So, Byzantine influx...?

[L Lawliet]

How ridiculous is it that other nations can benefit from the fall of the Empire while Byzantium iself is forced to sit on a stick and ignore it's ancient cultural heritage?
A bit ridiculous if you ask me, especially in the situations where Byzantium actually manages to become a world power. Meaning only when I play it.

 

[unmerged(106498)]

Actually, it's pretty easy to make them powerful by screwing with the ottomans and causing rebellions. Only problem is, they don't play nice under AI control, and end up getting in too many wars and eventually beat down.

 

[DanaDark]

Last game I played, AI Byzantium took over all of the Ottomans and began expanding even further, without me ever getting involved in any way. They did very well.

 

[unmerged(106498)]

Last game I played, AI Byzantium took over all of the Ottomans and began expanding even further, without me ever getting involved in any way. They did very well.

This can easily happen if Ottomans get too much revolt risk. Big army stacks will pop up in Larrisa, and roll over all the Venician and lesser Greek states.

 

[unmerged(150720)]

Did it also happen to you that a state like Aydin or Karaman actually takes over the most of the Turkish provinces, Ottoman Empire owns? Sometimes it also happened that they got some Greek or Bulgarian provinces from the Ottomans like Edirne and Bursa. Usually they get beaten down by Bulgaria or Byzantine Empire because they can't manage to hold their Christian provinces because not only has the Ottoman Empire collapsed, but the rebellions also gave the Balkan nations new land or even freed a country.

 

[L Lawliet]

People, I'm not whining about the weakness of Byzantium but about the cultural decision for other nations when Byzantium falls (+2 yearly cultural tradition), Byzantine Influx, of which Byzantium, the holder of that culture, has no use of.
Proceed.

 

[unmerged(135993)]

People, I'm not whining about the weakness of Byzantium but about the cultural decision for other nations when Byzantium falls (+2 yearly cultural tradition), Byzantine Influx, of which Byzantium, the holder of that culture, has no use of.
Proceed.

This is indeed bad, the Byzantines should be OP for their size IMO.

1. I agree that they should be able to benefit from their ancient cultures, for free, no large magistrate cost.

2. They should be in the western/latin tech group! I dont think this needs any explaining at all.

3. And last but not least, there should be a cot in thrace as they still had a lot of trading going on there.

 

[Arilou]

People, I'm not whining about the weakness of Byzantium but about the cultural decision for other nations when Byzantium falls (+2 yearly cultural tradition), Byzantine Influx, of which Byzantium, the holder of that culture, has no use of.
Proceed.

Of course they don't, they already have that culture. They get no benefit from it because it's already there. (and they've already spent it)

2. They should be in the western/latin tech group! I dont think this needs any explaining at all.

No. Byzantium was far behind the western powers by the 1400's. And definitely behind the Ottomans too. They weren't really very different from the other balkan powers.

 

[chals]

wel, still more advanced,, for one thing byzentine fire

 

[unmerged(17537)]

People, I'm not whining about the weakness of Byzantium but about the cultural decision for other nations when Byzantium falls (+2 yearly cultural tradition), Byzantine Influx, of which Byzantium, the holder of that culture, has no use of.
Proceed.

That's what happened historically: other European areas did see cultural growth (especially in Italy) as a result of having access to Classical Greek sources they previously didn't have.

 

[L Lawliet]

That's what happened historically: other European areas did see cultural growth (especially in Italy) as a result of having access to Classical Greek sources they previously didn't have.

And if you're Byzantium and get back on your feet, you should experience the same cultural growth, shouldn't you?

 

[unmerged(147169)]

And if you're Byzantium and get back on your feet, you should experience the same cultural growth, shouldn't you?

um, they already had the sources in the first place?

 

[unmerged(84079)]

I think the point is that it was the opening up to Western/Central Europe of a second culture quite different from their own that advanced ideas so remarkably. Whereas for Byzantium to have a similar story, they would require an influx of European or perhaps Middle Eastern culture.

 

[Ioustinos]

um, they already had the sources in the first place?

Great! Where's their modifier then?

 

[Profane]

Great! Where's their modifier then?

Their modifier is buried under a mountainous amount of corruption tradition and inefficient bureaucracy. They might have had amazing resources in human knowledge and know how but they did not make good use of them.

 

[Earl Uhtred]

wel, still more advanced,, for one thing byzentine fire

When is the last documented use of Greek fire? Wrong side of the Fourth Crusade I fear.

 

[Riddermark]

I think that's what this event refers to:

This battle marked the end of the Byzantine Empire, an empire which had lasted for over 1,100 years. The city's fall was a massive blow for Christendom. Pope Nicholas V ordered an immediate counter-attack, but his death soon after marked the end of the plan. Mehmed made Constantinople his capital and proceeded to conquer the last two Byzantine states, the Despotate of Morea and the Empire of Trebizond. Many Greeks fled the city and migrated to other parts of Europe, in particular Italy. This move is thought to have helped fuel the Renaissance. The Fall of Constantinople is seen by some scholars as being a key event in leading to the end of the Middle Ages, and some mark the end of the Middle Ages by this event

 

[unmerged(145401)]

Their modifier is buried under a mountainous amount of corruption tradition and inefficient bureaucracy. They might have had amazing resources in human knowledge and know how but they did not make good use of them.

So its agreed! They should get the benefits of Byzantine Influx and additional modifiers to give them an immensely corrupt and inefficient government.

 

[wraitii]

So its agreed! They should get the benefits of Byzantine Influx and additional modifiers to give them an immensely corrupt and inefficient government.

Easy : give them the modifier " byzantine influx " and 100 inflation at game start. Good luck.

 

[Grubnessul]

AFAIK they weren't that corrupt and inefficient as West tends to think given the use of the word 'Byzantine'...

As far as that modifier goes, I don't think it's necessarily, as an Empire they start much more efficient than other states (they can move sliders more often and have more magistrates). Besides, rebuilding the Empire is already kinda easy, so in game terms they don't need it either.