Spanish/Argentinean events

[Gen.Schuermann]

I was wondering, if NatSpa or Arg ever wanted to go Axis.
This would make things quite easier, and more interesting. But as we all know, they didn't join (as far as i know ^^), maybe because of some events like the war with RepSpa was so exhausting or Arg being frightened of Brazil.
In the original version, there was a "Platinean War" scenario, Brazil vs. Argentina, so maybe one would do some research and include this as an event, with a low successrate, however. This would be like Germany supporting Arg, and America supporting Brazil, if i am correct. The two countries would either join the Allies or the Axis if they won.

For NAtSpa, it would be the nice thought of holding Gibraltar, the prospect of getting funds from Germany (just like support the Revolutioners event), and therefore controlling who's coming in or out of the mediterranean sea.

Just a thought, though...

 

[ArmdChair]

It might be interesting, if Brazil was ever allowed to join the Allies.

In the HoI 1 version of CORE I saw Argentina join the Axis quite often while playing as the USA. It was rarely profitable for Argentina as the USA was able to annex them fairly easily. Though, I will say that the Argentine fleet would always come out to challenge the USA invasion fleets and make it interesting.

Historically, I think the USA spent a lot of influence dissuading the Argentines (or any other American country) from aiding the Axis. There would have to be a rather large incentive for any American country to join the Axis alliance.

 

[baylox]

It could be a nice incentive to force the US player to spend the time, money and effort to keep good relations with the South American countries in general in order to keep them away from the Axis (during their pre-war years), otherwise they might join up (and the US shouldn't just be able to go around annexing minor nations either...).

 

[ArmdChair]

I agree completely, Baylox. The USA should be encouraged to spend some wealth in keeping the other American nations out of the Axis (unless the USA joins the Axis themselves, heh, heh). Anything that keeps the USA from running rampant economically is good for the game. The relationships between the OAS states seems to be under-utilised/represented in both HoI and CORE.

I only annexed the Argentines because I was a member of the Allies and currently at war with the Axis. It probably wasn't the Argentine AI's best moment to opt to join the Axis when the USA was already part of the Allies and the Soviets were as yet undefeated.

 

[JRaup]

As regards South and Central America, the Lend-Lease event chain will heavilly influence all those nations towrds the USA. I also believe that we will reintroduce the Hendaya Meeting chain as well for NatSpain.

One of the problems here is the AI influence settings. Easy enough to adjust so that the USA continually influences the Western Hemisphere.

 

[baylox]

I assume Lend-Lease will cost the US money (and other things) this time around?

 

[McNaughton]

I would like the politics of the region to be better developed. Argentina wasn't alone, it was fairly closely allied with Paraguay (who recently had substantial war experience after the Chaco War), and I believe that other nations would form on one side or the other. I think it would be good to allow for possible events in South Amercia, between the Germans and Americans, regarding possibl entries into the war. Germany would want nations to join the fight, while the US would be keen on keeping nations neutral.

 

[JRaup]

I assume Lend-Lease will cost the US money (and other things) this time around?

The concept ATM is that the USA will pay out in terms of supplies and Cash, while the minor nations will receive supplies and "training" (mainly Blue Prints). Plus some relations adjustments as nations sign on to the agreement. Some will also get moves towards a DOW on one or both of the main Axis powers, based more or less on historical date and current relations and slider settings.

 

[JRaup]

I would like the politics of the region to be better developed. Argentina wasn't alone, it was fairly closely allied with Paraguay (who recently had substantial war experience after the Chaco War), and I believe that other nations would form on one side or the other. I think it would be good to allow for possible events in South Amercia, between the Germans and Americans, regarding possibl entries into the war. Germany would want nations to join the fight, while the US would be keen on keeping nations neutral.

In general agreed. The main "alliance" leaders would be (IMO) Argentina and Brazil. But lets not go overboard on handling this via event. There's a lot that can and should be done through the AI first, then cover what can't be handled that way by event.

 

[Kretoxian]

I read somewhere that the most punished foreign comunity in the japanese captured philipines was the spanish comunity.
And that made general franco to think about declaring war to japan (joining the allies of course).
This could be in CORE using an event, couldn't it?

 

[Zer00]

It might be interesting, if Brazil was ever allowed to join the Allies.

In the HoI 1 version of CORE I saw Argentina join the Axis quite often while playing as the USA. It was rarely profitable for Argentina as the USA was able to annex them fairly easily. Though, I will say that the Argentine fleet would always come out to challenge the USA invasion fleets and make it interesting.

Historically, I think the USA spent a lot of influence dissuading the Argentines (or any other American country) from aiding the Axis. There would have to be a rather large incentive for any American country to join the Axis alliance.

Well, A relatively large flaw is that Brazil doesn't have events to join the Allies (historically joined after the torpedoing of a couple of boats in '42).

The US muscled many central and south american countries to join the allies, if not only in just writing. Brazil contributed significantly and sent a expiditionary fighter squadron which saw heavy action in Italy and participated in many famous battles (including the attempts to take Monte Cassino). Also a 25,000 man force was sent to fight in Italy.

According to this wikipedia article most latin american countries had declared war on the axis before the wars' end. However, most of their contributions were irrelevant, and as I said before it was only a political play. Besides Argentina, countries such as Paraguay and Chile had a large right-wing, facist base that I'm sure that given the right conditions wouldn't have hesitated to join the axis in order to reap some benefits. A chain of events, perhaps an event in which Brazil joins the allies, could lead the Latin American countries to declare war on Brazil and to join the axis....

 

[McNaughton]

Well, A relatively large flaw is that Brazil doesn't have events to join the Allies (historically joined after the torpedoing of a couple of boats in '42).

The US muscled many central and south american countries to join the allies, if not only in just writing. Brazil contributed significantly and sent a expiditionary fighter squadron which saw heavy action in Italy and participated in many famous battles (including the attempts to take Monte Cassino). Also a 25,000 man force was sent to fight in Italy.

According to this wikipedia article most latin american countries had declared war on the axis before the wars' end. However, most of their contributions were irrelevant, and as I said before it was only a political play. Besides Argentina, countries such as Paraguay and Chile had a large right-wing, facist base that I'm sure that given the right conditions wouldn't have hesitated to join the axis in order to reap some benefits. A chain of events, perhaps an event in which Brazil joins the allies, could lead the Latin American countries to declare war on Brazil and to join the axis....

CORE does not want the world to be run via events. Many other mods take this and run with it, but, things like battles, ship sinkings, etc. are not to be modelled in CORE, and are left up to the players/AI to do so. To get Brazil into the Allied camp, you have to spend money convincing it diplomatically. It wouldn't be fair to have an event that has ships sunk which causes Brazil to join the war. What if Germany has no subs anywhere near Brazilian vessels? What if Germany docked all their subs for a year? Most things will be done via the system, and not through events. Things that cannot be done through the 'system', will be covered in events (such as getting Polish escapees joining the British Army after the fall of Poland).

 

[Captain Frakas]

Things that cannot be done through the 'system', will be covered in events (such as getting Polish escapees joining the British Army after the fall of Poland).

This is a very good policy...

 

[unmerged(33236)]

Well, A relatively large flaw is that Brazil doesn't have events to join the Allies (historically joined after the torpedoing of a couple of boats in '42).

The US muscled many central and south american countries to join the allies, if not only in just writing. Brazil contributed significantly and sent a expiditionary fighter squadron which saw heavy action in Italy and participated in many famous battles (including the attempts to take Monte Cassino). Also a 25,000 man force was sent to fight in Italy.

According to this wikipedia article most latin american countries had declared war on the axis before the wars' end. However, most of their contributions were irrelevant, and as I said before it was only a political play. Besides Argentina, countries such as Paraguay and Chile had a large right-wing, facist base that I'm sure that given the right conditions wouldn't have hesitated to join the axis in order to reap some benefits. A chain of events, perhaps an event in which Brazil joins the allies, could lead the Latin American countries to declare war on Brazil and to join the axis....

The main reason for Argentina and the other countries joining the Allies was the formations of the UN which the Americians and the British with the Australians were pushing for .

That coulld be a trigger to start bringing other countries into the Allies depending how the War is going IRC Argentina was Told if it did not Join the allies it would not be allowed to Join the United Nations.

 

[Zaku]

Argentina should have a "refueling of german subs" event.
there was an agreement between the two nations, that the german subs can refuel at argentin naval ports, for some wargear(suplies, and maybe 1-2 division)

 

[Carroarmato-P40]

I do know that Ernst Rhoem (Leader of post WWI German/Nazi SA) spend many years in the 20's serving, training and leading the Bolivian army and recording some astounding victories. After this the Bolivians, like the Argentinians, became quite friendly.

 

[McNaughton]

I do know that Ernst Rhoem (Leader of post WWI German/Nazi SA) spend many years in the 20's serving, training and leading the Bolivian army and recording some astounding victories. After this the Bolivians, like the Argentinians, became quite friendly.

Actually, the Bolivians weren't very successful during this era, militarily. They completely flunked the Chaco War, used backward tactics, and modern equipment poorly. While they were German influenced, they were influenced rather badly. Also, Argentina and Paraguay were on greater friendly terms (Paraguay was Bolivia's enemy during the Chaco War), so much that Argentina supplied Paraguay with weaponry.

 

[unmerged(29298)]

Hi, well, i am from Argentina but i am going to speak about Spain

Franco and Hitler meet each other to negociate the entrance of Spain into the Axis.
Franco demanded a lot of territory in north of Africa, like a sphere of influence, Hitler at that time was at his best moment and was quite sure too win the war, soo, he didn´t accepted Franco´s proposal.

Some people say that Franco really didn´t want to enter into the war, that´s why he asked soo much.

Anyways, when Hitler attacked the Soviet Union, a small group of volunteer joined Germany in their antibolchevisk crusade, they were quite few and disorganized but very brave indeed according to German´s report.

so if you want to put events, you can put there Hitler - Franco meeting, and the options, if Hitlers´s accept or not.

and another event about the Spanish volunteer´s, in total not more than a division, so it could be a 36 division for germany.

about us,
yes, we were in good relations with Germany but with US and UK too.

many nazis came here after the war and we protected them as we protected the jews too. after US and UK we have the biggest jew community.

About entering the war,... i doubt it, we didn´t have territorial interests... except "malvinas" of "falklands", but we sold things to both parties.

it´s true that we were under heavy US and UK preassure, that´s why we had to give up the "graf spee", the german ship that reached our costed chased by the UK navy.

the crew of that ship landed here and they went to a small town in Cordoba they didn´t want to return and they descendants still live there.

it´s also true, that our army used at that time regular german rifles (mauser)... i have one in my house with bayonet included.

 

[unmerged(17949)]

Argentina never declared war because we were too busy making insane amounts of money from selling food to the UK. And the '43 coup installed a Nationalist (right-wing) leadership, still selling food to the UK. Not in our best interests to go into a war, really.