Stellaris Dev Diary #171 - Federations Stream

Stellaris Dev Diary #171 - Federations Stream

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Verx90

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isn't this ( the trailer) a type change from a galatic union to an egemony one ?
 

FleetingRain

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isn't this ( the trailer) a type change from a galatic union to an egemony one ?
What I understood is that the blue guys left the federation because of unjust terms and joined/formed a new one, declaring war on their ex-fellas.
 

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The +25% bonus to *all* resource production of non-President level-5-Hegemony member states will hopefully help a little bit in this regard. I normally vassalize empires just to lock down portions of the map when I play a Star Empire / Despotic Hegemony. The perks of the new Hegemony Federation look good enough that I will definitely be giving that a try. I think the bonus to member states is meant to address the problem you are discussing.
But don't you have to release your subject empires in order to form a Hegemony? So this wouldn't fix the issue with the vassal system.
 

Bankipriel

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But don't you have to release your subject empires in order to form a Hegemony? So this wouldn't fix the issue with the vassal system.
Hegemony functions just like vassals, except you get a ton of perks. There's no reason to claim vassals and numerous reasons to form a Hegemony. Which, I think is your point. But also mine. We're in agreement that vassals are worthless. I'm just saying, I think PDX has decided to "fix" vassals by offering a "Federation" type that is Hegemony, rather than change the base vassal mechanic.

I agree with you, that vassals are in need of fixing. In the mean time, the Hegemony "Federation" is doing everything I wanted vassals to do & more. *shrug*.
 

BlackUmbrellas

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Hegemony functions just like vassals, except you get a ton of perks. There's no reason to claim vassals and numerous reasons to form a Hegemony. Which, I think is your point. But also mine. We're in agreement that vassals are worthless. I'm just saying, I think PDX has decided to "fix" vassals by offering a "Federation" type that is Hegemony, rather than change the base vassal mechanic.

I agree with you, that vassals are in need of fixing. In the mean time, the Hegemony "Federation" is doing everything I wanted vassals to do & more. *shrug*.
Vassals need a rework for sure. I've been saying since we first learned about Hegemonies that they might as well just get rid of Feudal Society since the Hegemony origin does the same thing but better.
 

Joey3155

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Vassals need a rework for sure. I've been saying since we first learned about Hegemonies that they might as well just get rid of Feudal Society since the Hegemony origin does the same thing but better.
I think Feudal Society needs a rework so it serves a unique purpose. I don't think I want to sacrifice my origin pick every time I want to play with vassals. I'm gonna sit down and watch the replay I'm curious to see what they plan to do.
 

BlackUmbrellas

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I think Feudal Society needs a rework so it serves a unique purpose. I don't think I want to sacrifice my origin pick every time I want to play with vassals. I'm gonna sit down and watch the replay I'm curious to see what they plan to do.
Well, we know based on dev diary 141 (IIIRC) that they want "vassal contracts", which I would ASSUME would basically be the Federation Laws mechanism but applied to the relationship between vassal and overlord.
 

Pointyearedgit

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Thinking back on the stream I'm wondering:

1) We didn't see the details for the federation fleet laws. They said something about maybe tying the federation fleet size to the contribution law earlier. What is the new maximum, and if we reach it, do we still lose the excess naval capacity if our federation hits the max? Otherwise, what's the point of the contribution bonuses?

2) What is the cost of maintaining a federation, still 2 inf? I noticed 3 inf for the voor start, which would seem to indicate this is still the case (-50% for diplo tradition, 0.5 inf from authoritarian).

Hegemony functions just like vassals, except you get a ton of perks. There's no reason to claim vassals and numerous reasons to form a Hegemony. Which, I think is your point. But also mine. We're in agreement that vassals are worthless. I'm just saying, I think PDX has decided to "fix" vassals by offering a "Federation" type that is Hegemony, rather than change the base vassal mechanic.

I agree with you, that vassals are in need of fixing. In the mean time, the Hegemony "Federation" is doing everything I wanted vassals to do & more. *shrug*.
Especially since the hegemony master doesn't have to pay into the Federation fleet.
 

mirco297

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If the Feudal Society civic gets a rework I hope it expands the options in creating vassals.

For example:
- Allow for the creation of civilizations that are not complete copies of their overlord.
It doesn't have to mean that you have to be able to choose from all Ethics/Civics, only those that are present in the population of the released territory.
And with those different ethics also other civics and government types.
Releasing vassals that also have the exact same civics, ethics and government type as their overlord is often not the desired outcome when I play as Feudal Society empire.

I like the Hegemony federation type. And it adds a lot of things I once hoped the Feudal Society civic would provide.
Now that most of those aspects are met. I think a direction of vassal creation would be one of the few ways that Feudal Society would be able to stand out and be worth while.
This freedom with vassal creation would fit greatly with the new option of releasing a vassal and letting it go in order to start a Hegemony.
 

Malecord

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If the Feudal Society civic gets a rework I hope it expands the options in creating vassals.

For example:
- Allow for the creation of civilizations that are not complete copies of their overlord.
It doesn't have to mean that you have to be able to choose from all Ethics/Civics, only those that are present in the population of the released territory.
And with those different ethics also other civics and government types.
Releasing vassals that also have the exact same civics, ethics and government type as their overlord is often not the desired outcome when I play as Feudal Society empire.

I like the Hegemony federation type. And it adds a lot of things I once hoped the Feudal Society civic would provide.
Now that most of those aspects are met. I think a direction of vassal creation would be one of the few ways that Feudal Society would be able to stand out and be worth while.
This freedom with vassal creation would fit greatly with the new option of releasing a vassal and letting it go in order to start a Hegemony.
Though releasing vassals with exactly your ethos is what you need with any federation, including hegemony, due to the cohesion mechanic.
 

Indignation211

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Though releasing vassals with exactly your ethos is what you need with any federation, including hegemony, due to the cohesion mechanic.
Imposing Ideology on other empires should also work for that purpose. In the case of a naturally Authoritarian Hegemony you probably want to go that route instead of the "Expand Hegemony" CB when dealing with an Egalitarian empire as you don't want that conflicting ethic in your Hegemony. If ethics attraction work as intended then being in a Federation of any kind with an Egalitarian member creates Egalitarian attraction in your empire. Same if you are Materialist and the target is Spiritualist.

That said the devs probably intend for a Hegemony to have to devote most if not all of their Envoys to maintaining cohesion to counter diverse ethics and thus have less to devote to the Galactic Community. Whether that's good or bad balancing remains to be seen.
 

klingonadmiral

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Does the blue alien guy realize that he is just another rung for those that climb the endless ladder of profit?

warprofiteers.png
 

Spaceception

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Vassals need a rework for sure. I've been saying since we first learned about Hegemonies that they might as well just get rid of Feudal Society since the Hegemony origin does the same thing but better.
Yup, or instead of outright removal, do the same thing that happened to Corporate Dominion, and remove it for people who have Federations. Then give Feudal society some of Hegemony's bonuses and mechanics. Doesn't have to be a lot, but something more than it currently has.
 

Bankipriel

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Especially since the hegemony master doesn't have to pay into the Federation fleet.
It's actually better than that. They add to the Federation fleet *BUT* don't actually subtract the added value from their own empire fleet cap.

At least, that was my understanding from the stream.
 

mirco297

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Though releasing vassals with exactly your ethos is what you need with any federation, including hegemony, due to the cohesion mechanic.
True, it would not be optimal for federation cohesion. But it would make the vassal often more stable.
For example:
If I play as a xenophobic empire and want to make vassal out of a just conquered part which has multiple species.
Because of my ethics the empire will end up enslaving all species that aren't the main species.
Which over results in planets being full of a species with citizenship or having only slaves duo to a different preference in habitability.
Not to mention the dissatisfaction of most if not all pops because they don't follow the government ethics.
If one is able to alter the ethics of their would be vassal, this problem would be resolved.
Also, this prevents empires from having starting civics that don't actually work for them, most of the civics that have this issue currently will become origins though.

The opinion boost of releasing a vassal is often more than enough of becoming a federation member. They don't need to have the exact same ethics, it sometimes would even make it easier.

But you got a point. There would be a drawback to differing ethics.
 

Abominus

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They generally come out somewhere between 3 and 5 hours from now.

Why isn't this Dev-Diary pinned?
Thanks, I was curious, because normally they say "next week, we talk about blah blah..." that is missing here.

And yes, that second part, the not-is-pinned is something I havent understood last week (170), they pinned it later.