Thats mostly because US prices do not include sales tax while EU prices includes VAT though
The DLC I'd pay a LOT for (like $10.00)
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Thats mostly because US prices do not include sales tax while EU prices includes VAT though
Three years ago the dev team where ~8 people, soon we are 22. More resources are spent on QA both internally and externally etc.
Of course not as we don't develop game by randomly do stuff until a point where we think the game is finished and than tally up a bill to see what it cost to produce. It starts with the price at $39.99 and a guesstimate on how many copies we think we'll sell and those two factors combined than determines how much time/money/manpower/features we have to play around with.
If adding more events would have caused us to go over schedule/budget, than yes, which is exactly why we don't do that.
They day we start doing that on a regular basis we won't be around anymore.
This image is false. CKII has more stuff then CK1. Civ 4 has more stuff then Civ 3. Sim City 4 has way more stuff then Sim City 3.Agreed.
Dumb picture debunked.
This thread makes me sad. Paradox is upfront and refeshingly honest, they are listening to us and is everything gamers have asked for. And yet they are mistrusted and treated like they were some evil corporate money stealing badasses. They deserve better. I won't buy cosmetics. Others want it. Paradox sells it to those who wants it. Everyone is (should be) happy.
That image had nothing to do with sequels. You are confusing its purpose. It's a joke about how DLCs pretty much (but not quite completely yet) removed the terrific game concept that was expansion packs from the market without really introducing the same level of playability those had.
Judging from the current situation in the gaming industry, the NOW image is already old. But I don't know how Day-1 DLCs could be represented in there.
In any case it's a joke and a pertinent one. You don't need to be offended or pretend you can debunk one of the most controversial aspects of modern gaming (DLCs) in 30 words.
I'm going to bed after this...
That's good, but what I was getting at was that some of the money Paradox makes almost certainly goes to people/entities that don't contribute to the making of the game.
Again right. But you factor into that how much you want to make in profit too so there is leeway in development costs and pricepoints. IIRC HoI3 was only going to have 3 patches but you made 4 and that cost you money. I'll bet HoI3 was still profitable but you spent a little more on the community to get a better game and we thank you for that. I like how you said it starts with the price BTW because again, obviously if you go slightly over budget and make $0.10 less per game by including Mongol faces you obviously aren't going to change the price.
If you added a ton of events it might have, but I said one. I'm saying there is flexibility to what you can put in a game and what that game costs for the consumer... it's all rough. You can make $10 per game sold on one title and $9 per game sold on another. What is in flux when a budget is altered or poorly estimated is your profits or even losses, not the final price (though it can change in extreme circumstances but it is extraordinarily rare).
Well that is definitely true but you can theoretically do it if you have future knowledge of exactly how many games you would sell. You wouldn't have made any money so for your next game you'd have to get money from a very irresponsible lender and pay interest which would factor into the $39.98 development cost but a business could run like that with no profits or losses.
You know what this thread ultimately reminds me of? I was about 14, and I walked into the local video game store. Someone was trying to sell their used copy of a video game, and was dumbfounded that the owner wanted to pay them less than what the owner would then charge for that game.
I agree.
A bit of cynical behavior towards corporations, large or small, is an asset. You do well exercising it, for your own sake as a customer. It's a basic principle of a free market and helps put pressure towards quality of products and services at the lowest possible cost for us. The fact the gaming industry has benefited from an attitude of loyalism (as if sports teams they were) is potentially damaging to us customers.
That said, I don't see cause for some of the criticism towards Paradox. As you say they almost always have been upfront and decent in their relationship with their customers. Definitely they have been developing superior titles like no one else in their niche genre and producing very interesting titles developed by others. But personally, I prefer to stay always on my toes. And never, unless facing some shockingly unjust offense, actively support a game development company. My contract with a game development company starts and ends with the money transaction we undergo to purchase their titles.
This is where I disagree. I was actually very happy to see the two DLCs already released as simple cosmetic content. What I fear aren't DLCs that extend the game experience, but DLCs that change it. Because then I will be indeed forced to buy them and have the nagging feeling I'm being ripped off. Not because of one or two DLCs, of course. But because, collectively DLCs tend to be more expensive than expansion packs that could aggregate all these changes.
In fact, DLCs were initially thought out as being exactly just added content unessential to the gameplay. So, if I see Paradox launching a DLC to play the Sunni, I'll be annoyed. Then another DLC to play the Pagans, I'll be even more annoyed. Then another DLC to play ecclesiastical rulers, I'll become mad, etc. Because I know that the game can potentially double my initial investment. I will also have to have all these DLCs if I want to host or join any potential multiplayer game.
I'm a sucker for cosmetics. So I'm also spending money there (or will when I can, as is the unfortunate case right now). So, some games can be real money draining devices on an already thin wallet.
@leggbros the lst time they forgot there budget was HOI3, we all know how that turned out
No, this picture is legit, but mostly for other games, Paradox have always had good quality of their games and support modders.
What do you say about Mass Effect who will come out with a DLC just after a few days after the game gets released? It happend for Creative Assembly too, Im quite sure Dragon Age 2 had similiar thing, I guess it is because EA has always been greedy.
Well i take your quote to add something personal to the discussion.
Actually i miss people with blond hair (especially women
) - i must say that i was so busy with other aspects of the game...that i never looked/caredmuch for portraits.
But today i notice : That all people (99%) have black hair - even people from sweden,denmark - "north germanic races"
I don't know why it's not in the game...maybe they forgot it simply.
Now just an imagination
If now a DLC shows up that adds blond hair to the game and maybe some more faces...i am honest : i'll buy it. (i have unused bluecoins on GG)
On the other side i ask myself - if they REALLY would sell a blond hair DLC
Should i not be ashamed of myself to be degenerated to just a weak willed computer DLC Buyer
The game is great...but so great that ill buy stuff that ususally should be in "for free"....
With other words something that is so great...maybe sometimes is better to be deleted ?!
Well at the moment i simply assume that they just forgot to add blond hair to the game...sigh
True (even though sales tax is applicable in some states of the US, it doesn't normally exceed 1-2%, vis-a-vis the huge VAT in the EU) but I'm not sure if that's the reason. Not talking about Paradox specifically here but most of the time I check out prices of digitally downloadable versions of games, it's the exact same number of currency units from USD, through EUR to GBP. And GBP > EUR. Also, I remember instances of games costing the same number of CAD (Canadian dollars) as USD as a courtesy to players from Canada by the American developer/publisher.
+1
The DLC name is cursed thanks to other companies, it has a such of negative thanks to the other companies. Paradox should name it to something else and im sure it will be fewer posts hehe.
Maybe they should just change the name of the term to DS - Downloadable Stuff.
Somehow I don't think that would change anything.
Somehow I don't think that would change anything.
Now, look. I am as capitalist as it gets here, but ripping off someone means that you tricked him into making a bad financial decision usually by flash.
And yes, that 25 euro mount WAS ripping off. I bought a 6-month developed game for 20 dollars (you might have heard of it, it is called a house divided) and I am supposed to pay 35 for a sparkling pony?
Whoever paid it, and that includes you, I am afraid, was ripped off badly and I feel sad about blizzard doing that.
I disagree heavily with the DLC policy. Want to be paid for hard work? Sure! I want to pay you too. Make the little dlc's all in a package and call it an expansion! Then sell it for 20-30 dollars.
Now, you might say, why not release all the DLC's separately and pick what you like for less of a price? And that is a very good question! The problem with it, of course, is that companies historically get side tracked by that and degrade their games so they can sell dlc fixes and that is NOT moral behavior towards your customers.
Now, by NO means I am saying paradox is doing that, but I would be very very sad if it did. Exactly how I am very sad the bioware started doing it, or blizzard more lately.
So to conclude, as long as paradox shows restraint on what should be free (eg, adding a new nation like babylon in vicky2) and what should possibly be paid (expanding and unlocking Muslims, and not simply unlocking which can be done with 1 min of modding) it should be fine.
Can paradox do it? I would be very sad if they don't and, honestly, I would not even chose to make them pass through this trial since how many failed to pass it. I would prefer to stick to the good ole "buy the whole thing and if you don't like a part of it, don't use it" model.
You mean the old "don't get five new features because there's one you really dislike"-model. :ninja:
Regardless of the actual value of sales taxes, they are not included in the price of products in the US, but calculated during the transaction (hence the well-documented confusion of Europeans when they come here). Since sales tax doesn't apply to online purchases in the US, it works out.
Thanks to Paradox for developing a game that is great on its own, and allowing those who want to add some flare and visional perks they can buy it. This is a great company and here is my 2 cents.