State of Stellaris forums

[maxp779]

I know it sounds childish, but I'm getting real tired of posts 'my performance is okay, don't see any problem' with no references to both hardware and timers. All you have to do is to tell us how much time it takes for your game to progress one month on fastest speed and your PC specs. Because everyone have different definition of what's acceptable performance. Hell, I had a friend, waaay back, once he played Need For Speed 3 when I came over. Game had around 20 FPS, I was shocked. I said - man, how can you even? And he said - nah, it's fine by me.
But that's the thing, there are reasonable slowdowns and there are unreasonable ones. The border is thin, sure. And quite personal and subjective. But then again - we have a starting line in regards to game performance, literally the start of the game. If game slows down 3 to 5 times - it'd call that unreasonable slowdown.
That's all there is to the issue of performance. I'm baffled how people make it to be something else. About various styles of play, or work ethics, or forum communication or some other stuff.
This, plus AI - again, it's not about how different people play the game, it's about AI inability to play the game. Since this game have an enemy AI and not a sandbox - we expect some form of competition on AI side. And that doesn't happen - you can see it for yourself very easily using observer mode.
These two things make a game borderline unplayable. Could someone enjoy the game in current state (vanilla)? Sure. People could derive enjoyment from such a vast array of activities, it's actually difficult to find one that's can't be found as enjoying to at least someone. But that doesn't make it okay.
And the last thing - I really can't say that the vast majority of players are exhibiting some extreme forms of anger towards devs. People are really understandably pissed - that's all there is to it. Posts like this make it look like only some angry unreasonable minority of really poor people with 'strange' ideas on how games should be played are the ones complaining. So, one could say that it's things like these posts that try to invalidate the claims others have.

Agreed. However I can already see the slew of people coming back with "but I don't play on fastest so why does it matter?" with an argument ensuing and no progress made to ascertain their definition of playable.

 

[Mr Thursday]

In space no one can hear your screams of frustration...

 

[Darkrenown]

I actually hope Darkrenown will not have trouble for the post he made.

Nah

 

[stnylan]

Just for the record (given that many people seem to not have realised it) in my original post I wrote the following

"I am finding it very frustrating that so many people here seem to be saying there is only one way to play this game. Some people say you have to play it on 1000-size galaxy and fastest and everyone who isn't has an illegimiate point of view. Some people say that if you are having issues you should play on slower speeds or a smaller galaxy. The Stellaris forums these last few weeks have taken a distinctly vile turn."

I thought that made it plain I was getting irritated by people who insisted that people having issues on larger/faster playthroughs should change how they want to play as much as I was getting irritated by the reverse. It is, perhaps, a sad reflection of where things are in that this was so often missed.

Likewise I think there is a misunderstanding that just because I am enjoying the game that I am not encountering bugs, or that I don't want them fixed. Of course I do. Much as I have enjoyed my playing of Stellaris the last few weeks, that does not mean the experience could not be significantly improved by certain (well-known) issues being addressed. Or that I am saying people shouldn't complain. But there are ways and ways of complaining. And too much of the language in these forums has been, as I said, vile. It makes this place unpleasant.

And regardless of any issues with the game, these boards should not be unpleasant.

 

[Spacemadnesss]

And regardless of any issues with the game, these boards should not be unpleasant.

The thing is that "issues with the game" aren't the impetus for the dire lack of civility over the past month. The reasons for the severe unpleasantness is the context in which these issues came into being in the first place. This context unfortunately involved the motivations and interactions of one party with another. It is not just about the game bring broken, it is about people taking offense at what has occurred. In a situation in which it is reasonable for people to take offense at the situation they've been put into by another party, it is not entirely rational to expect things to remain wholly pleasant. And so it hasn't.

Customer complaints levied at businesses are unlikely to be entirely so, yet for some reason the expectations of videogame businesses are that they as a whole are our buddies, friends, fellow travelers and shouldn't be complained about in the way customers complain about faulty products or failing service. I understand this mentality. The developers are doing their best to make Stellaris great and they probably want to be friendly with the community and that's a great thing of the internet era. Unfortunately for them and for us to a lesser degree they are our only line of communication with the business as a whole. I am frustrated with this and i'm entirely sure some people are much more frustrated than I am with this situation. I do not want to sling snark at folks who are blameless, I really don't and I'm sorry if anything I've said has caused distress.

With that said however, the unpleasantness has a cause and it is neither the people being unpleasant or the people unfortunate enough to have to read it.

 

[stnylan]

I just don't buy that. People are still responsible for their own actions. Being provoked by another's action or inaction is rarely regarded as a good excuse for one's own action.

Look I understand why folks are annoyed. I wish the game was in a better state too. But I can't really do anything about that.

I am disappointed people seem to take that annoyance out on people who hold a different view from their own. That is not the behaviour I generally associate with this community. And just perhaps through this thread I can do a very little (I won't kid myself it will be more) about that .

 

[Spacemadnesss]

Edit: I suppose we're coming at this from two different perspectives. This is your community, going by your post count you're quite fond of it. Meanwhile I sporadically check in for how-to guides and to ask questions. When I began posting in december it was to complain about the state of the game. While i'm sorry for ruining your forum experience, there is unfortunately no other place to talk to the folks behind Stellaris. Once the game is patched up i'm sure it'll go back to how it was.

You're kind of talking about two different things and swapping them as if they're interchangeable, they're not. In one some of the users are levying complaints at the business they feel did something wrong. In the other users are being unpleasant towards each-other regarding the details of the complaints. They share the root cause, but they're not the same and to posit it as such is muddying the issue.

We're on the forum for a business that sells a product. When a product is deemed to be lacking by any single or multitude of users there is no reason why they should remain quiet about it even if any number of other users have already said what they're saying, that is or rather should be their right as a consumer. That right does not extend to abusing people in any way shape or form. However, using vaguely insulting language or sarcasm to criticize the business or practices thereof does not in my eyes meet the standards of abuse.

I do not understand the perspective of some individual consumers who rather than letting other consumers voice their displeasure feel the need to try to keep the peace so things are "nice" on a forum for a product that is currently non functional. And yes I understand half of the programs on the washing machine still work and that this is all you need or ever use, however I would implore you to feel some empathy towards those people who cannot currently wash their clothes after paying for a new machine just last month. They might be a bit cross with you for deciding to mention that you're not having any issues.

 

[stnylan]

I am not stopping anyone make justified complaints about the state of the game. I would have hoped that would be clear by now.

I am objecting to language and behaviour that makes this forum an unfriendly place. There are a goodly number of ways to register one's dis-satisfaction with the current situation without making a public venue an unpleasant place for others to be. There are even some quite creative ways of doing so. I remember back when Alpha Centauri was released 20 plus years ago there was this great thread on the Firaxis forums where someone created a little short story that ended with the error that kept crashing his game. As I recall several others joined in and did somethign similar. It was a really effective way for those folks to get their frustration with the situation across, and actually contributed to that forum and that time being a generally nice place.

And if you look back through this thread you will see a fair few people assume what I am saying, rather than actually read what I am saying, and make points that argue a strawman. I won't say it is a deluge, but it speaks to an unhealthy situation where people think they have a licence to rant and rave just because they are a mite annoyed. It pollutes so many threads at the moment and it is just plain un-necessary.