Targeted Melee Strikes

[kpipersburg]

Simply add the ability to choose where to hit on the enemy mech with melee. The randomness is kind of odd given that you are literally punching the other mech. The randomness is also annoying since you could punch a leg with no armor, but your mech punches the fully armored center torso instead.

P.S. Melee weapons would be nice too. (weapon variety in general would be nice tbh)

 

[Dizzy_XC]

I think they dumbed down the melee attacking part from TT. Forgive me, it's been years, but I think you had the choice to either attack with a punch or kick. Depending on whether or not you and your enemy were on the same level, and considering facing, that choice was hugely consequential. Obviously in the simgame, I'd rather have the choice to punch or kick depending on what I was hoping to hit. If the choice came down to hitting a Hunchback's AC20 armor damaged RT as opposed to kicking an undamaged armored leg, in the TT, you'd know exactly which to chose. But here we dont get that choice.

What about targeted melee attacks?

 

[Darrious Quinn]

Randomness is part of the combat mechanic. Without it.... you have a turn based version of MWO where everyone just aims for the legs.
The random hit locations keeps things in check. Called shots while a mech is on its back is bad enough and aimed melee would allow an undesirable meta and player behavior. It would be all about who can close faster, kneecap your heaviest mech and keep moving.

I wouldn't mind seeing melee weapons at some point though maybe as a mech mod (like current leg and arm mods in game now), BUT.... besides specific mechs like the Axeman, most melee weapons were just the lost limbs of other mechs that combatants picked up off the ground... which just sounds like a programing nightmare.

 

[Dizzy_XC]

Alright, so because of another game, that's why melee was dumbed down here and you are not allowed to chose between kick and punch?

 

[Toadbat]

I think the meta could be mitigated by using moral abilities like with targeted ranged strikes. Also, you might think that everyone would choose "Kick" over "Punch/Headbutt" however, I think it would be highly situational. Legs have a good amount of armor and the receiving mech can kick back, which puts the kicker in jeopardy.
So, if when melee attacking you had to burn moral in order to choose the upper or lower half of the target I believe that might work out. It'd need to be balance tested of course.

 

[Dayman107]

I've always loved the TT rules that said you could pick up an arm that was destroyed, and use it as a club. I'd love to see that rule back in the game.

Also, in the TT rules, weapons had increased damage, as did destroyed limb-clubs.

 

[Dizzy_XC]

I've always loved the TT rules that said you could pick up an arm that was destroyed, and use it as a club.

That would be something... Can you imagine a light mech struggling to hit another mech over the head with an Atlas leg? Too funny.

 

[Havamal]

If it was an option to kick or punch, I would indeed leg almost every time, just like it TT.

With the added bonus that everyone running customs keeps their ammo down there.

The legging meta would be boring within a week IMHO.
Going to a generic melee was IMHO a better balance move, though I do miss full charge rules.

TT Charging would give a little oomph the the venerable Locust, ect. Though displacement creates potential map issues.

 

[Havamal]

I think the meta could be mitigated by using moral abilities like with targeted ranged strikes. Also, you might think that everyone would choose "Kick" over "Punch/Headbutt" however, I think it would be highly situational. Legs have a good amount of armor and the receiving mech can kick back, which puts the kicker in jeopardy.
So, if when melee attacking you had to burn moral in order to choose the upper or lower half of the target I believe that might work out. It'd need to be balance tested of course.

On a side note, we might ask them: as my fugitive and faulty old man memory wants to say they did prototype a high/low attack skill at one point with it being too exploit cheesable.
I could be wrong on that though...

 

[Dizzy_XC]

I think it'd be a great idea to tie in melee choice of kick or punch to the morale system. What about you?

 

[Dizzy_XC]

I dont remember the charging TT rules. But charging does more damage the faster you go? It displaces your enemy in their hex? OMG I want to charge an assault mech off a cliff with a Locust! Yeah, so if there's not a move space to displace, you dont. Simple. Also be nice if we had ragdoll physics with mechs. I want to see em slide down the hill after falling!

 

[kpipersburg]

I agree that it should be morale based to choose where to strike. They could also (if they ever let the skill trees go higher in lvl) add to the guts tree the melee morale strike (to keep it locked behind specific pilots) and a passive ability to have a % chance to counterstrike melee attacks. It would, IMO, make melee risky and rewarding to have a chance to knockout enemies and, if they fail, to be able to turn the tables.

 

[kpipersburg]

Also, I don't MP at all yet. How is there not a kneecapping meta already? Only 2 really exploitable strats atm from what I can tell in SP, jumping behind an enemy and opening their ct like a can, or kneecapping them and blasting them open with the precise strikes on the ground. Or do people just run around with LRMs and AC's blasting away at each other from range? *rolls eyes*

 

[JAMMINxw]

Also, I don't MP at all yet. How is there not a kneecapping meta already? Only 2 really exploitable strats atm from what I can tell in SP, jumping behind an enemy and opening their ct like a can, or kneecapping them and blasting them open with the precise strikes on the ground. Or do people just run around with LRMs and AC's blasting away at each other from range? *rolls eyes*

MP meta is jumpjet+brace into SRM range then injury fish + knockdown until pilot death, with an occasional support piece or two sprinkled in around it.

 

[Dizzy_XC]

I agree that it should be morale based to choose where to strike.

I dont think I'd go that far. I'm saying use Morale to differentiate between Kick or Punch rather than have it be completely random. That's it. Yes, that's amazingly simple. It deserves a bigger font.

Add in Kick or Punch Melee attacks that are linked to Moral. RNG the rest.

[Mod note: let's not get into type point size- off]

 

[Donvale]

Yeah because a location targeted ~200 damage (if you add some actuators on a big mech) strike wouldn't be overpowered at all....

 

[ShinzouMoa]

If I remember correctly, kicking did more damage than punching in TT, didn't it, which might explain people's proclivity for it there. Also legs are generally armored better than arms, so that evens out a little. Damage for either attack also was much lower than in the CG and more likely a last resort kind of attack since attacking at range was much more beneficial, except with mechs specifically designed for melee like the Hatchetman .

I also don't think it is completely random in the CG and more determined by the situation whether you punch or kick (or headbutt).

 

[Lyrch75]

Could the attacks' zone at least be synced with the animations?

Just had my Atlas melee a Trebuchet.
Animation was a kick, low like a drunken shin kick.
RT Destroyed was the outcome.


LOL and my Awesome just kicked a 733 Highlander in the head for Lethal Damage

 

[ShinzouMoa]

Interesting... i have only seen that when my mech was on a higher elevation level. Else my attackers almost always punched, unless the target was much smaller (think highlander vs. locust). So maybe that was just the impression I got from small sample size.

But I agree we should be able to choose kick or punch with different target areas..

 

[RavenBHK]

Simply add the ability to choose where to hit on the enemy mech with melee. The randomness is kind of odd given that you are literally punching the other mech. The randomness is also annoying since you could punch a leg with no armor, but your mech punches the fully armored center torso instead.

P.S. Melee weapons would be nice too. (weapon variety in general would be nice tbh)

*Pictures a sword