Stop the instant culture conversion

[TheArrogantOne]

The "culture conversion" mechanic should be stopped. It simply doesn't make sense. Unless you massacre the majority of the people of the previous culture or deport them all somewhere else (both happened, but only in certain cases and more like later in history), there's no way you could change the culture in just a few years. It should be a long-time process... say a really long one. For instance, the Estonians do not even have their own country at the start and yet, Estonia exists today. I'm not sure if this is a good example because I don't know if they were persecuted. If it isn't, go with Poland, who didn't exist for 123 years and Polish culture still didn't "magically" disappear, even though Prussia, Austria and Russia wanted to ensure it does. They did not succeed though, as Poland does exist.

In my opinion, the "culture convert" button should either be completely removed and culture would change due to events, like in M&T, or else just extend the time after which a culture can be converted, and maybe also multiply the time by a random factor.

 

[Fluffy_Fishy]

I don't see the culture conversion as entirely destroying a culture. I see it as a similar situation to what happened to the Welsh after the English conquest, where they destoryed as much claims for Welsh nationalism as possible, rather than utter destruction of the actual culture.

 

[Andrzej2]

I hate when I see culturally homogenous, ultra stable states. Especially in multiplayer where everyone is changing cultures. In eu3 multicultural empires led by human players could easily fall apart after long, destructive war. In eu4 they are far more stable becouse of that culture conversions. It also looks very ugly and boring. So i propose solution:

Changing culture should be impossible (there should be only rare event that changes culture like in Eu3).
Accepted cultures shouldn't be chosen based on base tax and you should have ulimited numer of possible accepted cultures.

You should be able to start procces of assimilation (acceptance) of any culture that is in your country. It would drain your diplomatic points. Cost and time would depend on overall size of culture you want to accept and your ideas.

There should be some events that can set back assimilation procces for example that nobility from your base culture want's privileges just for themselves or that people you want to assimilate still can't bring together preserving their identity with loyalty to your state or that foreign power of same culture is supporting nationalist movement etc.

After that assimilation procces is done you would gain that culture accepted. It would still be profitable and worth spending diplomatic points but also would look nice on map. And even accepted cultures can revolt if unrest is high enough so we won't have problem with too stable homogenous empires.

TL;dr - Basically you should spend diplomatic points to accept cultures not to change them to your own.

 

[AmbroStoics]

I said it once (ok I posted about this like 50 times) and I will say it again. Yes.

 

[Gaussia]

Do people acctually use Cultire Conversion (always think the price is to heavy for it to feel worth it, but maybe I have been wrong all this time?)?

 

[AmbroStoics]

Well it does remove all the culture penalties and renders nationalist rebels impossible.

BUT regardsless of human players doing it, the AI always will and it is annoying AF when all of Belgium is Asutrian and you can't convert it back because Austria exists and they can't lose their cores because it is their primary culture. The least Paradox should do is add a requirement for a land bridge between the convertee province and the capital.

 

[grommile]

Do people acctually use Cultire Conversion (always think the price is to heavy for it to feel worth it, but maybe I have been wrong all this time?)?

Some people do (and the AI definitely does; Croatia routinely ends up Austrian, for instance).

I do it occasionally, if I'm sitting on a surplus of DIP points or I've got a bunch of islands I would like to not have to ever worry about nationalist revolts on ever again.

 

[AmbroStoics]

My problem with that is, that it's miseading. Call it loyalty or something then, not culture.

 

[BFTeixeira]

Do people acctually use Cultire Conversion (always think the price is to heavy for it to feel worth it, but maybe I have been wrong all this time?)?

Use every time i'm getting to diplo points max points. And use every time i conquer a high BT province (10+).

 

[veycon]

I'd really appreciate a culture system like in victoria 2 but without those different groups like farmers or capitalists

 

[crusaderking]

I agree. Culture conversion sucks, and one-click culture conversion sucks even more. I do like the alternative another poster suggested, that is to spend DIP points in assimilating a culture rather than converting it. At the same time, there should be events to convert cultures as well, but it shouldn't be as easy as it is now.

 

[elpibeuruguayo]

Or only make the culture system like the culture system of EUIII, the culture only changed in an rare event.

 

[Kansai-kun]

Do people acctually use Cultire Conversion (always think the price is to heavy for it to feel worth it, but maybe I have been wrong all this time?)?

If I convert anything, it's mostly islands (Socotra to Amhara) or single provinces bordering my cultural heartlands (Macedonia/Edirne to Bulgarian, Navarra to Catalan/Aragonese).

 

[Tacticalenforce]

I agree. This is more logical and historical.

 

[zabuzaninja]

Just as you use MIL points to put down an entire "welsh" uprising, it should cost DIP points to accept the entire Welsh culture. This makes the accepted culture -10% really helpful (now it would be -10% DIP cost). Cost to make accepted could be based on development of all that culture's provinces with a significant penalty for provinces of that culture that you do not own (let's say development is counted twice). This would make it impossible to add French as accepted if you only own 1 French province, but allow you to make a culture accepted if you're only missing 1 province (Hungary refusing to be accepted because you everything except Pozsony is silly). Plus, when you do get that last prov, coring will be easier because the culture is already accepted in your state.

Ex:
We'll say the add accepted culture is a *20 modifier with DIP cost
England owns all prov with Welsh as culture with total development 10
England has a -10% accepted culture cost idea
10 development * 20 * 0.9 = 180 DIP to add Welsh as an accepted culture

Ex2:
We'll say the add accepted culture is a *20 modifier with DIP cost
England owns all prov with Welsh as culture with total development 10 except Cornwall which has development 5
England has a -10% accepted culture cost idea
15 development (10 total + 5 for unowned Cornwall) * 20 * 0.9 = 270 DIP to add Welsh as an accepted culture

The numbers might need to be changed a bit, if French culture provinces have a total development of 50 it would be impossible to add accepted with a *20 mod. This way though, if it's late game and the Dutch have built up the development in Holland a ton, it will be really expensive to add them as accepted which makes some practical sense.

For actually changing cultures you could do something like neighboring your primary culture and accepted with MTTH 100 years - Austrian culture Balkans should not be as easy as it is now.

 

[grommile]

Just as you use MIL points to put down an entire "welsh" uprising,

Eh? I use manpower.

 

[zabuzaninja]

Eh? I use manpower.

http://www.eu4wiki.com/Rebellion#Rebel_faction_progress