The CK2 To EU3 Converter Project

[Idhrendur]

I don't know how easy this would be to code as an algorithm but I did it by had with this approach:

1) Determine the correct owner of all provinces and identify them by their primary CK2 holding.
2) All rulers with EU3 tags equivalent to CK2 tags are assigned. If more than one ruler could be assigned the same tag (e.g. King of Burgundy and Duke of Burgundy are the primary titles of different people), the owner of the highest CK title is assigned. If one ruler has more than one EU3 tag among his CK2 titles, the first of his titles is the one he is assigned. Note that some of these rulers are vassals and the vassal relationship should be retained (except for HRE vassals)
3) All other realms, the Holy Roman Emperor, and the HRE's direct vassals are assigned the best remaining available tags in order of priority:
i) the Eu3 country containing the CK2 ruler's capital historically (base on 1399 or 1453, perhaps)
ii) an EU3 country with core on the CK2 ruler's capital in 1399
iii) an EU3 country with same/similar culture
iv) a country with the same religion in the same region
4) All vassals (except direct HRE vassals) that didn't have perfectly appropriate EU3 tags, were given their realm ruler's tag.

I was able to get almost all the countries in my game assigned that way and only had to pull out-of-region or religiously inappropriate tags for a few rulers. I created the vassals based on having available tags rather than crown authority or relationship because it was easy. On the plus side, it means the vassal tags all make sense, but it does mean that countries like France tend to devolve into a ton of vassals, while the Scandinavian countries and England tend to remain as big blocks. If you want to honor the crown authority in the CK game, it might make more sense to create all the realms first and then create vassals only for countries with lower crown authorities, using the same sort of prioritization to assign tags.

Note that merging of personal unions, determining which empire (if any) converts as the HRE, and the absorption of vassals (as in your step #4) will be handled before we start mapping tags to titles, and the exact mechanics involved are still under discussion.

With that out of the way…
1) Done. Well, more or less. See, we figure out all the titles and relationships (the rulers aren't even involved at this step), and we also map all the CK2 counties to EU3 provinces. When you put those data together…
2) Easily enough done via the mapping rules.
3iii) Likewise
3i & 3ii) An interesting idea. I might just borrow it when I get to the point I'm working on updating those mechanics.
3iii) While we could do this based on default EU3 culture/religion, I don't think it's necessary. Regional connections would handle everything we gain from trying this, and Iberia as a region implies that it could cause us to skip good possibilities for alternate tags.

magritte2's post gave me an idea. What if two or three extra tags for each region were thrown into EU3 to be assigned to CK2 tags that don't have an EU3 equivalent? For example, if some independent county in western Europe still exists at the end of a CK2 campaign, but there is no equivalent EU3 tag, instead of giving it some off the wall, out of region leftover tag from asia or something, you'd have a backup tag for that region that, historically, would've at least been in the same ballpark? Just thinking out loud.

Not a bad idea for the converter mod. In the end though, we want to allow people to not use the mod if they don't want to, so we have to have mechanics that work even otherwise.

 

[Arcvalons]

Would you be able to create a tag for any possible duchy, with independent counties merging with their de-jure duchy?

 

[Kalelovil]

I'm in favour of just having the converter generate its own custom mod specific to the save game used as input, which is then placed in the EU3 mod folder. It would cut down on the amount of work needed significantly compared to designing a solution compromised by vanilla EU3's constraints in parallel.
Using mods in EU3: DW has been made easier and more fool-proof compared to earlier Paradox games, and I doubt a significant number of people willing to use an unofficial work-in-progress converter tool/mod would be averse to mods in general.

 

[Fdurke]

I'm in favour of just having the converter generate its own custom mod specific to the save game used as input, which is then placed in the EU3 mod folder. It would cut down on the amount of work needed significantly compared to designing a solution compromised by vanilla EU3's constraints in parallel.
Using mods in CK2 has been made easier and more fool-proof compared to earlier Paradox games, and I doubt a significant number of people willing to use an unofficial work-in-progress converter tool/mod would be averse to mods in general.

This would be the best thing I thinks.

 

[PyroAce2]

I'm in favour of just having the converter generate its own custom mod specific to the save game used as input, which is then placed in the EU3 mod folder. It would cut down on the amount of work needed significantly compared to designing a solution compromised by vanilla EU3's constraints in parallel.
Using mods in CK2 has been made easier and more fool-proof compared to earlier Paradox games, and I doubt a significant number of people willing to use an unofficial work-in-progress converter tool/mod would be averse to mods in general.

That would be nice. I really don't want to pick up an EU3 game with randomly assigned country names just because appropriate tags didn't exist in EU3 for some of the ahistorical outcomes that CK2 produces. If I wanted to play on a random looking EU3 map, I'd just use the random map generator they've got already for that game. That might also improve compatibility with CK2 mods that add new kingdoms, since the converter could just pull the kingdom name from the localization files and move forward from there.

 

[Arcvalons]

I'm in favour of just having the converter generate its own custom mod specific to the save game used as input, which is then placed in the EU3 mod folder. It would cut down on the amount of work needed significantly compared to designing a solution compromised by vanilla EU3's constraints in parallel.
Using mods in CK2 has been made easier and more fool-proof compared to earlier Paradox games, and I doubt a significant number of people willing to use an unofficial work-in-progress converter tool/mod would be averse to mods in general.

That's actually a great idea, I support it too.

 

[GreyHuge]

I'm in favour of just having the converter generate its own custom mod specific to the save game used as input, which is then placed in the EU3 mod folder. It would cut down on the amount of work needed significantly compared to designing a solution compromised by vanilla EU3's constraints in parallel.
Using mods in CK2 has been made easier and more fool-proof compared to earlier Paradox games, and I doubt a significant number of people willing to use an unofficial work-in-progress converter tool/mod would be averse to mods in general.

Except, the mod wouldn't be for CK2, it would be for EU3. We will be having a mod generator, but first we need to be able to reliably produce a functional save. Babysteps.

Also Idhrendur, your Paradox inbox is full.

 

[Kalelovil]

Except, the mod wouldn't be for CK2, it would be for EU3. We will be having a mod generator, but first we need to be able to reliably produce a functional save. Babysteps.

I've corrected that detail. EU3: Divine Wind has a working mod folder and launcher IIRC so the same applies.

I agree that the project should move forward one step at a time, but by planning ahead hopefully unnecessary duplication can be avoided when that stage is reached.

 

[Idhrendur]

So it was. I've now cleaned it out.

 

[herbe]

hi i got this in my log file when testing to convert

Reading configuration file.
12-08-01 09:19:03: No input file given, defaulting to input.ck2
12-08-01 09:19:03: Getting CK2 data.
12-08-01 09:19:03: Parsing CK2 save.
12-08-01 09:19:03: Error: Could not open input.ck2

steam installed on both CK2 and EU3 DW i have the 00_traits.tex in the CK2 folder in my steam folder

i have been reading abute the empire and i think it should be abute how the succession laws is insted of crown authority and thats allso the diffrent between the empires IRL HRE was elective the rest was inhereted one way or the other, if you think scandinavia is the same as kalmar unionen then that one to was elective to and in eu 3 sweden norway and denmark start as a union, (finland was a part of the swed crown and was inhereted with it) it should be the same with kingcrownes to with means that if england is elective in the end of the CK2 game then you have a union of the dukes in the biggining of EU3 but if you on the other hand manege to get the succession laws up in HRE then you have a super blob in eu3 the crown authority can be the slider centralisation/desentralisation low crown authority=more desentralisation

 

[herbe]

after re-install the converter and doing everything agen it worked think i did somthing wrong in the configuration=) in my saved file i hold byzantine and scandinavia empires with ended in a split of them two byzan holding half of finland and ramazan(think its scandinavia) hold some provinses in grecce but thats one easy fix i only destroy one of them and re-save =p

 

[Idhrendur]

The exact method by which we determine which nations convert is still undetermined. The current method is blobification, though in the future we might also merge some titles held by the same person.

In the end, we're going to have some amount of vassals be independent, though the exact amount and the rules we use to determine which ones are…contentious. Well, as contentious as we tend to get around here.

 

[Arcvalons]

Ideally, if one holds more than one King title, that would translate to personal union in EU3. But for example, if the King of France has taken Frisia and Lothairingia buthasn't created titles, then all of it should end up France's in EU3.

Also using Crown Authority? Though I'm afraid it'd still result in a blob HRE in EU3.

 

[magritte2]

What are you planning to do about inheritances in the converter? Can you import all the CK2 heirs as "heirs to the throne" for EU3, or is there going to be a problem with designating the ruler of one country the heir to another?

 

[Idhrendur]

Ideally, if one holds more than one King title, that would translate to personal union in EU3. But for example, if the King of France has taken Frisia and Lothairingia buthasn't created titles, then all of it should end up France's in EU3.

If the titles haven't been created, then all the duchies would be considered vassals of the Kingdom of France by CK2, so it's what we have to work with. If other Kingdom titles have been created, we just go with how the vassalages go (which is straightforward in version 1.05 and onward, but sometimes strange pre-1.05).

Also using Crown Authority? Though I'm afraid it'd still result in a blob HRE in EU3.

That's the most-agreed upon idea. I've some others I'd like to add, but the other analyst-types aren't convinced, and it's awhile before we get to the point we have to decide. Base tax and manpower and population are more pertinent at the moment. :-D

 

[Idhrendur]

What are you planning to do about inheritances in the converter? Can you import all the CK2 heirs as "heirs to the throne" for EU3, or is there going to be a problem with designating the ruler of one country the heir to another?

Nope, EU3 only allows one heir. So the primary heir for a given title becomes the EU3 heir. That is all converted right now (though there may be a bug with gavelkind and open/turkish succession)

 

[Emre Yigit]

Ideally, if one holds more than one King title, that would translate to personal union in EU3. But for example, if the King of France has taken Frisia and Lothairingia buthasn't created titles, then all of it should end up France's in EU3.

Also using Crown Authority? Though I'm afraid it'd still result in a blob HRE in EU3.

For the first, I'm not so sure. What happens if you're King of France and have become, say, King of Andalusia via a Crusade? Should that be a personal union?

 

[Idhrendur]

Right, I've got all the fixes for 1.06 committed. These are looking through all the files in the traits directory, looking through all the files in the dynasties directory (which solves the crash people were having), and providing some updated mappings for the new map areas.

For that last bit, I've done something clever. We've always had the mapping rules surrounded by a curly-brace block that was simply listed as 'mapping'. Well, now there are multiple of those blocks, with version numbers (similar to those at the top of the saves, 'v1.05', for instance) instead. If a save is from an earlier version of CK2 than a block identifies itself, the converter skips that block. Thanks to CK2's simplified versioning system, we can contain multiple mappings in one file, and only have to add the changes for any future versions.

Edit: A rule in an earlier block will block rules in later blocks. But only going from the EU3 parts of the rules. So, if you have

v1.06={
link = { ck2 = 1 eu3 = 1 }
}
v1.05={
link = { ck2 = 1 ck2 = 2 eu3 = 1 eu3 = 2 }
}

then the eu3 province two would still map to ck2 provinces one and two for a version 1.06 save, not just province one.


dtremenak, you mentioned awhile back you had some changes for the new map. Can you commit those, but using this new file format? I don't fully trust my quick-n-dirty mappings. Also, can you find a way to update your tool to support this?

 

[herbe]

personal union is a hard nut to crack at the same time you dont want to bigg blobes to go to the next game but at the same time if i have criated the kingdom of finland as sweden at say 1080 way would it consider it to be something ellse then a part of sweden in the year 1400 it have allways been that way ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_union
some of the unions is gamewise one other are unions and some says union after they sucseeded with a rebelion and clamed independence.....
might one event in the biggining of the game where the kings (if not you) can deside independence in a unoin or part of the motherland depends on what they feals abute you..?

 

[binTravkin]

A converter that converts to an EU3 "mod" would be useless for those who use converters to go through several or even all of the Paradox games.
The "grand games" are the most visible use of these converters as they often make very popular AARs.

I am myself looking for a CK2->EU3W->Vic2->HoI3 converted game and am hoping this converter will be useful for that.