[SUGGESTION] River travel for all.

[ekorovin]

Why HIP doesn't allow river travel for non-Norse religions? I'm pointing that to SWMH mostly, since the team did such an awesome job with Russian rivers. The only problem is that I can't use them, if I'm not Norse.
Slavs, Christians, Muslims, Atheists and Pastafarians could use and used rivers for raiding, trade, transportation and what have you. What's the reason to not allow them do that?

 

[Furion Matsuya]

Balance may haps ?

 

[ekorovin]

Balance may haps ?

For Norse to be completely unbalanced superbeings we know and love? What exactly would happen to balance if we implement it?
That leads to completely ahistorical gameplay, I just can't live with that, it makes me cry.
Is there maybe any way I can change it myself, considering the fact that I have less programming skills then average chipmunk?

 

[Calantyr]

Is there maybe any way I can change it myself, considering the fact that I have less programming skills then average chipmunk?

There's a tag in the religion file which allows it (allow_rivermovement = yes). Copy it to the other religions.

 

[ekorovin]

There's a tag in the religion file which allows it (allow_rivermovement = yes). Copy it to the other religions.

Thanks, will try it out.
Though I still think it should be implemented in HIP (and vanilla, for that matter, but oh well).

 

[BaronIronmaggot]

Thanks, will try it out.
Though I still think it should be implemented in HIP (and vanilla, for that matter, but oh well).

You can also just open the default.map and move everything within the "rivers = { }" to the appropriate sea regions and enclose the lines in brackets {} and add in front "sea_zones =".

For example, Volga river should be turned into this in vanilla game:

sea_zones = { 1092 1093 1094 1095 1096 1097 1098 1099 1100 1101 1105 1106 } #Volga

When that is done, start reading, line-by-line how many sea regions each ocean_region has and change the number accordingly. If European ocean region was like this before:

ocean_region = {	# European Ocean
	sea_zones = { 1 2 3 4 }
}

And you added 4 new sea_zones, you just increase the numbers like this:

ocean_region = {	# European Ocean
	sea_zones = { 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 }
}

 

[ekorovin]

You can also just open the default.map and move everything within the "rivers = { }" to the appropriate sea regions and enclose the lines in brackets {} and add in front "sea_zones =".

For example, Volga river should be turned into this in vanilla game:

sea_zones = { 1092 1093 1094 1095 1096 1097 1098 1099 1100 1101 1105 1106 } #Volga

That may be to tough for me, plus I play SWMH only these days, except for my Afghan AAR.

 

[BaronIronmaggot]

That may be to tough for me, plus I play SWMH only these days, except for my Afghan AAR.

If you want I can do this for you. Just attach your SWMH default.map file in your next post and I will edit it and you just can drop it into your map folder.

 

[ekorovin]

But what's the difference between allowing river travel and making rivers sea-zones? The ability to build trade-posts? If so, then I'll stick with just allowing river travel, SWMH makes Ilmen', Peipsi, Ladoga and Onega into sea zones anyway, plus I really don't want to trouble you:happy:

 

[BaronIronmaggot]

But what's the difference between allowing river travel and making rivers sea-zones? The ability to build trade-posts? If so, then I'll stick with just allowing river travel, SWMH makes Ilmen', Peipsi, Ladoga and Onega into sea zones anyway, plus I really don't want to trouble you:happy:

Alrighty then.

 

[Calantyr]

Turning them into seazones would allow Trade Posts and Port improvements to be built.

It will also conflict with the major_river=yes tag in the latest patch if HIP uses it in future.

Though I think more rivers should be traversable. Nile, anyone?

 

[BaronIronmaggot]

Turning them into seazones would allow Trade Posts and Port improvements to be built.

It will also conflict with the major_river=yes tag in the latest patch if HIP uses it in future.

Though I think more rivers should be traversable. Nile, anyone?

I have heard that the delta of the Nile is too shallow to traverse but the rest should be traversable. IMO, the delta should be a portage and rest of the nile traversable.

 

[SignedName]

Would river sea-zones allow for a Novgorod republic with the proper capital?

 

[Teutonic_Thrash]

I'm more concerned that the Caspian Sea isn't classed as a real sea.

 

[Gwyn ap Nud]

Would river sea-zones allow for a Novgorod republic with the proper capital?

Yes. SWMH already does this, I believe. In some start dates the capital is in the wrong place though.

 

[Slavicist]

Not everyone

It should definitely not possible for everyone to traverse the rivers, but the limitation for just the people of Norse religion is a bit far too odd. For starters, I think it shouldn't be tied to their religion, but culture.

There should be a number of alternatives for others - e.g. the Kingdom of Hungary could have The Black Army as a standing Varangian Guard-style vassal, which could have Serb river warriors. The Serbs (though not them exclusively) could be used to quickly transport renforcements and surprise the Ottomans, as historically.

 

[BaronIronmaggot]

It should definitely not possible for everyone to traverse the rivers, but the limitation for just the people of Norse religion is a bit far too odd. For starters, I think it shouldn't be tied to their religion, but culture.

There should be a number of alternatives for others - e.g. the Kingdom of Hungary could have The Black Army as a standing Varangian Guard-style vassal, which could have Serb river warriors. The Serbs (though not them exclusively) could be used to quickly transport renforcements and surprise the Ottomans, as historically.

Following that line of thought. Finland should be able to traverse even smaller rivers than the Norse can. Norse noted in their sagas that Finnish dudes had small boats when compared to nordic boats. One norway dude talked how lappish dudes raided them with their small ships. And the key point was, that lapish dudes used portages that went over the Scandinavian mountains.

 

[Calantyr]

I'm pretty sure the Romans were using the Danube as a highway up until they lost access to it for good. River travel should have been linked to culture instead of religion, in my not so humble opinion. Oh well.