Succession game!

[Myquandro]

The update with photo's:

New Harbor with Connecting Roads

Spoiler

This is the harbor. Located on the onsite side of the island from the other harbor it's a perfect location for handeling cargo and decreasing traffic that crosses the entire island.

The road build to connect the harbor runs through some empty spaces in the mountains and crosses a river with waterfall. If you don't have to drive it to get to work at the harbor, one might drive it for the scenic views.

A new interchange has been build to manage traffic the best way possible to allow further expansion at the harbor without traffic problems.

Redone/Improved Districts

Spoiler

This locations is redone completely because it was the location of one of the cities worst traffic situations. After redoing the traffic here, there was more room for new buildings.

Point Myquandro was enhanced a little in terms of traffic. A few parks were added and it got some cosmetic changes to make it look even better.

Redone/Improved Roads

Spoiler

A new interchange to improve traffic flow.

Further improvements to the most important highway of the city.

All intersections on the highway are changed to on and off-ramps.

The big roundabout is improved to deal with more traffic.

A new exit for the highway, which caused a lot of headaches.

The central roundabout was a big mess in terms of traffic flow and needed a lot of rethinking and restructuring to make it work. It got even worse then it was after bottlenecks at other points in the city were solved. The roads are still messy, but it flows nicely now.

Other Additions

Spoiler

My statue.

Overview

Spoiler

 

[Myquandro]

I took a peek at the save, and all I can say is WOW! You've consigned most of our traffic troubles to an ugly past that should've never been, and truly deserve the title of the Great Untangler (I tried locating your statue but failed so far; rest assured I'll rename it that way once I find it).

Thanks. It was a bit of work and I would have liked to have more money to do some things the proper way and I didn't had money to even start some things, but I'm satisfied with the results.

The highlights for me were how you made Corner-Stone truly deserve its name, as the, well, cornerstone of the traffic system in that area of the city. And you also succeeded in making a 6-lane road crawl up the cliffs below Varsity Heights, something that I couldn't do despite unreasonable amounts of effort.

Corner-Stone is the worst place of town, but at the same time the most interesting to have worked on and to watch how all the cars navigate through there. This is probably the best example of how bad planning causes ugly solutions.

Of course the traffic network remains an improved mess in the best of cases; you did phenomenally given the constraints (time, money, existing infrastructure), but to have some coordination from the beginning would've been still better. Maybe we could have a 'traffic planner', or planning committee (you and ItalianGuy?) in the next game, to ensure a smooth flow of traffic and no waste of resources correcting past mistakes? --In addition to our own districts, we could have roles like this in the general city: traffic planner, zone manager, etc. I'm not sure if there's enough 'vacancies' for everyone, but I'm sure we could work this out so that everyone has more or less equal responsibilities. --Maybe make it 'local traffic' and 'city-wide', since traffic is such a big part of the game in its current state? (Note that this doesn't mean you couldn't lay a single tract of highway if you're not the traffic planner; only that it's their main responsility, and you should always announce / negotiate your interference.) --We could make a thread for brain-storming the new district-based game, even way before we start it, so that we've got a working system once we do decide to roll the (wrecking) ball, somewhere down the line.

This seems like a good idea to me, but it still needs some thinking on how this can be done the best way. I've got some ideas about it, but it's probably better to discuss this in a separate thread or something together with other thing for a next SG.

Some more comments regarding other matters:

-- Oilton may have been restructured, but it's also a home to bums and not much else (buildings abandoned due to lack of workers). I suppose the oil workers could not be re-trained for use i general industry... Hopefully the problem will be alleviated by new people moving into the city. (However, now the presence of these industries in such a remote area is a bit questionable, seeing as how the oil was the main reason for their existence in the first place.)

I didn't had time to work on Oilton too much, I've seen the problems but have left it for another too solve

-- Someone should turn our windmills back on. Pronto. (Unless there's a good reason not to that I've managed to miss somehow.)

It's actually cheaper to turn-off power plants when they're not needed.

-- Smokestack Cove has been badly decimated by the new highway. It's the best area to demolish though, in many ways. I wonder why the workers from those industries haven't found their way to Oilton? Perhaps it's just a matter of time.

Maybe someone can redo Smokestack Cove instead of demolishing it.

-- I notice that my new conceptual residential area has been partially filled with commecial zones. Whether done by mistake or design, to this I can say one thing, and one thing only: We are the Renovators. Expect us.

What area/district are you referring to?

-- I hope the tourists visiting our city have a good map of the tunnel network.

It's getting worse and worse. If the next SG would be on a flat(ter) map we don't need this many tunnels.

 

[Calad]

Sorry for being late again but here comes my diary

When I opened save there were some great design problems, like some part of city was not conttected on grid so it was my first task to fix it.

Also I dont think people who designed ths city actually want to live here. Got no money? Cross the street please sire!

City produced a lot of extra electricity so I turned off all coal plants and wind turbines. Two dam is enough.

Also Blue Pond had become another Aral Sea, theree pipes consumed all water so I turned two of them off.

Then on my main task: Trafic problems. It was clear city needed something more than one long road. Also commerce area was a hellhole.

Must be nice to wait in a car every day 2 hours.

New entrance highway was build. I had to demolish many buildings to build a new elevated sound walled highway trough the city. Note also a strange road bug: roads are clearly connected but game says otherwise. I managed to by pass this bug by using other type of road.

More had to be destroyed.

Finally main road was connected. Still project was far from ready.

Corner stone become a new traffic hell so I had to redesign it couple of times.

First airport was founded and named after me...

Well this is not working at all!

A new tunnel was build trough recently named Mount Calad This helped with some traffic problems.

Uh wait what?

Thats better! But can be even more better!

New living airport area!

Some new offices and corner stone redesigned.

Meanwhile tunnel project was decided to be connected on main road.

Third time, final time! No more redesigns!

Much better.

But main road had some issues...

Actually it is as bad as first road. Later I found out that one buss was strangely looping around picture above which explained why busses were always stuck.

Also road up to mountains was getting too busy so new, larger had to be done.

Better but not perfect.

Thats it pretty much. One year is short time. Blue pond is recovering but waterfall has not recovered yet.

Here lies an ancient dwarf fortress Kazad-Dum! (really who made this?)

Aerial view.

 

[stiiknafuulia]

Holy hi-res screenshots, Batman! (And unholy crappy internet connection!) --Did you use a filter for (some of) those shots? (The beginning ones about the new harbor.) Kinda looks like Realistic, which is what I used, but it seems subtly different... I really like it and would like to use it for some of mine. Unless it's just the default game acting pretty (it happens at times).

This seems like a good idea to me, but it still needs some thinking on how this can be done the best way. I've got some ideas about it, but it's probably better to discuss this in a separate thread or something together with other thing for a next SG.

I agree; I might start the thread sometime next week. --Ofc since you sort of have to lay roads every time you make new zones & buildings, there has to be some player discretion in this, regardless of 'dedicated' planners... Perhaps we could make elongated districts that are reserved for highway development? Anyway, there's lots of ways to go about this. And if the way we choose to do things doesn't work, we can always change it once the game has started.

It's actually cheaper to turn-off power plants when they're not needed.

I see. Now that I think of it, it makes sense... It just looks so ugly to see those 'turned off' symbols.

Maybe someone can redo Smokestack Cove instead of demolishing it.

I think the more time passes and the more educated our cims get, the less room there is for 'traditional' industries in our city. I'd rather redo the area along more progressive lines; some offices and new Residential areas may be in order (unless someone else chooses to work on it before me).

What area/district are you referring to?

The one in Upper New Haven (the new area across the bay near Tregonwell shopping center), where I zoned those nice walk-ways in preparation for the future residents. It's kind of confusing though that they're close to the Supermall; however this won't save the owners of those shops from their future relocation (no compensation will be offered; they're technically illegal squatters and should be thankful for avoiding prosecution!).

It's getting worse and worse. If the next SG would be on a flat(ter) map we don't need this many tunnels.

Imo, there should be a limit to the number of tunnels per square / district / *some arbitrary area*, to not make the game too easy / unrealistic; in terms of in-game reasoning, we could spin it something like 'Warning from seismologists! The number of tunnels in the city pushes the limit of tension in the nearby fault zone! Any more tunnels will likely result in a major earthquake!'. --Tbh, I enjoyed writing my report more than playing my actual turn. In our new game, I could be the city's Flavor / Tourism Commissioner, writing reports and opinions from local citizens and the 'outside world' alike. (Not to say that others couldn't add to these ofc; just that it's safer to let me report on the traffic than to allow me to plan it. )

 

[Calad]

The update with photo's:

New Harbor with Connecting Roads

Spoiler

This is the harbor. Located on the onsite side of the island from the other harbor it's a perfect location for handeling cargo and decreasing traffic that crosses the entire island.

The road build to connect the harbor runs through some empty spaces in the mountains and crosses a river with waterfall. If you don't have to drive it to get to work at the harbor, one might drive it for the scenic views.

A new interchange has been build to manage traffic the best way possible to allow further expansion at the harbor without traffic problems.

Redone/Improved Districts

Spoiler

This locations is redone completely because it was the location of one of the cities worst traffic situations. After redoing the traffic here, there was more room for new buildings.

Point Myquandro was enhanced a little in terms of traffic. A few parks were added and it got some cosmetic changes to make it look even better.

Redone/Improved Roads

Spoiler

A new interchange to improve traffic flow.

Further improvements to the most important highway of the city.

All intersections on the highway are changed to on and off-ramps.

The big roundabout is improved to deal with more traffic.

A new exit for the highway, which caused a lot of headaches.

The central roundabout was a big mess in terms of traffic flow and needed a lot of rethinking and restructuring to make it work. It got even worse then it was after bottlenecks at other points in the city were solved. The roads are still messy, but it flows nicely now.

Other Additions

Spoiler

My statue.

Overview

Spoiler

What graffic mod you have? This looks excellent!

 

[Myquandro]

I use Realistic (as stiiknafuulia said), but I then imported it to Aperture (Mac application like Adobe Lightroom) which I let it auto-enhance white-balance and a few more things (just very subtle differences). But those subtle differences can make all the difference.

 

[stiiknafuulia]

@Calad:

So you made that road up the cliffs and not Myquandro? Nice work mate! ...And don't be too demoralized about Myquandro's recent renovations: you had the fortitude to lay the groundwork for the new network (read: evict the citizens), while he worked to improve on your initial design. Iteration is how we do things irl, after all (sometimes I feel like the Finnish traffic designers are playing too much C:SL!).

Re Blue Pond drying up: this gives me some ideas for the future (when/if we get to the point where land starts running out)... I've seen some screenshots on Reddit about people making 'Dutch' polders by using dams and water pumps to pump away water from large parts of the ocean. Something to use our piles of money on, for the far future.

Re Calad Mountain & Airport: I've always maintained that humility is squarely for the untalented! Good to see that you too recognize the inherent truth that it takes some *major talent* to be able to become a mayor.

Re Opulence Tower not being connected to the electrical grid in the first pic: I did notice it at the end of my turn, but figured the next mayor would spot it too and have it corrected. It did ruin the grand opening party, but luckily I didn't have to attend, having already handed the keys of the city to the next mayor. As to the copper wiring that was reserved for the electrial connections, I've no idea what happened to it. Sometimes things simply get misplaced in the inevitable confusion and chaos that are involved in a shift of high executive power.

Re road bug: That is likely just the game being its usual self. For some reason those kinds of connections are very hard to get to set correctly. In any case Myquandro has sorted out any potential traffic problems for the foreseeable future (barring extreme happenings).

Re Corner-Stone being a problem area traffic-wise: it may be a bit non-intuitive, but roads being red on the traffic overlay is not in itself an indication of bad traffic; just of a big amount of it flowing through that location. To determine whether an area is truly problematic, a visual examination is always necessary (if there are lines of cars that are blocking up the area, yup, it's a problem alright). This said, in that pic it does look like the traffic worsened after I'd observed Corner-Stone for some time (determining at the time that the traffic there was smooth enough). In any case I think it's safe to say that it'd be dangerous for us to stick our fat thumbs in this knot of concrete again; I get a dizzy head just from looking at Myquandro's beautiful monster, let alone making changes to it!

Re origins of Kazam-Dum: the wizard in question would be Spockyt I believe. (Btw still waiting for your report, Spocky! )

@Myquandro: Ah. Never even thought about improving the screenshots afterwards... Well that should handily double my workload. Kudos for your 'help'...

 

[Myquandro]

Re Blue Pond drying up: this gives me some ideas for the future (when/if we get to the point where land starts running out)... I've seen some screenshots on Reddit about people making 'Dutch' polders by using dams and water pumps to pump away water from large parts of the ocean. Something to use our piles of money on, for the far future.

I've also done this. As a Dutch guy, I just had to try that at least once. And because its completely flat land its the easiest part to build on.

 

[Spockyt]

Indeed, that Mountainous-Tunnely-Mess(tm) was I. Sorry. I was trying to make a tunnel from below to above... it didn't work. And I'm still aware that I need to write my report, but I've had a very stressful and busy few weeks, sorry. I'm going to complete it a t sometime though, and if I get to my next turn before I ahve posted the current report, I'll obviously post that one first. What I'm planning to do though, is edit a earlier post of mine to add my report (and post a new post to let you know.)

 

[stiiknafuulia]

https://www.reddit.com/r/CitiesSkyl...t_are_some_nonintuitive_tricks_to_successful/

Some of these tips are ones that I really wish I'd have read before we started this game. I won't comment on them for now (too tired and must go to sleep), but there aren't that many to read and many of these are very useful, so the next mayor (whether that be TCV or JJ) would be wise to take notice before revving up the bulldozers.

 

[ItalianGuy]

Sorry to go off topic, but I need help from you who studied maps before starting the game.
I noticed that on flat maps I often feel lost, because expanding on them is just random and feels forced. I started a new city yesterday on our paradise falls map and it's much nicer to expand following the natural land shape. I'll post a screenshot later to show you what I'm talking about.
Can you suggest me some similar maps? I'm enjoying so much with tunnels, German roads, vehicle settings and realistic population mods on that map!

I also have a question for Calad: how do you create links to posts?

 

[Calad]

@Calad:

So you made that road up the cliffs and not Myquandro? Nice work mate! ...And don't be too demoralized about Myquandro's recent renovations: you had the fortitude to lay the groundwork for the new network (read: evict the citizens), while he worked to improve on your initial design. Iteration is how we do things irl, after all (sometimes I feel like the Finnish traffic designers are playing too much C:SL!).

Re Blue Pond drying up: this gives me some ideas for the future (when/if we get to the point where land starts running out)... I've seen some screenshots on Reddit about people making 'Dutch' polders by using dams and water pumps to pump away water from large parts of the ocean. Something to use our piles of money on, for the far future.

Re Calad Mountain & Airport: I've always maintained that humility is squarely for the untalented! Good to see that you too recognize the inherent truth that it takes some *major talent* to be able to become a mayor.

Re Opulence Tower not being connected to the electrical grid in the first pic: I did notice it at the end of my turn, but figured the next mayor would spot it too and have it corrected. It did ruin the grand opening party, but luckily I didn't have to attend, having already handed the keys of the city to the next mayor. As to the copper wiring that was reserved for the electrial connections, I've no idea what happened to it. Sometimes things simply get misplaced in the inevitable confusion and chaos that are involved in a shift of high executive power.

Re road bug: That is likely just the game being its usual self. For some reason those kinds of connections are very hard to get to set correctly. In any case Myquandro has sorted out any potential traffic problems for the foreseeable future (barring extreme happenings).

Re Corner-Stone being a problem area traffic-wise: it may be a bit non-intuitive, but roads being red on the traffic overlay is not in itself an indication of bad traffic; just of a big amount of it flowing through that location. To determine whether an area is truly problematic, a visual examination is always necessary (if there are lines of cars that are blocking up the area, yup, it's a problem alright). This said, in that pic it does look like the traffic worsened after I'd observed Corner-Stone for some time (determining at the time that the traffic there was smooth enough). In any case I think it's safe to say that it'd be dangerous for us to stick our fat thumbs in this knot of concrete again; I get a dizzy head just from looking at Myquandro's beautiful monster, let alone making changes to it!

Re origins of Kazam-Dum: the wizard in question would be Spockyt I believe. (Btw still waiting for your report, Spocky! )

@Myquandro: Ah. Never even thought about improving the screenshots afterwards... Well that should handily double my workload. Kudos for your 'help'...

Its okay, my work was not perfect and I hope someone will blow up it and make it better. I think Corner Stone is getting better, now there are no big traffic problems but the problem itself is city around it: roads are too small.

I've also done this. As a Dutch guy, I just had to try that at least once. And because its completely flat land its the easiest part to build on.

Dutchmen, Dutchmen everyhwere!

Indeed, that Mountainous-Tunnely-Mess(tm) was I. Sorry. I was trying to make a tunnel from below to above... it didn't work. And I'm still aware that I need to write my report, but I've had a very stressful and busy few weeks, sorry. I'm going to complete it a t sometime though, and if I get to my next turn before I ahve posted the current report, I'll obviously post that one first. What I'm planning to do though, is edit a earlier post of mine to add my report (and post a new post to let you know.)

Its okay, I also took some time... that why originally I sad one week for each player for cases like this.

Sorry to go off topic, but I need help from you who studied maps before starting the game.
I noticed that on flat maps I often feel lost, because expanding on them is just random and feels forced. I started a new city yesterday on our paradise falls map and it's much nicer to expand following the natural land shape. I'll post a screenshot later to show you what I'm talking about.
Can you suggest me some similar maps? I'm enjoying so much with tunnels, German roads, vehicle settings and realistic population mods on that map!

I also have a question for Calad: how do you create links to posts?

I also think flat maps are boring because it really just is building an optimal city, and once you figured out how to build good connections you just copy that model to everywhere.

To create link on certain post first right click post number on right of quote and copy link, then when posting a new post copy that link into link section.

 

[Myquandro]

I also think flat maps are boring because it really just is building an optimal city, and once you figured out how to build good connections you just copy that model to everywhere.

My personal preference is a map that is flat enough to build big cities on without having to make ridiculous tunnels, bridges and small roads with hundreds of hairpins just to get up one mountain. But I've played flatlands for 1 hour and was done with it, it's just too easy. I'm now playing Cliffside Bay which is close to what I want, it has elevation changes, enough flat lands and there are resources, but not too much. The city I'm building now is shaped not only by my imagination, but also by the landscape. I'm trying to find more of these maps at the moment and see which one is best (possibly for a next SG)

 

[ItalianGuy]

I'll post a screenshot later to show you what I'm talking about.

Spoiler

With German Roads I created a long fast road that travels through the city (of course there was no city when I placed it), then expanded to both sides of this road following the landscape (river banks, mountains...). Doing this from a cims perspective is very fun! The city grows slowly and orgaincally. The industry is far, far away, near the freeway where the grass doesn't grow. This is the city, not industry. It has residential buildings, some shops, parks, pedestrian paths where cims protested to have them, trees, bushes, some small bridges to reach good pieces of land. It's been much much more fun than building the soulless blobs that were cities on flat maps!

 

[stiiknafuulia]

@ItalianGuy: The landscape in that pic is pretty much ideal by my standards, even if I'd have built the city a bit differently. I also like to have a lot of islands, big, small and anything in between on my maps... Tomorrow when I get back to my good computer, I might post a screenshot of the European map that I'm building atm. I might as well spoil the surprise a little bit and state that it has oodles of channels to give variation and contours to an otherwise flat terrain; I also plan to have an elevated area in the center, as an 'old town' of sorts -- mainly to provide nice views over the city once it's fully developed! --I'd really like to try out the European theme buildings in our next game, but the trouble is that you need a (mostly) flat map for this as the buildings look ridiculous in steep terrains... It doesn't help finding the right kind of map that the Steam Workshop has abysmal search options ('Maps'... That's it?! Are you kidding me?). So I chose to build my own map as the best option, but if a better map is found on the WS, then I'm not opposed to using it. My map is still very much a work in progress, and I'm not sure it'd be ideal for the kind of game we're planning to have next (the channels make for good natural borders to districts... Perhaps a bit *too* natural in the final end.)

While I like Paradise Island, there too the terrain lends itself to easy divisions: the central island becomes the 'common' territory almost by default, while the surrounding 'banana-shaped' island is easily divided into even districts for the 'personal' territories. --Btw I've been brainstorming the new game format a little bit and I really need some help / ideas with it... It has the potential to be great fun, but equally well it could blow up in our faces spectacularly, if we don't think everything through before starting. I will post my initial thoughts on it in a new thread in a few days' time (a week at most), on this same forum. Stay tuned.

--Btw, did we start using Traffic++ yet? I was able to load the save without it, so I guess it's not yet activated? The next player should start using it then; although the traffic issues are solved for the moment, to ensure they won't crop up again, we might as well start to learn how to use bus lanes and the like for best possible traffic flow. It will only help our next city after all.

 

[Myquandro]

--Btw, did we start using Traffic++ yet? I was able to load the save without it, so I guess it's not yet activated? The next player should start using it then; although the traffic issues are solved for the moment, to ensure they won't crop up again, we might as well start to learn how to use bus lanes and the like for best possible traffic flow. It will only help our next city after all.

I didn't use Traffic++ in this game. I have used it yesterday in one of my cities and although I'm not sure my problems were caused by Traffic++ or one of its options, when I loaded my city with it within a week I had several major traffic problems. I this is indeed caused by (some part of) Traffic++ I'm not sure we should use it.

 

[ItalianGuy]

Calad, remove Traffic++ from OP.
Let's do one more iteration without it.
Who is next?

 

[stiiknafuulia]

I didn't use Traffic++ in this game. I have used it yesterday in one of my cities and although I'm not sure my problems were caused by Traffic++ or one of its options, when I loaded my city with it within a week I had several major traffic problems. I this is indeed caused by (some part of) Traffic++ I'm not sure we should use it.

It might be that T++ is conflicting with the existing infrastructure of your city. It might be best to wait until the new game to use it, so we can use it right from the beginning, assuring that all roads follow the same 'system'.

@ItalianGuy: It was TheChaoticVoid's turn from Saturday 12:30; since 48 hours have passed, it is now JerkyJerry who's up (in fact has been for over a day now). If Jerry doesn't post a 'got it!' before 12:30 tomorrow, then we'll move on to Spockyt.

@JerkyJerry: it's your turn now so please post a 'got it!' if you're able to play within the next 6 days or thereabouts.
@Spockyt: Prepare to play in a day or so if JJ doesn't show up.

 

[Spockyt]

If it does defaut to me (uh oh) do you mind posting the save on an alternate site? Norton still hates tinyupload for me, though who knows why.

 

[stiiknafuulia]

If it does defaut to me (uh oh) do you mind posting the save on an alternate site? Norton still hates tinyupload for me, though who knows why.

Can't you just disable it for a little while? Or make an exception for that site.

Btw can we put screenshots in spoilers from now on (as Myquandro has done on the top of this page)? If you have a slow connection (as I'm blessed to have), the pictures make the forum jump up and down as they load gradually, making it rather annoying to write replies.

I will edit this post with a few pics of my own shortly...

EDIT: I'm too lazy to embed the pictures; there's only 7 this time, so be sure to check them out:

http://imgur.com/a/kkt3E