It's just talk to see how the game might evolve in future expansions.
Portugal tends to be a superpower, but realistically should only get a bonus during the first wave of colonisation. Nations like the Dutch, if formed, should get a look in too.
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So is the idea delayment basically another nerf for hordes?
- Thread starter toroltao
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It's just talk to see how the game might evolve in future expansions.
Portugal tends to be a superpower, but realistically should only get a bonus during the first wave of colonisation. Nations like the Dutch, if formed, should get a look in too.
Portugal was dragged into Spain's wars while under PU and spent a decades being hounded by Dutch pushing their interests. This would be modeled in game by the Portuguese grabbing their way to the spice trade and then just sticking colonists into Brazil for a while, and eventually the Netherlands and GB crushing their fleets, privateering their trade, and seizing vulnerable colonies.
The constant wars and the conquest of its colonies were a huge reason Portugal broke with Spain. It didn't simply stop colonizing, it was forcibly controlled by hostile outsider forces, and was still shoveling people into Brazilian jungles during its period of being curbed elsewhere. If Portugal had been given a free and uninhibited hand to continue its global trading efforts unfettered, without harassment by Spain's enemies (including even their English BFFs) I don't see why they shouldn't be colonizing all over. AI Portugal, in my opinion, is one of the most consistently historically plausible nations in the game if it avoids Siberia.
For all the complex talk about the nerf to Native Americans here, I think it's really simple. Once you've reformed, it's a yawnfest until you meet the Europeans. Mechanics that increase boredom should be rethought.
Of course moving tech groups to improve colonization impacts far too many things for too little gain if that's the best reason that can be given.
Of course moving tech groups to improve colonization impacts far too many things for too little gain if that's the best reason that can be given.
I think the only correct answer to slow down colonization is to increase the number of bad event compared to f.ex. native assimilation. Maybe im wrong but i seem to get positive outcomes more often the bad ones. I found this little read on the first colonies as a quick look at how perilious it actually was: http://nationalhumanitiescenter.org/pds/amerbegin/settlement/text1/text1read.htm
Lets say all overseas colonies had loads of horrible events where you would have to step it up and cash out either points or ducats to keep the colony alive. These could be connected to time periods too - like pre 1500 it would be hell to get a colony started - combined with the allready slow tickle of new settlers.
Making these events separate between overseas or no would stop it from affecting the f. Ex. americas, russians+ east asians too badly.
Lets say all overseas colonies had loads of horrible events where you would have to step it up and cash out either points or ducats to keep the colony alive. These could be connected to time periods too - like pre 1500 it would be hell to get a colony started - combined with the allready slow tickle of new settlers.
Making these events separate between overseas or no would stop it from affecting the f. Ex. americas, russians+ east asians too badly.
It's more a numbers game initially. Ditching the 2nd colonist in the Exploration group would help. I think the challenge is differentiating between Russia-style colonising and traditional naval exploration colonisation. In the real world, if Russia had an uprising in Siberia, it could eventually get some troops over to restore order. When you are half the world away by boat, your naval tradition/ideas/fleet-size should impact on things.
Perhaps instead of colonising ability being date-dependent, it could be related to your diplomatic-tech level
Plus - the size of your population should come into it too. A massive country has more people to colonise - someone like Navarra just doesn't have the population to feed a global empire.
Humanist ideas could help here - if you are tolerant, you might encourage people from other nations to flee to your colonies
That would be horrible.
Yes colonization overseas should be more difficult in the way that your colonies are more likely to fail like in real life; not by culling a colonist.
How does diplo come into it?
Not necessarily. Even small countries can be overpopulated and initially none of the European colonies were particularly populous. And the population in the colonies can become large really fast.
Or if your colonies are rich; that will attract people too.
Ironically, many colonies were founded because the home nation was NOT tolerant. Humanism giving a colonial buff is silly; a CN having humanism getting some kind of colonist growth maybe I could see.
Or, for more fun, being able to trigger a bonus to conversion at home in exchange for colonies going frequently heretic.
Or, for more fun, being able to trigger a bonus to conversion at home in exchange for colonies going frequently heretic.
Diplo-tech dictates how far you can colonise - so why not use it to increase the probability of settlement?
I'm not taking sides here, but there are some fascinating events in native history that might be worth modeling in the game. Here's a couple pre-contact or at least pre-large scale contact events in Iroquois history:
- The introduction of Maize (population explosion, followed by crash and ritual cannibalism, 1350-1400)
- The formation of the first Iroquois Confederacy (1451? 1475?)
- The loss of the fortified town of Hochelaga (sometime between 1540 and 1600)
- The formation of the Iroquois League (1570) and the beginning of the Great War
- The dispersal of the Shawnee (1660-90 - they divided into four groups after losing to the Iroquois)
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Well, diptech does include naval improvements - more solid contacts with the motherland would and did do wonders.
In yesterday's stream it was seen that one of the things protestants can take as their church ideas is expelling the heretics to the colonies!
Ah I misunderstood it then. I for some reason read it as diplomacy and not diplo text.
Though it shouldn't impact the probability of establishing a colony: That should be really easy. But it should impact how easy and costly it is to maintain it plus how likely the colony is to survive. Colonies disappearing should happen way more in the early game; and they should grow slower.