I guess that's what @CplKatie meant when he/she/it wrote about "imposing political nonsense into a game".
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I guess that's what @CplKatie meant when he/she/it wrote about "imposing political nonsense into a game".
Thank you....
Now I comment...
History is full of awesome women warriors doing awesome women warrior stuff. Awesome queens that ruled as both benevolently or tyrannically as kings. *Boudicca!!* Nothing is barring a female leader expect historical cultures that didn't have female leaders. Historically women worked alongside men. Unless you were a noble women or royalty. Crusader Kings 2 is a historical roleplaying game and grand strategy mix. You are managing a bloodline through warfare, treachery, intrigue, and life. I would like to face off against female commander or a mercenary captain. I would like to command a female vizier to fabricate a claim. But I understand I am playing a game set in the early to late middle ages. And during that time period while queens holding power in the court was a common. Women on the battlefield was a rarity.
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I'll reserve judgement until I see how it actually works in practice.
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I assume your talking about first marriages. Once a heir is secure, regular marriages can be a powerful tool to exploit.
As an aside, it is amusing how threatened some in this community are by mechanics they know nothing about.
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Never mind they can just keep it set to traditional and ignore that part of the window entirely.
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We don't know the specifics, I immagine that it's going to either require very specific conditions or be more or less political suicide. But I like being given the option. Would be nice if other countries had opinions about your laws, for an example pushing women's rights might negativly affect your opinion with everyone who hasn't.
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I once read in a book. If you look at a culture's gods you could tell a lot about that culture and what it valued. Most poly-thesis culture are easy. Goddesses and Gods played alongside each other. Goddesses had their intrigue their violence their glory just like the gods. I am going to use my favorite myths Egyptian and Greek/Roman. Why would a culture that treated women poorly allow their goddesses free reign? Goddesses like Athena and Sekemet punished men for transgression without reprisal. Hathor was saved the world in one myth. Aphrodite fucked every god under Zeus behind her husband's back and was praised. Hera punished or killed or tortured Zeus' lovers and not once did he stop her. She made his demigod children suffer fates unfathomable. Not a word against her was spoken by anyone. Why would there be goddesses at all?
While I know it doesn't work in the game world it should help you make real world comparisons help you draw you own conclusions.
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Stay classy Pdox forums. Need I remind everyone that I. the game isn't just Western European in focus and II. we can do things like reform Norse paganism and have demon babies, but the prospect of women having equal inheritance and ruling rights is completely unimaginable.
It's an option. If you don't like it, don't pick it. I can't imagine the AI will be picking it often or at all.
It's an option. If you don't like it, don't pick it. I can't imagine the AI will be picking it often or at all.
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Pretty much guaranteed it's just a redesigned UI for what's already in the game (at least I hope so):
Level 1 (Traditional) -- Absolute Cognatic
Level 2 -- Agnatic Cognatic
Level 3 -- Absolute Agnatic
Level 4 -- Absolute Agnatic No Opinion Penalty
Level 5 (Full) -- Absolute Agnatic No Opinion Penalty / Women can lead armies
Level 1 is only option for Tribal, Nomadic, etc. Level 5 only possible for Cathars. Basque, Messalian, etc. are level 4. It would be pretty lame if tribal Khans started having women lead armies because they passed 'laws'.
Level 1 (Traditional) -- Absolute Cognatic
Level 2 -- Agnatic Cognatic
Level 3 -- Absolute Agnatic
Level 4 -- Absolute Agnatic No Opinion Penalty
Level 5 (Full) -- Absolute Agnatic No Opinion Penalty / Women can lead armies
Level 1 is only option for Tribal, Nomadic, etc. Level 5 only possible for Cathars. Basque, Messalian, etc. are level 4. It would be pretty lame if tribal Khans started having women lead armies because they passed 'laws'.
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Nitpicking but you switched the meanings of agnatic and cognatic, it should be the opposite.
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We should wait and see. If it has appropriate advantages and drawbacks, good. I like the idea of being able to give talented women a place on my council, it's something that happened historically, and not all Medieval states had the same attitudes towards women. It also provides a mechanical way to keep certain titles Agnatic for a longer period. Going to far to the right of the scale with most cultures and religions should start having huge opinion penalties as well as piety and prestige losses.
If it turns out it's a mechanic to have 1st and 2nd wave feminism in 1250AD, then we can start mocking it.
If it turns out it's a mechanic to have 1st and 2nd wave feminism in 1250AD, then we can start mocking it.
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Yup, you're right. Sorry, I was trying to look up 'that other weird woman heresy' (Messalian) while I was typing it.
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Yup, you're right. Sorry, I was trying to look up 'that other weird woman heresy' (Messalian) while I was typing it.
This is as good a time to point out that, unlike what CK II would have you believe, we don't actually know much about what the Messalians believed. All the stuff about Satan worship and family orgies came from their enemies.
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World Conquest in one year = You legend !
Restore the Roman Empire and conquer the known world = Great stuff !
Reform the Germanic Faith, obliterate Catholicism and kill the Pope at a blot = No issues !
Conquer all of Britannia as Aztec invader in 1320 AD (ie before a unified Aztec realm even existed) = What's the problem ?
Become Caliph, Saoshyant, Fylkir, Sayyid, Viking, Crusader - simultaneously = Why did PDX make this so hard to do ?
Allow different realms to have different levels of status for women in society =
WTF ? PC POLICE ! THIS GAME SUX ! PDX BOWING TO FEMINAZI PRESSURE ! GIVE ME BACK MY CONCUBINES ! HAXXXORRZZZZ !!!!!
Restore the Roman Empire and conquer the known world = Great stuff !
Reform the Germanic Faith, obliterate Catholicism and kill the Pope at a blot = No issues !
Conquer all of Britannia as Aztec invader in 1320 AD (ie before a unified Aztec realm even existed) = What's the problem ?
Become Caliph, Saoshyant, Fylkir, Sayyid, Viking, Crusader - simultaneously = Why did PDX make this so hard to do ?
Allow different realms to have different levels of status for women in society =
WTF ? PC POLICE ! THIS GAME SUX ! PDX BOWING TO FEMINAZI PRESSURE ! GIVE ME BACK MY CONCUBINES ! HAXXXORRZZZZ !!!!!
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It's a strawman, but some of the objections are rather overwrought too wouldn't you say? Like, the whole SJW thing and 20th century feminism stuff -- I think everybody involved knows that's not what we're getting, so why bring it up?
Like, I'm pretty sure that "full" equality is basically just cognatic with some possible refinements like republics (possibly no longer hardcoded??). Actually ideally it wouldn't even be cognatic, but would open up the *option* for cognatic -- it'd be interesting to have essentially agnatic-cognatic but still be able to have landed women.
Like, I'm pretty sure that "full" equality is basically just cognatic with some possible refinements like republics (possibly no longer hardcoded??). Actually ideally it wouldn't even be cognatic, but would open up the *option* for cognatic -- it'd be interesting to have essentially agnatic-cognatic but still be able to have landed women.
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It's not. all the succession laws are still on the same tab. You can see it in that shot and we already got a shot of what the new succession law interface with be in a previous dev diary:
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I hope it has opinion penalties from traditional minded males and females that slowly lower with each subsequent generation.
What breaks immersion for me is that I can have 5 generations of warrior queens that pretty much shatter Muslim dominance of the Iberian peninsula (bringing many lands under their rule and making them properly Christian again) and break the back of the Sunni Caliphate which causes it to fall apart drastically yet vassals and such balk at the thought of another warrior queen. One from a family known by all of Christendom to be amazing Holy Warriors, leading their armies themselves. What continues to break my immersion is that after over a century of female rule, my queen/empress cannot fight alongside her similarly martial trained daughters and heir (nor any other close, female relation) despite the fact that the heir, at least, will be able to lead armies instantly when she becomes queen/empress. Despite the fact that my female rulers have proven themselves to be the betters or equals of the men of the realm, they still freak out at the thought of a woman on the throne despite one having been so as long as they've lived and is the NORM for the kingdom/empire.
It is my hope that this new law will help make such situations less ridiculous.
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