The future of EU4 and Paradox games, a schism?

[BarrosRodrigues]

Not really? I'd consider a "successful" game to be when you reach the historical borders of your nation. Anything above that is gravy.

Wonderful, I am glad for you! Wouldn’t it be much simpler for the designers if everyone had the same preferences/taste?
FYY a successful game for me is when I am having fun playing a game that I like, the way I like and that was pleasant and “rewarding” before nationalism was in-game. Nationalism turned the way that I like to play the game into a click fest nightmare without adding anything good or plausible to the game, it did not make the game harder only tedious so my solution will most likely be to stop playing it unless these issues are addressed.

 

[Arilou]

Wonderful, I am glad for you! Wouldn’t it be much simpler for the designers if everyone had the same preferences/taste?
FYY a successful game for me is when I am having fun playing a game that I like, the way I like and that was pleasant and “rewarding” before nationalism was in-game. Nationalism turned the way that I like to play the game into a click fest nightmare without adding anything good or plausible to the game, it did not make the game harder only tedious so my solution will most likely be to stop playing it unless these issues are addressed.

Nationalism has been in the game since EU2 at least (I never did play EU1)

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

I don't understand how EU4 is more micro intensive. I think what you mean is it's much more in depth than HOI3 on AI control. HOI3 on AI control ruins the already limited aspects of the game thus it is a limited in depth game, but off AI control it is easily as bad with all the micromanagement.

No EU IV right now is much more micro intensive (mostly) due to the arcade rebellions mostly related to Nationalism and revolt size scaling with OE; EU IV is shallow by comparison with HOI III regardless of automation. Automation does not decrease the depth of HOI III it only helps the player to reduce the amount of clicking needed to for example invade the Soviet Union or deal will pesky underground resistance partisans or nationalism rebels.

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

Nationalism has been in the game since EU2 at least (I never did play EU1)

For 30 years?? Not in EU IV!

 

[Sgt.Pepper1947]

No EU IV right now is much more micro intensive due to the arcade rebellions mostly related to Nationalism and revolt size scaling with OE; EU IV is shallow by comparison with HOI III regardless of automation. Automation does not decrease the depth of HOI III it only helps the player to reduce the amounts of clicking needed to for example invade the Soviet Union or deal will pesky underground resistance partisans or nationalism rebels.

I honestly think this problem is attributed to the player. I mean there are several ways to expand and keep OE and rebels relatively low, although I agree that rebels should be fixed in EU4.

 

[Trunting]

I think, the most problematic aspect of EU IV is the focus on expansion, which means, that you've got barely anyhing to do regarding realm management. Of course, you can build stuff, convert provinces etc., but the building system is really pale in comparison to the other aspects of the game. This game needs something like a cultural victory as it is possible in the Civ series.

 

[Sgt.Pepper1947]

I think, the most problematic aspect of EU IV is the focus on expansion, which means, that you've got barely anyhing to do regarding realm management. Of course, you can build stuff, convert provinces etc., but the building system is really pale in comparison to the other aspects of the game. This game needs something like a cultural victory as it is possible in the Civ series.

I'm pretty sure that's both blasphemy and sacrilege.

 

[1alexey]

For 30 years?? Not in EU IV!

for "just" 50 years in EU3.
:happy:

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

I honestly think this problem attributed to the player. I mean there are several ways to expand and keep OE and rebels relatively low, although I agree that rebels should be fixed in EU4.

No it is not a player related problem, it is a problem related with a poorly tested and implemented mechanic. Even non grand strategy titles have ways to avoid rebellions in recently conquered territories like tax exemptions, reduced taxes, etc. but not in EU IV! In EU IV you have to wait for the provinces to revolt, rebels to take all of their former country then accept demands, harsh treat everything (therefore fall behind in tech and ideas) and since this is not enough because of reasons (minimum revolt risk comes to mind), OP 40k stacks will still pop up ad eternum especially in provinces with non-accepted religion/culture; in short the only sensible thing to do right now is to accept demands ad eternum or stop playing.

 

[zodium]

No it is not a player related problem, it is a problem related with a poorly tested and implemented mechanic. Even non grand strategy titles have ways to avoid rebellions in recently conquered territories like tax exemptions, reduced taxes, etc. but not in EU IV! In EU you have to wait for the provinces to revolt, rebels to take all of their former country then accept demands, harsh treat everything (therefore fall behind in tech and ideas) and since this is not enough because of reasons (minimum revolt risk comes to mind), 40k stacks will still pop up ad eternum especially in provinces with non-accepted religion/culture; in short the only sensible thing to do right now is to accept demands or stop playing.

Good thing they just announced they're reworking the revolt system then, you s...pectacular person.

 

[Sgt.Pepper1947]

No it is not a player related problem, it is a problem related with a poorly tested and implemented mechanic. Even non grand strategy titles have ways to avoid rebellions in recently conquered territories like tax exemptions, reduced taxes, etc. but not in EU IV! In EU IV you have to wait for the provinces to revolt, rebels to take all of their former country then accept demands, harsh treat everything (therefore fall behind in tech and ideas) and since this is not enough because of reasons (minimum revolt risk comes to mind), 40k stacks will still pop up ad eternum especially in provinces with non-accepted religion/culture; in short the only sensible thing to do right now is to accept demands ad eternum or stop playing.

Does this happen in all your games? You seem really fired up toward the rebel mechanic in EU4, I mean the game isn't fundamentally broken because there are many players who can manege EU4.

 

[blackchoas]

I think, the most problematic aspect of EU IV is the focus on expansion, which means, that you've got barely anyhing to do regarding realm management. Of course, you can build stuff, convert provinces etc., but the building system is really pale in comparison to the other aspects of the game. This game needs something like a cultural victory as it is possible in the Civ series.

Cultural victory is a silly thing to suggest as very few campaigns are played to "victory" frankly I would disagree with using that term in general with this game as we end up in question of what is victory and what isn't. Is the only current victory world conquest?

However I'm glad you bring up Civ because I think there is a fair bit to be learned from Civ. In Civ games it is possible to build a tall empire as it were, 3-4 cities built high, as opposed to building a wide empire getting lots of cities and territory. In EU4 building tall is a complete unrealistic possibility, you can try to do this via trade, and can do an ok job at it but generally your too low force limit and manpower will lead to you getting destroyed by one of the large blobbing empires when they inevitably turn their sights on you cause even the AI only wants to expand and nothing else

 

[Trunting]

I'm pretty sure that's both blasphemy and sacrilege.

Nope, EU should see peaceful ways to win the game, at least something like building.

 

[Arilou]

No it is not a player related problem, it is a problem related with a poorly tested and implemented mechanic. Even non grand strategy titles have ways to avoid rebellions in recently conquered territories like tax exemptions, reduced taxes, etc. but not in EU IV! In EU IV you have to wait for the provinces to revolt, rebels to take all of their former country then accept demands, harsh treat everything (therefore fall behind in tech and ideas) and since this is not enough because of reasons (minimum revolt risk comes to mind), OP 40k stacks will still pop up ad eternum especially in provinces with non-accepted religion/culture; in short the only sensible thing to do right now is to accept demands ad eternum or stop playing.

Oh, child, you obviously don't remember the White Lotus rebellion in EU2. 40% revoltrisk in every province, ahh... Good times.

 

[Sgt.Pepper1947]

Oh, child, you obviously don't remember the White Lotus rebellion in EU2. 40% revoltrisk in every province, ahh... Good times.

Well to fair EU2 is over a decade old, so nobody would care or know the specifics.

 

[Arilou]

Well to fair EU2 is over a decade old, so nobody would care or know the specifics.

You got the Qing afterwards with their pretty good rulers though. It was worth it.

Not as fun as the Disintegration of the TImurid Empire (where you got a kickass general and shit afterwards) but still nice. My first time making it through the Timurids and forming the Mughals remains one of my fondest EU memories...

 

[LiberiusX]

I haven't bought a single DLC for EUIV and I don't intend to anytime soon. Maybe, just maybe, when they are done 'developing' this game I will buy them in the bargain bin.

But yes, I shudder to think about what Vicky 3 could/would possibly entail. Vicky 2 has its minor problems, but(with PoD) it is quite simply the best grand strategy game I've ever played. It's also the only Paradox game in which I've actually played a game to completion. In EUIII, EUIV and CKII I always seem to hit a brick wall in which I know I've won decades/centuries before the game is over. Vicky 2 has so many paradigm shifts to its gameplay that I remain entertained well into the 1930s and often find myself wishing the game could proceed.

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

Good thing they just announced they're reworking the revolt system then, you s...pectacular person.

I guess you missed this, here I will increase it for you because you seem to b...ind

I am sincerely hoping that the new expansion fixes these issues

Oh, child, you obviously don't remember the White Lotus rebellion in EU2. 40% revoltrisk in every province, ahh... Good times.

I never played EU II in my life and never ever call me a child again.





Edit: Is it me or people can´t express their opinions without being harassed in the forum? I am out

 

[Sgt.Pepper1947]

I think your definition of harassed is skewed. Some just give suggestions, others inform and some argue.

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

I think your definition of harassed is skewed. Some just gives suggestions, others inform and some argue.

Using expressions like "spectacular person" in an obviously sarcastic way or calling people a child? Is this not harassment? Well it is in my book, anyway I have more productive things to do right now