Doomdark has written a short guide regarding the supply system.
Link HERE.
I hope this can help give you some of the requested clarifications!
Link HERE.
I hope this can help give you some of the requested clarifications!
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Thanks @ Doomdark. I hope this will help some people to understand the supply system better. Otherwise there will also be the arcade mode^^
That adds alot of insight to how the game works! Thanks!!
I noted the bit on allied supply below:
<<If your units (this also applies to expeditionary forces you have sent) are in an area that has an allied province as Supply Source, they are effectively drawing supplies from that country, which could put a huge strain on their industry. What happens in this situation is that an automatic supply trade is
created between you and your ally, where you are giving them the amount on supplies and fuel that your troops are drawing from them. Unfortunately, this trade is invisible and does not require a supply convoy, meaning it is safe from enemy predation. Hopefully, a better solution will be found down the road.>>
I got a question regarding this: are the supplies "teleported" there automatically, or does it impact supplies comming to and from a port.
Also, suppose the US has troops in england and Germans are blocking the shipping to england, and england is producing no supplies. Will the US still be recieving the needed supplies.
Is there a way to prevent these supplies from reaching the allies supply center?
PS: I've put a list of tips from my experience with the game and with feedback from the community. You may want to list them in the PDF as well. Of course, feel free to refute or add to any of them.
The thread is here: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=476012
I noted the bit on allied supply below:
<<If your units (this also applies to expeditionary forces you have sent) are in an area that has an allied province as Supply Source, they are effectively drawing supplies from that country, which could put a huge strain on their industry. What happens in this situation is that an automatic supply trade is
created between you and your ally, where you are giving them the amount on supplies and fuel that your troops are drawing from them. Unfortunately, this trade is invisible and does not require a supply convoy, meaning it is safe from enemy predation. Hopefully, a better solution will be found down the road.>>
I got a question regarding this: are the supplies "teleported" there automatically, or does it impact supplies comming to and from a port.
Also, suppose the US has troops in england and Germans are blocking the shipping to england, and england is producing no supplies. Will the US still be recieving the needed supplies.
Is there a way to prevent these supplies from reaching the allies supply center?
PS: I've put a list of tips from my experience with the game and with feedback from the community. You may want to list them in the PDF as well. Of course, feel free to refute or add to any of them.
The thread is here: http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=476012
My guess, based on the document, is that if England has no supplies, they still get the American supplies, but that doesn't mean that the Americans will get them: The American units are treated just like English units for supply purposes, so the American supplies will be shared using the regular algorithm.
If your troops are placed in an area controlled by an ally but that doesn't use the capital as the SC, it doesn't quite explain if the supply transfer is done to the ally's capital or to the local supply center. If it goes to the SC, it's a way to send more supplies to an area than the ports allow, but it could also trigger the ugly Quindao effect. If it goes to the capital, you could instead be sabotaged by an ally due by causing a port overload.
It'd be interesting to know which one works.
If your troops are placed in an area controlled by an ally but that doesn't use the capital as the SC, it doesn't quite explain if the supply transfer is done to the ally's capital or to the local supply center. If it goes to the SC, it's a way to send more supplies to an area than the ports allow, but it could also trigger the ugly Quindao effect. If it goes to the capital, you could instead be sabotaged by an ally due by causing a port overload.
It'd be interesting to know which one works.
I hope its your first version. So the supplies are tipped (by teleportation if I read right) into the requisite capital and then distributed. This redistribution will then be subject to all the bottlenecks and friction of normal distribution (incl port capacity). Otherwise it'd get really gamey. Say you're Germany up to your armpits in the Soviet Union, your German troops are at the end of a ropey supply chain but any allies (as long as their govt is also sending supplies) would immediately and directly get the supplies they need.
Not sure the ally would then overload your port capacity through muscling out your supply convoys, the challenge will still be to balance troops on the ground with the supply capacity of the port system?
Thanks for that. Now at least we'll know why it breaks. 
I have a feeling that you could improve the supply system (or make a new, better one) by using the OOB structure which currently doesn't seem to matter at all. Assuming that the military AI makes a halfway decent job of placing units together with HQs, you have a "free" tree of supply needs, distances, and routes. That's a lot of data to work with, so maybe at least some of it can be used for logistics.
I have a feeling that you could improve the supply system (or make a new, better one) by using the OOB structure which currently doesn't seem to matter at all. Assuming that the military AI makes a halfway decent job of placing units together with HQs, you have a "free" tree of supply needs, distances, and routes. That's a lot of data to work with, so maybe at least some of it can be used for logistics.
I like numbers.... sad that there were none. lets wait for semper fi.
But i noticed one thing, i didnt know. The start port of a convoy hasn't a cap how much supply can go through. I think this has broken my supply in some provinces. ( when units are also in this province)
But i noticed one thing, i didnt know. The start port of a convoy hasn't a cap how much supply can go through. I think this has broken my supply in some provinces. ( when units are also in this province)
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Thanks for giving your insight, Doomdark. Semper Fi is suposed to improve the system supplying your troops overseas... Of course is not perfect (yet) but I hope it'd be evolving.
I'd like to see HQs playing a role in supplies and fuel distribution net.
I'd like to see HQs playing a role in supplies and fuel distribution net.
I would too. But from what I understand in the guide that the algorithms/programming needed to do that would take up too much processing power.
Excellent explanation, and I think it will help lower the ammount of bitching about the supply system.
Perhaps Doomdark could expand it a bit more by giving a bit more detail and numbers on the issue of port / infrastructure capacity / the weight of the supply tax? Perhaps a simple example with numbers? (Invasion of Phillipines or Sardinia or something).
Perhaps add some Supply tips and tricks? (like make sure to capture decent ports, use Transports on Supply Drop, limmit your invasion force, research the helpfull techs, appoint the right ministers, etc)?
It's all here on the forums, but for those that dont have that much time to spend, it would be handy to be in one document.
Perhaps Doomdark could expand it a bit more by giving a bit more detail and numbers on the issue of port / infrastructure capacity / the weight of the supply tax? Perhaps a simple example with numbers? (Invasion of Phillipines or Sardinia or something).
Perhaps add some Supply tips and tricks? (like make sure to capture decent ports, use Transports on Supply Drop, limmit your invasion force, research the helpfull techs, appoint the right ministers, etc)?
It's all here on the forums, but for those that dont have that much time to spend, it would be handy to be in one document.
Now you know how it works, when it works.
If you like to play Japan (as of 1.4), you'd better read this though:
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11174237&postcount=97
If you like to play Japan (as of 1.4), you'd better read this though:
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11174237&postcount=97
<If the troops in the area need more supplies than the Supply Source port can convoy in, additional
convoys can be set up to other ports in the area. However, it is important to remember that the area
still only has one Supply Source. This means that supplies from secondary ports might curve back
towards the Supply Source on their path to the units that actually need them. This is quirky, but
should not pose much of a problem.>
So, thinking about Semper Fi, say my supply source is Qingdao but I set up a secondary convoy to Tianjin. Does this mean the Tianjin supplies will first go to Qingdao and then travel out to my troops? Wouldn't that mean that they would still be limited by the infrastructure in the provinces around Qingdao and thus the extra route wouldnt help at all?
convoys can be set up to other ports in the area. However, it is important to remember that the area
still only has one Supply Source. This means that supplies from secondary ports might curve back
towards the Supply Source on their path to the units that actually need them. This is quirky, but
should not pose much of a problem.>
So, thinking about Semper Fi, say my supply source is Qingdao but I set up a secondary convoy to Tianjin. Does this mean the Tianjin supplies will first go to Qingdao and then travel out to my troops? Wouldn't that mean that they would still be limited by the infrastructure in the provinces around Qingdao and thus the extra route wouldnt help at all?
I think what he is saying is that the supplies will head towards the supply center in general but will be siphoned off as they go to the units in need.
I was glad when I saw that post, hoping for a complete, detailed document, explaining all the logic (or non-logic) behind all that system, with formulas, examples, ...
Then, I opened it.
The supply system is adding realism to the game. I find it normal infrastructure is defining how much supply can be delivered. I also find it normal that "the further away from the Supply Source your units are, the more expensive they are to supply, and the greater strain they will put on your Infrastructure". But then, you have that "logic" of one single supply depot, in the capital, even if that capital is thousands of km away, that is ruining it all. I find it mixing realism with non realism, and hoping it would still produce a realistic system at the end.
I still have a really hard understanding why having at least a depot for each theater would be such an issue, and why it would impact performances so much. A unit is located in a province. That province is within a theatre. That is all known information by the game. The supply depot would then just be that theatre HQ's location.
But, ok, this document is better than nothing.
Then, I opened it.
The supply system is adding realism to the game. I find it normal infrastructure is defining how much supply can be delivered. I also find it normal that "the further away from the Supply Source your units are, the more expensive they are to supply, and the greater strain they will put on your Infrastructure". But then, you have that "logic" of one single supply depot, in the capital, even if that capital is thousands of km away, that is ruining it all. I find it mixing realism with non realism, and hoping it would still produce a realistic system at the end.
I still have a really hard understanding why having at least a depot for each theater would be such an issue, and why it would impact performances so much. A unit is located in a province. That province is within a theatre. That is all known information by the game. The supply depot would then just be that theatre HQ's location.
But, ok, this document is better than nothing.
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I never had trouble understaing the supply system in HOI3, and I knew it worked just exactly like Paradox designed. I only couldn't agree on their claims that the system is realistic. It's not, and finally they have admitted it in the FAQ It's semi-realistic, but that doesn't equal to being superior over the system from HOI2, which though even less realistic in it's model, was better suited for gameplay. With drastic penalties for going over TC it could model "overstretched" supply networks on equal footing to HOI3 model, without looking so far away from reality in some points (like the original idea about supplying through single port or always overland in preference to convoy, even when the tax was killing). Those points will be fixed in SF, but other like having to travel one province per day (both requests and actual supply) will remain. Maybe for HOI4 Paradox will try to use the solution to solve BTSP using approximation algorithms, and using more than one depot per area and all will be happy
It's semi-realistic, but that doesn't equal to being superior over the system from HOI2, which though even less realistic in it's model, was better suited for gameplay. With drastic penalties for going over TC it could model "overstretched" supply networks on equal footing to HOI3 model, without looking so far away from reality in some points (like the original idea about supplying through single port or always overland in preference to convoy, even when the tax was killing). Those points will be fixed in SF, but other like having to travel one province per day (both requests and actual supply) will remain. Maybe for HOI4 Paradox will try to use the solution to solve BTSP using approximation algorithms, and using more than one depot per area and all will be happy 
