Originally posted by TheArchduke
NO!BiB would never be sarcastic. What crazy idea is that?
sheesh...
BiB and Sarcasm thats like fire and ice....
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sheesh...
BiB and Sarcasm thats like fire and ice....
Originally posted by Slargos
So your suggestion was not loaded with sarcasm?
Nope.
(neither was this post
)
I agree with Bib keep it as a fantasy scenario. While I wish to see improvements such as random leaders, I do not see how some of the suggestions will stop France annexing Savoy or Austria annexing Bavaria and other such fudamental problems.
Well, that goes down to the fact that it is waaaaaaaaaay too easy to diploannex a country. Something for Johan i would imagine.
What we're looking for is a fresh canvas that the players fill with colour, rather than the same old events that straight-jacket peoples thinking. I think that's why the idea appeals to some of us who would like an RPG game where it's our imaginations that set the scene not real life history.
What about the same old leaders, kings, and well, countries that also very much straightjacket people's thinking?
Leaders would be changed.
Countries set the foundation, that's pretty much self-evident.
Monarchs should probably also be changed to make the evolution complete, but it's a bigger project.
I suppose dynasties could also be evolved as the game progresses... the merger of the board RPGs with the Game.. I like it.
A few other issues:
The flag events. ToT, reformation, calvin, CRC, edict of tolerance. We will probably sleep the ToT, right? What about the religious events? I see 4 options:
1. Let them as they are
2. Remove them and let the church stay united in any case.
3. Write a new version of that event file with earlier start dates, higher offset and later death dates. There is the issue with those events triggering on reload, though.
4. Remove them and let the GM set the flags, possibly depending on in-game developments.
Culture gains, e. g. gaelic for England. I propose that every nation should be able to aquire cultures under these conditions:
1. It has to be RPed. Something like favouring them for public offices, encouraging them to serve in the army in some way, marriage of the crown prince into a family of that culture etc. possibly several such things.
2. It should come at the cost of stability, global or local revolt risk, maybe also dp-changes, money or base tax or manpower values. This should depend on how much the player gains through aquireing the culture.
3. The player must own at least 40% of the provinces of that culture and at least 50% of these provinces should be state religion and nationalism free.
4. There is a cap of 4 cultures per nation, and 2 cultures gained in such a way.
other conditions...?
Should we leave the monarch lists alone? I guess RP every marriage and randomizing the offspring would be too tedious.
The flag events. ToT, reformation, calvin, CRC, edict of tolerance. We will probably sleep the ToT, right? What about the religious events? I see 4 options:
1. Let them as they are
2. Remove them and let the church stay united in any case.
3. Write a new version of that event file with earlier start dates, higher offset and later death dates. There is the issue with those events triggering on reload, though.
4. Remove them and let the GM set the flags, possibly depending on in-game developments.
Culture gains, e. g. gaelic for England. I propose that every nation should be able to aquire cultures under these conditions:
1. It has to be RPed. Something like favouring them for public offices, encouraging them to serve in the army in some way, marriage of the crown prince into a family of that culture etc. possibly several such things.
2. It should come at the cost of stability, global or local revolt risk, maybe also dp-changes, money or base tax or manpower values. This should depend on how much the player gains through aquireing the culture.
3. The player must own at least 40% of the provinces of that culture and at least 50% of these provinces should be state religion and nationalism free.
4. There is a cap of 4 cultures per nation, and 2 cultures gained in such a way.
other conditions...?
Should we leave the monarch lists alone? I guess RP every marriage and randomizing the offspring would be too tedious.
Before continuing the discussion further, I'd like to suggest we get a dedicated forum for this.
If BiB doesn't agree that one is warranted here, I've talked to KAP over at kapland and he said he'd create a forum for us.
Would make discussing different points aswell as new events easier.
If BiB doesn't agree that one is warranted here, I've talked to KAP over at kapland and he said he'd create a forum for us.
Would make discussing different points aswell as new events easier.
I'd vote for 3, but could live with 1 or 4 too
I like Steins ideas on this.
I think it might be too much really to change the monarch lists too, unless it would be as easy (?!?) to generate monarchs for a session as it would be to create leaders. I have no idea of the programing random leaders and/or monarchs would need, but for a total programin-disable person like me it'd look like it woudn't be that much harder to generate random monarchs with a similar program that generates random leaders. RPing or not marriages as such shouldn't necessary change the siblings outcoming from any given marriage, it's pretty damn hard to say what kind of a ruler a person is going to be just by looking at his/her parents (is the supposed father even the father of the heir, what sort of teaching does the heir get, is the heir a total egoist and narcist or does he/she value other people opinions too or is he/she totally dependent on them etc etc).
But as said, maybe too much is too much, it just looks to me youl'd use basically the same sort of randomiser for a leader and monarch (and again, sorry if I am way wrong on this assumption).
Btw, if there's going to be a new forum for this, please announce it in this thread too, so that stupid people like me would also be able to follow the thread there
Could this be an event for the Pope with various options? Is the ToT hardcoded for Spain and Portugal? I think it is in which case we're stuck with it and should probably leave it as 1.
You mean like this?
Code:
[COLOR=white]event = {
id = xxxx
name = "Reformation"
desc = "blablabla"
random = NO
country = PAP
date = { year = 1510 }
offset = 7200
deathdate = { year = 1530 }
action_a = {
name = "Continue"
command = { type = flag which = 1 }
command = { type = treasury value = 500 }
}
action_b = {
name = "cease selling of indulgences"
command = { type = treasury value = -500 }
command = { type = domestic which = INNOVATIVE value = 3 }
command = { type = sleepevent which = yyyy } #calvin
command = { type = sleepevent which = zzzz } #counter-reformation
command = { type = losemanufactory which = -1 }
command = { type = losemanufactory which = -1 }
command = { type = revolt which = -2 }
command = { type = revolt which = -2 }
command = { type = stability value = -5 }
}
}[/COLOR]
Last edited:
Sorry for rushing in
In theory I think it wouldn't be bad to have no events at all and let everything evolve within the game engine. HOWEVER that would require that all important things that happened historically can happen the way they did in EU2. That doesn't mean I think historical events should always happen, but that things likethe historical events should be possible to happen, i.e. inheritances (that are certainly not the same thing as diplo-annexations; for starters: it was not necessary to have the respective nation as vassal before), gaining of claims or nations falling apart after one battle (like Delhi and the Mameluks). As long as the EU2 engine is still limited in some aspects, these things need to have events.
That said, it could be great to have a system of a lot more flexible historical events.
In theory I think it wouldn't be bad to have no events at all and let everything evolve within the game engine. HOWEVER that would require that all important things that happened historically can happen the way they did in EU2. That doesn't mean I think historical events should always happen, but that things likethe historical events should be possible to happen, i.e. inheritances (that are certainly not the same thing as diplo-annexations; for starters: it was not necessary to have the respective nation as vassal before
), gaining of claims or nations falling apart after one battle (like Delhi and the Mameluks). As long as the EU2 engine is still limited in some aspects, these things need to have events.That said, it could be great to have a system of a lot more flexible historical events.
I forgot to put up the "Whiners and Pessimists, Leave your doubts at the door" sign.
I dont see how getting random monarchs would be so hard..
heck.. i get me some dice..
throw 2 dice for a given skill (and count one for half points) making a max of 9 skill (6 + 0.5*6=9 for the mathematically challenged) and an average skill of 5.25.. this could of course be altered by for example DP sliders (innovative gives more admin or whatever)
and something like 10 dice (8?) for the lifespan
heck.. i get me some dice..
throw 2 dice for a given skill (and count one for half points) making a max of 9 skill (6 + 0.5*6=9 for the mathematically challenged
) and an average skill of 5.25.. this could of course be altered by for example DP sliders (innovative gives more admin or whatever)and something like 10 dice (8?) for the lifespan
Exactly what I thought too, but I don't know how hard that would be to program
However, I'd throw the lifespan with 10 dice and all '5':s and '6':s are ignored, which would give a possible reign between 0-40 years, with basically all reigns lasting between 15-25 years (but still the occasional ruler would end ruling just a few years while another would rule for 35 years). I don't know about programing a crap, but I've been rolling dice for over 30 years
The randomization isn't the problem. The RP is.
Creating new leaders is simple. You just put "Wallenstein" or "Rosenbeef" in there and slap stats on him.
With monarchs comes dynasties and a whole lot more complicated mess.
Creating new leaders is simple. You just put "Wallenstein" or "Rosenbeef" in there and slap stats on him.
With monarchs comes dynasties and a whole lot more complicated mess.
