Stop buying content DLC!?

[co_martsu]

How can you POSSIBLY say that pathfinding works as intended!?!?!

Please see screenshot below. I have repositioned tram stop C and bulldozed a road I had earlier built that contained an old tram stop. Take a look for yourself and see the route my citizens take to make the transfer from metro to tram...

View attachment 92099

All passengers alight the metro at A as this is the final stop on the line. They walk in completely the wrong direction
They cross the road at B, walk one block and then cross back to continue their journey
They walk directly past their final transfer point (E)
They make their way to C to board the tram
They travel one stop and alight at D (They already walked past this stop on their way to C to board the tram
They finally make their way to E to board the train at its first stop to continue their journey

Why do they not just walk across the road to the tram stop?

This is living proof that the pathfinding system does NOT work as intended. Like I stated in my other post, I'm trying not to be negative about this game as it has so much potential, but when I see posts like the one I have quoted I really find I have to bite my tongue to avoid venting my pure frustration at this whole thing!

In the case you describe, there are two options:
- The network was modified so that there wasn't enough time for the passengers to change their plan
- There's a bug in the road, that for some reason the passengers don't realize they can use it

It would be immensely helpful to get a bug report with a save game about this to the tech support forum. Thanks in advance!

 

[Alex_brunius]

I'm very sorry you don't like the pathfinding in the game. However it is something that we will not be addressing since it works as designed.

The pathfinder does not work... at all.

If you indeed consider it working fine, can you also tell me that you just like the CiMs are switching bus, tram and metro 7 times (including spending 2 hours walking extremely unnecessary detours) on your daily commute to work?



Just like many others here I was also fooled in the start buying Paradox DLCs, to try to bring in money for support patching and new features. But all you ever get is more more more more and more DLCs with content that really should have been there since launch...

 

[Gogomaester]

The pathfinder does not work... at all.
Just like many others here I was also fooled in the start buying Paradox DLCs, to try to bring in money for support patching and new features. But all you ever get is more more more more and more DLCs with content that really should have been there since launch...

Still better to pay 20€ + 5€ ( + 5€ + 5€ .....) (You can choose, which dlcs you buy and which not) than to pay 50€ for vehicles or features, that you wouldnt use.

 

[omoikane]

Still better to pay 20€ + 5€ ( + 5€ + 5€ .....) (You can choose, which dlcs you buy and which not) than to pay 50€ for vehicles or features, that you wouldnt use.

And still much better to pay 60$ to get original game which has only tram for public transport system and 10$ for each landmark pack.

 

[quirinus]

And still much better to pay 60$ to get original game which has only tram for public transport system and 10$ for each landmark pack.

well, sim city cannot serve as a rule since it is just a single big rip-off of casual gamers

 

[jq371]

yeah.... i stopped playing CIM2 months ago cause the pathfinding system was and CIMS were just frustrating watching them and it all making no sense......i came back to on the forum to see if there had been any game changes, but it seems not... i might get back into CIM2 one day, but for now, i dont have any interest which is sad.... not only is the pathfinding system annoying but I used to love parts of CIM1 with the moddable content etc, but except for DLC's thats all gone and i cant repaint my buses etc in the same livery like in the original.... there just isnt enough to keep me in at the moment....
dont get me wrong there are a lot of great things, the ruleset and street types etc, so maybe one day i'll have another crack....

 

[co_martsu]

yeah.... i stopped playing CIM2 months ago cause the pathfinding system was and CIMS were just frustrating watching them and it all making no sense......i came back to on the forum to see if there had been any game changes, but it seems not... i might get back into CIM2 one day, but for now, i dont have any interest which is sad.... not only is the pathfinding system annoying but I used to love parts of CIM1 with the moddable content etc, but except for DLC's thats all gone and i cant repaint my buses etc in the same livery like in the original.... there just isnt enough to keep me in at the moment....
dont get me wrong there are a lot of great things, the ruleset and street types etc, so maybe one day i'll have another crack....

It's very sad to hear this. The pathfinding works so that the citizens choose the most optimal route based on multiple factors (social groups, attractiveness, price, travel time, zones...) and sometimes changes in the network cause strange behaviour, if the route is interrupted. I would have hoped the engine would allow better modding, but CIM1 is definitely better for that. However I'm glad you found something interesting in Cities in Motion 2 also. I hope you'll come back to it one day

 

[jmr00]

I would have hoped the engine would allow better modding,

Would it be possible for something like a "skin" import/export function to be developed? For example, I click on bus 32, which is a comet sun, I click export, it exports the skin (in CIM 1 this was a DDS file) and I edit it in a paint program, and can then import that skin back into the game after editing? Maybe something to consider?

 

[Rick D]

The Network has been modified, however people still continued to take that route and never switched back to the old route

I'm all for helping to point out bugs however I don't currently have access to the Tech Support forums, I clicked on the link from your reply in my other thread and I got an access denied page

 

[Enzojz]

I am very disapointed that after even 6 months after the initial release, I still can't hide overground road in underground level, and the annoying grid.

At lease that should be an option, and I don't think it will be difficult, as a programmer of experience, I believe.

That just stop me from making underground trains, because that's not so beautiful as CIM

 

[unmerged(482071)]

I'm all for helping to point out bugs however I don't currently have access to the Tech Support forums, I clicked on the link from your reply in my other thread and I got an access denied page

You have to register your game first.

 

[kensternation]

It's very sad to hear this. The pathfinding works so that the citizens choose the most optimal route based on multiple factors (social groups, attractiveness, price, travel time, zones...) and sometimes changes in the network cause strange behaviour, if the route is interrupted. I would have hoped the engine would allow better modding, but CIM1 is definitely better for that. However I'm glad you found something interesting in Cities in Motion 2 also. I hope you'll come back to it one day

Again if the pathfinder system is working as planned, your plan sucks. I, for one do not take 5 separate vehicles on three separate lines when I can take two vehicles on two lines.

FIX THE DAMN SYSTEM AND STOP TELLING US IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It very clearly does not work and you are either deluding yourselves or lying. Which is it CO? If so many people are complaining about it maybe you should take another look, listen to the suggestions and modify it so it works according to the users rather than the programmers!

 

[ggjono]

Again if the pathfinder system is working as planned, your plan sucks. I, for one do not take 5 separate vehicles on three separate lines when I can take two vehicles on two lines.

FIX THE DAMN SYSTEM AND STOP TELLING US IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It very clearly does not work and you are either deluding yourselves or lying. Which is it CO? If so many people are complaining about it maybe you should take another look, listen to the suggestions and modify it so it works according to the users rather than the programmers!

1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+

 

[unmerged(721366)]

Again if the pathfinder system is working as planned, your plan sucks. I, for one do not take 5 separate vehicles on three separate lines when I can take two vehicles on two lines.

FIX THE DAMN SYSTEM AND STOP TELLING US IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It very clearly does not work and you are either deluding yourselves or lying. Which is it CO? If so many people are complaining about it maybe you should take another look, listen to the suggestions and modify it so it works according to the users rather than the programmers!

I do not support this kind of enunciation.

Of course there are a few things concerning CIM2 which can be improved, but i absolutely dislike that kind of yelling throughout the forums. That's childish. For me the pathfinding problems are not that kind of severe as you assume - although, of course, there is room for improvement.

But if you just accept perfectly designed games, and if you are not able to live with any compromises... then you should concentrate just on AAA titles and avoid any low budget productions.

Please, CO, keep on improving the game with the best possibilites you have.
It has a wonderful potential. And please do not feel demotivated from fans which are not able to critizise in an appropriate way.

 

[Misha_]

Again if the pathfinder system is working as planned, your plan sucks. I, for one do not take 5 separate vehicles on three separate lines when I can take two vehicles on two lines.

FIX THE DAMN SYSTEM AND STOP TELLING US IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It very clearly does not work and you are either deluding yourselves or lying. Which is it CO? If so many people are complaining about it maybe you should take another look, listen to the suggestions and modify it so it works according to the users rather than the programmers!

+1 * 100

I was very disappointed, when i bought the game. Almost no landmarks, useless timetables, stupid citizens (i.e. really bad pathfinding), many ui annoyances (e.g underground view without option to turn off the roads and net), and some awkward game design decisions (e.g. metro endings). I felt the game was little unfinished, so i didn't play and waited for some patches adding some missing content and fixing many things to be fixed.
But until now, half of year after release, nothing happens. Ok, something happens, but major issues - from my point of view - still not solved. And what's even worse, when read CO statements, i'm starting to lose any hope. Ok. If pathfinding works fine from developers point of view, maybe it really works fine. But not for me. I feel little cheated now. And so there is question, if i'll buy any other game from CO in future. I'm not sure for now. Sorry.

 

[kensternation]

I do not support this kind of enunciation.

Of course there are a few things concerning CIM2 which can be improved, but i absolutely dislike that kind of yelling throughout the forums. That's childish. For me the pathfinding problems are not that kind of severe as you assume - although, of course, there is room for improvement.

But if you just accept perfectly designed games, and if you are not able to live with any compromises... then you should concentrate just on AAA titles and avoid any low budget productions.

Please, CO, keep on improving the game with the best possibilites you have.
It has a wonderful potential. And please do not feel demotivated from fans which are not able to critizise in an appropriate way.

First, you are in the minority here. I do not need a perfect game. I need a game that does what it is designed to do.

Second, not that I need your approval, I started off not yelling (but you don't bother quoting me then, because it does not further your agenda), but when we are constantly lied to, it is time to up the ante. If you do not like my enunciation, then say what you have to say and move on. Why do I care that you dislike my yelling? I was not yelling at you, unless you work for CO, why do you care? What is childish, is complaining that someone is being mean. Are you going to run home to mommy?- there now I am being mean, childish and petty.

Third, if you are still reading my rant, it has been nearly 2 months since the last patch, and all we have heard from CO is that unless they have more details about what is wrong (which has been offered in many different ways) they can not fix the problems. People have been complaining since the game was put out that the pathfinding system does not work. CO is now telling us it does. What are we supposed to do? Say yes mommy I am so sorry to have troubled you? They already have our money so yelling is all I have.

 

[Steve B.]

I do not support this kind of enunciation.

Of course there are a few things concerning CIM2 which can be improved, but i absolutely dislike that kind of yelling throughout the forums. That's childish. For me the pathfinding problems are not that kind of severe as you assume - although, of course, there is room for improvement.

I agree. If you had paid $80 (or euros or pounds or whatever) for CIM2 (like some of us suckers did for the new SIM City) I could understand your outrage, but for 20 bucks this game has given me (and apparently many others) a lot of enjoyment. Twenty dollars (or whatever) doesn't give you the right to rant and rave at what is obviously a small, committed and caring development team.

That is not to say that your complaints are wrong; but a brief look at the forum shows how many more important problems with the game need to be fixed or improved. It is not just kensternation that doesn't take five different lines to get from one place to another, nobody does. Yes the pathfinding is bad but there are, in my opinion, other things that should be done first.

And, to get back on topic, not buying DLC is self defeating. CO is a business; they need sales to keep going. I, for one, will buy and have bought any and all DLCs that they develop. Support for the game is a two way street.

 

[vonhaubitz]

Again if the pathfinder system is working as planned, your plan sucks. I, for one do not take 5 separate vehicles on three separate lines when I can take two vehicles on two lines.

FIX THE DAMN SYSTEM AND STOP TELLING US IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It very clearly does not work and you are either deluding yourselves or lying. Which is it CO? If so many people are complaining about it maybe you should take another look, listen to the suggestions and modify it so it works according to the users rather than the programmers!

I would suggest you learn to behave yourself.

 

[kensternation]

Laughing. Ok I guess it is jump on KenSternation. I suppose I deserve it from people who have not seen my other posts. I have offered constructive help on other threads. I even started off on this topic doing the same. However cost has nothing to do with being lied to. I don't care if the game was free, don't lie. But thank you all for spanking me over my temper tantrum.

I understand CO is a small outfit and trust me I will likely never buy another EA game, but it is frustrating to me when you have something that can be great and the creators are satisfied with just ok. Just one short example "There could be 'official' transfer points, this way the CIM would not have to calculate and re-calculate for every single stop on the line." (that was posted by me here: (http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?689413-Passenger-intelligence/page3). The only answerfrom CO has been, the pathfinding system works as planned. That is the kind of non-answer you expect from a politician. If people are complaining about something, and I am not the only one complaining, then stop for a moment and say to yourself, time to change the plan. I still think another of my ideas is a good one. Why does the CIM have to recalculate the entire route every time they go from home to work, have the CIM remember the route and only recalculate if a line has changed. That has gone unanswered as well.

Open Transport is free and they take criticism better. But yes I will try to "behave" myself and try not to be so "childish" because it is so mature to call someone childish and to grow up. I will remember my mommy is here. lol

 

[timfrombriz]

Laughing. Ok I guess it is jump on KenSternation. I suppose I deserve it from people who have not seen my other posts. I have offered constructive help on other threads. I even started off on this topic doing the same. However cost has nothing to do with being lied to. I don't care if the game was free, don't lie. But thank you all for spanking me over my temper tantrum.

I understand CO is a small outfit and trust me I will likely never buy another EA game, but it is frustrating to me when you have something that can be great and the creators are satisfied with just ok. Just one short example "There could be 'official' transfer points, this way the CIM would not have to calculate and re-calculate for every single stop on the line." (that was posted by me here: (http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?689413-Passenger-intelligence/page3). The only answerfrom CO has been, the pathfinding system works as planned. That is the kind of non-answer you expect from a politician. If people are complaining about something, and I am not the only one complaining, then stop for a moment and say to yourself, time to change the plan. I still think another of my ideas is a good one. Why does the CIM have to recalculate the entire route every time they go from home to work, have the CIM remember the route and only recalculate if a line has changed. That has gone unanswered as well.

Open Transport is free and they take criticism better. But yes I will try to "behave" myself and try not to be so "childish" because it is so mature to call someone childish and to grow up. I will remember my mommy is here. lol

You Say...

I suppose I deserve it from people who have not seen my other posts

I frequent these forums and have seen every (as of the last few months) post from you, and as of late every post from you is an attack on CO and in no way diplomatic.

Further, You provide an example of your diplomatic behaviour;
"(that was posted by me here: (http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?689413-Passenger-intelligence/page3"

Look over it, because at no point did you contribute in a way other than throwing a tantrum, the exact link you provided is where I propose a solution to CO and they respond to MY solution. You immediately get back on your bandwagon and act like a tool.

This is a community forum, if you feel something isn't working, be diplomatic and not attacking, work together with the forum members 'constructively' not 'angrily' and help CO work to a solution.

The official CO response has been that changing the Pathfinding AI will modify gameplay behaviour that may affect existing players playstyle. The second part of their argument is that modifying the pathfinding will create more demand on memory overhead (an issue already with 32bit users) and CPU processing requirements.

Unless people want to demonstrate some clear bugs in the pathfinding that do not full into the category of 'pathfinding operating not as efficiently as could be humanly possible', such as this one at http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...ntent-DLC!&p=16187907&viewfull=1#post16187907 , then they need to provide a save game so CO call pull apart the exact moment these things happen and isolate what triggers this behaviour.