LumberKing

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This thread is for any kind of suggestions in order to improve the mod. Debates and discussions are welcome, but I ask things be kept civil. Failure to do so, will result in immediate notification to the Moderators.

I will attempt to respond to most things. However, just because I haven't responded does not mean that the idea is rejected nor ignored, but rather I haven't got around to it yet.
 

loup99

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A bit too early for this, but fair enough... :p
 
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Seeing how most of the religions added in this mod are represented by Animism in EU4, I'd like to be able to reform them, as you can do with the Norse faith.
 

aruon

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Seeing how most of the religions added in this mod are represented by Animism in EU4, I'd like to be able to reform them, as you can do with the Norse faith.

you are already able to reform most of the eastern religions in the last all under heaven update, i haven't taken a look back yet, but i think only Confucianism, Shinto, and Taoism can't reform. i may be wrong though. most of the religion's didn't have their holy sites assigned so they just instantly reformed.
 

aruon

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here's some suggestions i've had on a list for a while:

add Emishi (aka Ebisu) ethnicity in Tohoku/Michinoku region for pre-1066 start dates (NE japan AKA dewa and mutsu) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emishi

maybe rename k_japan to k_nippon or k_nippon-koku? (this is mainly so the empire and main kingdom aren't the same name, plus since Nippon literally means Japan, it would signify an inward-facing kingdom and an outward-facing empire. since the emperor of japan is an emperor ingame.

make shinto & its heresy part of Chinese religion group instead of pagan. (i'm guessing that this is just a temporary placeholder?) plus Buddhism should also probably be Chinese since it's only Indian in vanilla CK2 because there is no china. EDIT: apparently either way, Shinto is actually be the reformed version of the japanese faith: Koshinto (literally old way of the gods or old Shinto) so maybe there could be a few provinces that still cling to the old faith? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koshintō

limit Japanese crown authority to low and centralization to medium? definately limit to minimum after shogunate starts (can unique government types be made?). after 1192, the Shoguns effectively took control were usurped by the Hojo clan (who were practically dictators) with the Kamakura shogunate, making the Japanese emperor only a tiny bit less of a figurehead than it is now.

Japanese unique honorary title "Sei-i Taishogun" (Commander-in-Chief of the Expeditionary Force Against the Barbarians). maximum of 2 of them. prerequisites: zealot trait and/or 16+ military skill.

japan unique plot- banishment. emperor Go-Daigo was banished for not alternating with the Go-Saga line, though he regained the throne a few years later... only to get banished again. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shogun#...2.80.931333.29

divide Dewa into 2 provinces. divide Mutsu into 2 or 3. (they're just too large considering the size of japan) i don't know about any name changes but now, they're the Akita, Aomori, Fukushima, Iwate, Miyagi, and Yamagata prefectures. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...gion_large.png

ryukyuan religion as independent religion shinto heresy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryukyuan_religion
 

aruon

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In China, I'd love to see some sort of representation of the invention of Gunpowder, the Compass, and movable type.

yeah. that's something i never liked in EU4. technologically, the various Chinese and nearby kingdoms were literally centuries ahead of Europe and the middle east. the Zhuge crossbow- first semi-automatic weapon. oldest surviving gun- made of bronze and dated to 1288. first cannons- chinese Huochong, which dates back to the song dynasty. also a fun fact: "The first recorded firearms in Vietnam Đại Việt were used against the Champa king Chế Bồng Nga in 1390. He was killed by a volley of cannons known in Chinese as Huochong, one cannonball blasted through the ship planks before hitting the king and causing his instant death"

EDIT: so actually, maybe china should have massive or even maxed military tech level in some spots? or Chinese culture group-specific troops being kinda OP?
 

LumberKing

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A bit too early for this, but faire enough... :p

Don't be silly, it's never too early for pure awesomeness! :p

In all seriousness though, since I am anticipating this Mod to be quite big, I want to keep things organised as much as possible.

Seeing how most of the religions added in this mod are represented by Animism in EU4, I'd like to be able to reform them, as you can do with the Norse faith.

All Folk/Pagan religions are reformable except for Shinto, which is pre-reformed like Hellenic Paganism, but with more stuff hopefully. If you're talking about converting, we have a long way to go before we can even start to talk about that. Besides, it is irrelevant whether a religion is reformed or not when it comes to converting, it is just a matter of telling the converter what to do.

you are already able to reform most of the eastern religions in the last all under heaven update, i haven't taken a look back yet, but i think only Confucianism, Shinto, and Taoism can't reform. i may be wrong though. most of the religion's didn't have their holy sites assigned so they just instantly reformed.

Confucianism and Taosim are not Pagan in this mod, so they can't reform anyways. They are treated like a proper organised religion like Buddhism, but in a new Chinese Group (Daoic) along with Amidism.

here's some suggestions i've had on a list for a while:

add Emishi (aka Ebisu) ethnicity in Tohoku/Michinoku region for pre-1066 start dates (NE japan AKA dewa and mutsu) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emishi

I'll have to think about it. I just managed to clean up and standardise the mod (finafuckingly) and have removed a bunch of cultures and religions for the sake of simplicity. Once the project is truly underway I shall look into it. Since I will be doing pre-1066 dates last before Open Alpha, it may take a while.

maybe rename k_japan to k_nippon or k_nippon-koku? (this is mainly so the empire and main kingdom aren't the same name, plus since Nippon literally means Japan, it would signify an inward-facing kingdom and an outward-facing empire. since the emperor of japan is an emperor ingame.

I don't see anything wrong with having an Empire and a Kingdom sharing the same name. There are many like it elsewhere (most in short-form). I might consider localisation for Japan to be Nippon or Nihon for Japanese culture (no, I am not adding goku in the end).

make shinto & its heresy part of Chinese religion group instead of pagan. (i'm guessing that this is just a temporary placeholder?) plus Buddhism should also probably be Chinese since it's only Indian in vanilla CK2 because there is no china. EDIT: apparently either way, Shinto is actually be the reformed version of the japanese faith: Koshinto (literally old way of the gods or old Shinto) so maybe there could be a few provinces that still cling to the old faith? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koshintō

Shinto has really got me stumped. Since I know that they have had that whole syncretic debacle for centuries, just having Shinto religion on its own is not ideal. My intention has been to have Shinbutsu as a character trait for those who are either Shinto, Buddhists, or Amidists, with various opinion modifiers and what not, but realised that this will be difficult to implement accurately for the provincial populations. However, since you have mentioned Ko-Shinto (which I have never heard of until now), I might be able to not only implement this in an interesting way, but also make the Emperor the damn head of religion without making him theocratic thus unplayable. However, this will depend on whether I can make a religion start reformed without it being pre-reformed (otherwise, time to complain to the good Captain Gars).

As for Buddhism being Chinese, simply no. Especially within this time frame, Buddhism is an Indian religion and even now it is defined as being a Dharmic religion. It's just that it is dying if not dead in India. They made it Eastern in EU4 for the opinion shit, but it simply wouldn't make sense to do so in CK2. However, I did make a whole new religion called Amidism which represents Buddhism of the Far East and South East Asia. At the moment it's just a clone with Martial bonuses, but will be working on it at some point.

limit Japanese crown authority to low and centralization to medium? definately limit to minimum after shogunate starts (can unique government types be made?). after 1192, the Shoguns effectively took control were usurped by the Hojo clan (who were practically dictators) with the Kamakura shogunate, making the Japanese emperor only a tiny bit less of a figurehead than it is now.

No, I don't like the idea of hard-limiting something for the sake of historical railroading. Though the Emperor gradually lost power by the time the new millennium came, it is still not too feasible for the Chrysanthemum Throne to reclaim lost power or even pull of a Meiji Reformation a few centuries too early. If was to put this kind of limitations, I would also have to do it to the Holy Roman Empire as well, and though they did go on a perpetual decline, it was not impossible for them to continue to be a powerhouse.

Japanese unique honorary title "Sei-i Taishogun" (Commander-in-Chief of the Expeditionary Force Against the Barbarians). maximum of 2 of them. prerequisites: zealot trait and/or 16+ military skill.

japan unique plot- banishment. emperor Go-Daigo was banished for not alternating with the Go-Saga line, though he regained the throne a few years later... only to get banished again. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shogun#...2.80.931333.29

Interesting ideas. Will have to look into it soon-ish.

divide Dewa into 2 provinces. divide Mutsu into 2 or 3. (they're just too large considering the size of japan) i don't know about any name changes but now, they're the Akita, Aomori, Fukushima, Iwate, Miyagi, and Yamagata prefectures. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...gion_large.png

It's too early for increase in provinces. Don't get me wrong, I actually want there to be more provinces, but I have to work with what I got. We will, however, look into increasing province numbers overall once we're in either Closed Alpha or Closed Beta (most likely the former).

ryukyuan religion as independent religion shinto heresy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryukyuan_religion

Will have to look into it later.

In China, I'd love to see some sort of representation of the invention of Gunpowder, the Compass, and movable type.

Interesting, but I have no idea how I would implement it. Also, how would it affect gameplay wise?

yeah. that's something i never liked in EU4. technologically, the various Chinese and nearby kingdoms were literally centuries ahead of Europe and the middle east. the Zhuge crossbow- first semi-automatic weapon. oldest surviving gun- made of bronze and dated to 1288. first cannons- chinese Huochong, which dates back to the song dynasty. also a fun fact: "The first recorded firearms in Vietnam Đại Việt were used against the Champa king Chế Bồng Nga in 1390. He was killed by a volley of cannons known in Chinese as Huochong, one cannonball blasted through the ship planks before hitting the king and causing his instant death"

Um... Empires are already over powered as it is. Do you really want China to conquer everything in between Ireland to Cathay?

EDIT: so actually, maybe china should have massive or even maxed military tech level in some spots? or Chinese culture group-specific troops being kinda OP?

You think? :D
 

loup99

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For gunpowder and etc, use special units.
 
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Cuporly666

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Interesting, but I have no idea how I would implement it. Also, how would it affect gameplay wise?



Um... Empires are already over powered as it is. Do you really want China to conquer everything in between Ireland to Cathay?



You think? :D

I was thinking something along the lines of the Greek Fire Event or the Age of Vikings event. A narrative event chain for each invention, with an accompanying technology boost. Gunpowder military units sounds cool too, if such a thing can be implemented.

I see nothing wrong with an expansionist China. If the Emperor of Japan can consolidate power, or the Holy Roman Empire can flourish, why can't China become expansionist? If you're really concerned, maybe you could make certain Causes Belli unavailable to rulers with Chinese culture?
 

Enlil

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The Tanguts ingame should have their upper leadership as Buddhist, but their lower level counts and provinces should be Root West, their native religion. I could provide the icons I have for Root West in WTWSMS if you would like them.
 

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I was thinking something along the lines of the Greek Fire Event or the Age of Vikings event. A narrative event chain for each invention, with an accompanying technology boost. Gunpowder military units sounds cool too, if such a thing can be implemented.

That's an awesome idea. Consider it done (sometime in the near/far future).

I see nothing wrong with an expansionist China. If the Emperor of Japan can consolidate power, or the Holy Roman Empire can flourish, why can't China become expansionist? If you're really concerned, maybe you could make certain Causes Belli unavailable to rulers with Chinese culture?

Oh, there's nothing wrong with expansionist China. However, there might be something wrong when Kings of Pictland form an independence faction against the Tang Dynasty within the First Century of gameplay. :p

The Tanguts ingame should have their upper leadership as Buddhist, but their lower level counts and provinces should be Root West, their native religion. I could provide the icons I have for Root West in WTWSMS if you would like them.

I've been meaning to for a while, but what exactly are Root West? I couldn't find any information on them so I removed them from the game. If someone can give me some kind of source, I might put them back in the game.
 

TheAnguishedOne

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Do any of the religions added have unique features? Norse lets you raid and take concubines, Zoroastrian allows incest, etc.
 

LumberKing

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Do any of the religions added have unique features? Norse lets you raid and take concubines, Zoroastrian allows incest, etc.

Not yet, but they will. Feel free to add in suggestions for what they ought to have and I'll consider implementing them.
 

TheAnguishedOne

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Not yet, but they will. Feel free to add in suggestions for what they ought to have and I'll consider implementing them.

I would love to help, but I don't have any knowledge about the religions. All my suggestions would have no historical reasons.
 

Enlil

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omega20056

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With what I've seen so far this should end the annoying calls for a China DLC. Keep up the good work.
 

LumberKing

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For gunpowder and etc, use special units.

That's actually a good idea. In fact, I could pull off quite a bit with this...


Thanks for the info. Will take it into consideration in the future. For now, I've made Root West and Donba, Bon for now. Will keep it in mind update at some point in the future.

With what I've seen so far this should end the annoying calls for a China DLC. Keep up the good work.

This will probably fuel the fire for such a DLC. :p Besides, this is supposed to test the waters to see how things work out. ;)
 

aruon

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hey i don't know if your actively looking for mini-mods to add into the mix, but one i've found- Old Age. it's made by cybrxkhan and could add a little extra spice/realism. can't have a 110 year old Chinese emperor going Bruce lee on everyone after all. it's completely safe for any patch and mod.
 
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Cameron122

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There should be new imperial titles for dynasties that unify large swaths of afro-eurasia. Like how unifying india creates a single imperial dignity. Maybe they could turn the old empires into "high kingdoms" (large king titles)

Maybe a global empire title for WC games :)