Stupid Personal Unions... (Just this time¡¡¡)

[trevi2]

I am playing Austria in 1467, and right now I count with Castille and Muscovy in PU's... In a first moment it can seem a great thing, but nevertheless is a great handicap as they are Castille and not Spain, and Muscovy and not Russia...

The problem with this is that they haven't expanded practically -Castille does not even has conquered Granade-, does not have the Iberian wedding, etc. and Kazan, Riazan ,etc. do exist...

So I have two questions, one of the game mechanics and the other one as a debate if the first one is possible:

1. Being the lord can you break the PU -holding the RM and dinasty-? I believe you can not, unless you act neglectly to loose all your prestige, because my relations with them are excellent as they were peaceful PU's.

2. In case you can break it...would you break it? They have a lot of territories available to conquer...

 

[Jaol]

1) PUs break peacefully on either negative prestige or negative relations. So if you spam them with insults the union will break. Pretty sure you will lose the RM (there will be a new ruler in each nation), but you may keep the same dynasty--I've seen the Denmark-Norway PU break up peacefully, with both sides keeping the same dynasty. Not sure what the chances are, though.

2) Depends on what sort of game you want. If you're looking to make yourself as powerful as possible, then there's no point in breaking it. Getting a PU is largely a matter of luck, and you have no guarantee you'll be able to do so again. If you just want to see how far your dynasty can spread, then sure. But it's definitely a non-optimal strategy.

 

[Rya]

You have just taken out two of the major competitors for world domination in the first 20 years. You want to give that up?! Are you mad? Muscovy will colonize Siberia and Castille will still colonize everything else. Destroy Portugal for good measure (feed to Castille) and you're set.
To answer your question, I have seen Norway and Sweden break away from Denmark keeping the same dynasty but I don't know how they did it. Could have been random.

 

[trevi2]

1) PUs break peacefully on either negative prestige or negative relations. So if you spam them with insults the union will break. Pretty sure you will lose the RM (there will be a new ruler in each nation), but you may keep the same dynasty--I've seen the Denmark-Norway PU break up peacefully, with both sides keeping the same dynasty. Not sure what the chances are, though.

2) Depends on what sort of game you want. If you're looking to make yourself as powerful as possible, then there's no point in breaking it. Getting a PU is largely a matter of luck, and you have no guarantee you'll be able to do so again. If you just want to see how far your dynasty can spread, then sure. But it's definitely a non-optimal strategy.

1. I had not think about the insult. Thanks.

2. Well the thing is that they can conquer a lot of provinces for you... Although for sure repeating a peaceful PU, will be kind of impossible the chance of getting a PU through war is quite possible

 

[Novacat]

To answer your question, I have seen Norway and Sweden break away from Denmark keeping the same dynasty but I don't know how they did it. Could have been random.

Peaceful breakaways tend to keep the same dynasty. My last Swedish game I had the Von Wittelsbachs all the way to 1820.

 

[zodium]

If you're looking to expand, there is no good reason to break the PUs, especially as Austria. Just integrate them and use the base tax to vassalize more people, whatever expansion they could have done you can do yourself faster with their base tax.

 

[Jaol]

Although for sure repeating a peaceful PU, will be kind of impossible the chance of getting a PU through war is quite possible

Don't count on it. They can easily change dynasty, never have an heir with a weak claim, turn into a noble republic, etc..

 

[dstarsboy]

Not to thread hijack but he raises a pretty good point about something. Let's say he has Castille and Moscovy as PUs and he decides to wage CBless wars on their neighbors (Aragon/Granada/Kazan/Crimea/etc) and takes these territories and feeds them to his PUs... will they create Spain and Russia?

 

[Novacat]

Not to thread hijack but he raises a pretty good point about something. Let's say he has Castille and Moscovy as PUs and he decides to wage CBless wars on their neighbors (Aragon/Granada/Kazan/Crimea/etc) and takes these territories and feeds them to his PUs... will they create Spain and Russia?

Most of those decisions require that they not be vassalized, so probably not.

 

[trevi2]

....

 

[BBBD316]

I am not sure it would really matter, he will integrate them anyway. Does it matter if he integrates Spain v Castille?

 

[SweetHalcyHS]

I don't see why you would want to release them; it's a pretty risky gamble you'd be running there.