time and these two brothers simply cannot bring themselves to take down legitimately bad people. I understand honor but... we saw how that worked out for ol' Ned Stark (not that these characters know anything about that)!

Eadward is 50 though? Egads, where does the time fly?



Even post Conclave women can only be on the council if you have some level of status of women. (And it's higher depending on the position - Spymaster is first-tier and it goes up from there) So it's rare that I see women council members unless they are the wife/mother of the ruler. The best you could do is give the duchess an honorary title or two, which understandably makes it hard to write her in court.
Indeed, Eadward is 50. I agree, it seems like just yesterday he was the young 16 year old wanting to be Chancellor. Well, he got his wish.

And while it was agonized over due to a sense of honor, Eadward did finally relent. You will see that he may not quite his agonizing but his morals get a little more loosy goosy coming up. ;) (Slight spoiler alert.)

Well well well-2 scenes that depict starkly the intrigue and problems facing the Regent. Personally I am with Wulfnoth: Agathe needs to be put down like the rabid dog she is

Well written scenes
Thank you, sir. I did think them somewhat two sides of the same coin. As @stnylan suggests, Eadward is learning quite a lot right now. He needs to.

Excellent! It has taken a while - and much provocation - but at last Eadward gets down to the business. The headsman (perhaps a Frankish swordsman, Boleyn style) would have been quicker and more ‘noble’. But a dagger or whatever in the dark if the night, fall from a high tower etc will do when needs must! :)

And whether troublesome, turbulent or meddlesome, Agatha ain’t no Thomas a’ Becket! No sainthood for her. o_O

But, there are always consequences... :eek:
I am pleased you quote the reference. :) I could not help myself as we are so close in time with the real event. Certainly the themes have changed and I agree, Agatha is no Becket but that quote is so famous (even if questioned.) It was too rich not to use.

Well, not complete security for any King but something wicked this way comes?
Something wicked indeed, sir. Or perhaps some things. There is a plan, however. I hope it works. :D

Indeed, the return of a minor character to voice similar to forum comments about their lacklustre management skills is amusing. I have no idea whether this was written before or after all that though so...partial credit?



As you'd expect. ;)



Ah yes, I think I remember getting conclave in George's realm and immediately having to invest a ton of resources into raising women legally because I had waaaayy too many powerful women in the realm that needed to be on the council...including the regent. I guess this means Albion will be divergent from quite a few Conclave games then? Is this not something people usually do in their games?
The last scene was actually written some time before this most recent discussion yet I do not deny that some whispers have been considered and I do try to make Wulfnoth a bit of a voice of reason. Here, I anticipated the reaction and so it was slightly humorous to me to see so many suggest the same thing.


To all - As expected, I thought that many might be pleased with the latest happenings and so I was keen to get it out there after the recent disappointment of releasing Agatha. We shall see her fate soonish. I will have to explain in more detail at a later time for this is only of a piece and all of it will need to be explained more fully. That said, I agree and still think it was the right choice. She was just too much of a problem. Knowing this all before I started this third book, you may now see why I thought it an interesting idea to have her kill Morcar in the first place. It makes her resolution somewhat easier.

Expect the next scene tomorrow when I get home from work and thank you as always for your excellent comments! You remain the best! :)
 

Nikolai

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Going back to the talk with Brother Nylan... The ancient way of succession during the Cerdicingas - that is the House of Wessex - was elective among the dynasty's members, was it not?
 

Specialist290

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You know, the more this situation evolves, the more parallels I see between our present royal dynamic duo and another one from much earlier -- namely, that of Morcar the Elder and his brother Eadwin. Certainly the parallel doesn't hold in all cases (Uhtraed and Eadward are on much better terms personally, for one), but the similarities that do seem to be coming out of the woodwork are rather striking.

I do have to wonder whether Uhtraed would countenance Eadward's participation in a murder plot, given his own break with his father over the means by which his throne was attained -- but then, Uhtraed now has nearly half a century's worth of experience as King himself (and of the attendant burdens of duty) behind him, and Agatha is hardly an innocent babe.
 

Asantahene

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I do have to wonder whether Uhtraed would countenance Eadward's participation in a murder plot, given his own break with his father over the means by which his throne was attained
Will Eadward tell him though? Personally I’d keep schtum ;)
 

Bullfilter

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Will Eadward tell him though? Personally I’d keep schtum ;)
Yes, the phrase “plausible deniability” may be a modern (and villainously humorous, while egregious) term, but the concept is as old as the hills.

For Agatha, a face-full of pillow could be appropriate - ooh, we are are wicked with our electronic characters, aren’t we!? ;):eek::D
 

coz1

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More fb-fb:

Going back to the talk with Brother Nylan... The ancient way of succession during the Cerdicingas - that is the House of Wessex - was elective among the dynasty's members, was it not?
I have to be honest, I am not entirely sure but I think that this is right. I will bring up a rather famous case soon, but I'd be more than happy to hear the thoughts of more learned minds than mine. I won't deny that I have explored this already.

You know, the more this situation evolves, the more parallels I see between our present royal dynamic duo and another one from much earlier -- namely, that of Morcar the Elder and his brother Eadwin. Certainly the parallel doesn't hold in all cases (Uhtraed and Eadward are on much better terms personally, for one), but the similarities that do seem to be coming out of the woodwork are rather striking.

I do have to wonder whether Uhtraed would countenance Eadward's participation in a murder plot, given his own break with his father over the means by which his throne was attained -- but then, Uhtraed now has nearly half a century's worth of experience as King himself (and of the attendant burdens of duty) behind him, and Agatha is hardly an innocent babe.
Very interesting point! In some ways, you might say that the positions are reversed. I cannot say that it was any thought on my part to build such a thing, but a really intriguing idea.:)

However, Eadward will not be telling Uhtræd of this action as much as he might need the "backstory" of their father's reign (though he has heard the rumors.)

Will Eadward tell him though? Personally I’d keep schtum ;)
Indeed, no. And I hope you don't mind but I read your comment with the voice of Michael Palin. :D

Yes, the phrase “plausible deniability” may be a modern (and villainously humorous, while egregious) term, but the concept is as old as the hills.

For Agatha, a face-full of pillow could be appropriate - ooh, we are are wicked with our electronic characters, aren’t we!? ;):eek::D
Face full of pillow would be most apt, but it may go another way. ;) Wicked we are when it is deserved (and sometimes when it isn't) I just hope that when we are done here I don't get called out like I did with my Into the West AAR for basically killing off everyone that meant anything to the readers. :(;)
 

JabberJock14

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do have to wonder whether Uhtraed would countenance Eadward's participation in a murder plot, given his own break with his father over the means by which his throne was attained -- but then, Uhtraed now has nearly half a century's worth of experience as King himself (and of the attendant burdens of duty) behind him, and Agatha is hardly an innocent babe.

Given Uhtraed's issues with Eadgar and his own concern with God's wrath, (and he's nearness to death) I feel like there's no way he'd let the plot fly. But the king would be wrong - Eadward must do what's right for the kingdom.

Slippery slope there... I admit.