States - the smallest map piece?

[ASAD]

Is there possibility that each state is divided into smaller pieces of land, like territories in IR, or the state is base land piece?

I'm bit confused with information I could find here. In lat DD it's said that buildings are build on state basis even that which produces goods, so the are no particular smaller pieces of land in which resources/goods are farmed/gathered/mined?

 

[Heatth]

There ought to be a better way to make clear to people that a lot of their questions have been asnwer3ed already...

Yes, states are divided into smaller pieces of land. State will be the smaler unit you can directly interact with (for pops, building, etc), but it is made of a number of provinces and, in certain circumstances, can be split into two or more smaller states.

 

[ASAD]

I meant what is province/territory (smaller piece of land than state). Will be cities there (or there will several cities per state not conected with exact province)? Will provinces be places where POP's live? Or the will only a pieces of land where army can move?

 

[Acacias]

I meant what is province/territory (smaller piece of land than state). Will be cities there (or there will several cities per state not conected with exact province)? Will provinces be places where POP's live? Or the will only a pieces of land where army can move?

From what I understand it, it will work similar to HOI4. States are the smallest economically significat units you can interact politically and economically with. Provinces will be subdivisions of a state that are probably used almost exclusively for moving armies around. Yes some of these provinces will have cities on them, but you cannot interact with them out side the state its in. These cities will be in a province to delinieate where an army can capture the city. Like others said above however, certain treateis allow you to split a state into smaller states, like a treaty port.

 

[Heatth]

I meant what is province/territory (smaller piece of land than state). Will be cities there (or there will several cities per state not conected with exact province)? Will provinces be places where POP's live? Or the will only a pieces of land where army can move?

Provinces will be more than where the army can move, buildings are in individual provinces (though you build in the state), as are cities. An state can be divided and, thus, the provinces are relevant for that. I believe it was also said colonization is per province. POPs don't seem to live in provinces, though, they live in the state (if the state is split, it is then calculated where each POP is).

 

[kviiri]

From what I understand it, it will work similar to HOI4. States are the smallest economically significat units you can interact politically and economically with. Provinces will be subdivisions of a state that are probably used almost exclusively for moving armies around. Yes some of these provinces will have cities on them, but you cannot interact with them out side the state its in. These cities will be in a province to delinieate where an army can capture the city. Like others said above however, certain treateis allow you to split a state into smaller states, like a treaty port.

An important distinction from HoI 4 is indeed like you say, that Vicky 3 has been said to support splitting a single "State Area" into two states in peace treaties. This possibility was specifically mentioned as applying to treaty ports, so it remains unconfirmed how versatile this system will be.

 

[Sparticulous]

I hope the smallest piece is provinces like in imperator. And where we can take whole states or individual provinces like that game. I dont want all of random x provinces. Also hopefully the provinces follow important rivers and land marks

 

[JBolt]

I meant what is province/territory (smaller piece of land than state). Will be cities there (or there will several cities per state not conected with exact province)? Will provinces be places where POP's live? Or the will only a pieces of land where army can move?

Sadly it looks like Victoria 3 only shows you pops at a state-wide level. You can’t see them in just Dublin or Wexford as you did in Victoria 2 (which is much more granular and close-up), now you can only see them in the state of Leinster. Whereas in Vic2 you could see population in like 10 different Irish provinces, now you only see them in a much more zoomed-out 3 states. Instead of having a pop move from Dublin to New York City, you have a pop move from Leinster to somewhere in New York State. It’s a huge step back, if I’m reading everything right.

 

[Ottoman Master]

Sadly it looks like Victoria 3 only shows you pops at a state-wide level. You can’t see them in just Dublin or Wexford as you did in Victoria 2 (which is much more granular and close-up), now you can only see them in the state of Leinster. Whereas in Vic2 you could see population in like 10 different Irish provinces, now you only see them in a much more zoomed-out 3 states. Instead of having a pop move from Dublin to New York City, you have a pop move from Leinster to somewhere in New York State. It’s a huge step back, if I’m reading everything right.

Yeah, it's unfortunately one of the areas they're going backwards on.

 

[JKComposer]

Sadly it looks like Victoria 3 only shows you pops at a state-wide level. You can’t see them in just Dublin or Wexford as you did in Victoria 2 (which is much more granular and close-up), now you can only see them in the state of Leinster. Whereas in Vic2 you could see population in like 10 different Irish provinces, now you only see them in a much more zoomed-out 3 states. Instead of having a pop move from Dublin to New York City, you have a pop move from Leinster to somewhere in New York State. It’s a huge step back, if I’m reading everything right.

A small thing, but Ireland now has 4 states in Vic3 instead of 3.

 

[ASAD]

Sadly it looks like Victoria 3 only shows you pops at a state-wide level. You can’t see them in just Dublin or Wexford as you did in Victoria 2 (which is much more granular and close-up), now you can only see them in the state of Leinster. Whereas in Vic2 you could see population in like 10 different Irish provinces, now you only see them in a much more zoomed-out 3 states. Instead of having a pop move from Dublin to New York City, you have a pop move from Leinster to somewhere in New York State. It’s a huge step back, if I’m reading everything right.

Exactly this is my concern. But as far as I know it was only said that we could deal with POP's on state basis but not that they will "live" on state basis. At least I understand it that way.

 

[Heatth]

Sadly it looks like Victoria 3 only shows you pops at a state-wide level. You can’t see them in just Dublin or Wexford as you did in Victoria 2 (which is much more granular and close-up), now you can only see them in the state of Leinster. Whereas in Vic2 you could see population in like 10 different Irish provinces, now you only see them in a much more zoomed-out 3 states. Instead of having a pop move from Dublin to New York City, you have a pop move from Leinster to somewhere in New York State. It’s a huge step back, if I’m reading everything right.

In many cases it is a step back, but in these examples, it is frankly, not. Truth to be told, the distribution of population within a state in Vic 2 was kinda meaningless. For starter, you couldn't interact with it, all your tools effected state level, not province level. The main thing the population distribution did was restrict where a farmer or laborer could find a job, meaning they had to migrate internally if they wanted to change, but that isn't really necessarily a good thing or a particularly interesting mechanic, all it amount to was the coolness of having more granularity to see where your pops lived, but even that was a bit flawed; You talked about "Dublin" and "New York", but in Vic 2 these provinces didn't really represent the city (actually, maybe NY did, but not Dublin), they represented a huge area around it. A farmer in Dublin might as well be a farmer in Leinster, given they aren't from the city itself.

In Vic 3, meanwhile, altough the pop aren't distributed by province, their place of work are. You can actually see the buildings on the map, and said buildings have employees. The employees likely live in the same province and, given that provinces are smaller, in a sense Vic 3 has more granularity than Vic 2.

Which is not to say the system is perfect. I think One Proud Bavaria put it best when he was concerned about the lack of ways to represent minorities regionalisms. Having the population be able to work anywhere in the state solve some weird problems with Vic 2 system but it does sacrifice some flavor and make it harder to represent some situations. That said, I think people see this is a more radical departure from the Vic 2 system than what it is in reality. In piratical terms Vic 2 also dealt almost entirely with states, not provinces, so Vic 3 is just cleaning the system by making it more uniformly state centered, instead of state centered with a few weird exceptions.

 

[Acacias]

Yeah, it's unfortunately one of the areas they're going backwards on.

If I were to make a guess, ill say this was done to maximise preformance, having pops operate only on state limtis the number of calculations significantlly. Consdiergin how stellaris preformance tanked with the introduction of pops, and how vicky 3 will have pops do many more things, i can accept provinces being sacrificed. This si just my guess however

 

[Thure]

Sadly it causes some issues like some border regions. Regions like Sleswig where it would be important in which province which ethnicity lives, can't be represented well with this system. Also Alsace Lorraine will be problematic. Historically Alsace had more Germans than Lorraine, ingame it will look way more mixed because they will put Alsace and Lorraine in the same State most likely.

 

[EUnderhill]

At least in principle, couldn't a motivated group of modders rework the states to have 1-2 provinces each?

 

[Sbrubbles]

Sadly it looks like Victoria 3 only shows you pops at a state-wide level. You can’t see them in just Dublin or Wexford as you did in Victoria 2 (which is much more granular and close-up), now you can only see them in the state of Leinster. Whereas in Vic2 you could see population in like 10 different Irish provinces, now you only see them in a much more zoomed-out 3 states. Instead of having a pop move from Dublin to New York City, you have a pop move from Leinster to somewhere in New York State. It’s a huge step back, if I’m reading everything right.

Wasn't that pretty much a cosmetic thing in Vic2? I don't recall many instances where it actually mattered, except for building infrastructure in the province with highest income first (which didn't matter much because you would eventually build everywhere in the state), and, of course, in terms of troop movement.

 

[JBolt]

Wasn't that pretty much a cosmetic thing in Vic2? I don't recall many instances where it actually mattered, except for building infrastructure in the province with highest income first (which didn't matter much because you would eventually build everywhere in the state), and, of course, in terms of troop movement.

Province-level modifiers, railroads and naval bases, occupation in one province at a time, RGO employment in one province at a time, and just in general losing complexity and game depth, as well as losing cultural regions and majority minority regions.

 

[Sbrubbles]

Province-level modifiers, railroads and naval bases, occupation in one province at a time, RGO employment in one province at a time, and just in general losing complexity and game depth, as well as losing cultural regions and majority minority regions.

Those were things that existed, but they didn´t really affect gameplay (aside from moving troops and building infrastructure in the highest income province before the others), hence, cosmetic.

I mean, sure, I don't mind more cosmetic things in the game. Flavor really makes a good experience into a great one.