Yeah, but will a newbie know all that? Maybe not. I have a hard time convincing people to start playing this game because it is so complicated. My girlfriend and brother live in fear of EU2.
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No, but it does take some time for new players to learn how to spell Wollongong, Xinjiang, and Västergötland
Ah, well, my old gripe with not having a direct link from the ledger to the world map (i.e. click on a province in the ledger and you go to the world map focused on that province, click on a general in the ledger and you go to the world map focused on the province he is in), rears its ugly head. It would make so many things easier when you are searching for things
AI troop movement
Is the AI in 1.06 or 1.07 better in taking foraging into acount when attacking eg. Venice or on Balkan. I love to play Venice, but the AI as Hungary or Turkey always masses (30k) his troops for sieging in provinces with a support value of 6-8. It is not "that hard" to win the war by just waiting until his forces are decimated and the AI doesn't have any money left to by new troops.
Is the AI in 1.06 or 1.07 better in taking foraging into acount when attacking eg. Venice or on Balkan. I love to play Venice, but the AI as Hungary or Turkey always masses (30k) his troops for sieging in provinces with a support value of 6-8. It is not "that hard" to win the war by just waiting until his forces are decimated and the AI doesn't have any money left to by new troops.
It would also be a programming nightmare Peter. At least, that is what I would think it would be. Being a non-expert on EU2 code structure
Not knowing anything at all about EU2 code structure but being a programmer, I can't think of any reason why such a thing would be difficult at all. It would just be the equivalent of firing the close screen event/method and the find province event/method.
I doubt it would be a programming nightmare at all. Functionality already exists to quickly snap to any given province (trivial), and the code to extract the correct province number given e.g. an army selection should be a piece of cake. It would, however be an interface change - and those can be time-consuming. As such, it is eminently sensible that it has not been changed since inception.
Still wish it had made it into HOI, though, since so many nations have so many, many provinces, but then, I do not play HOI anymore, so I will just hope it makes it into future games based on the Europa engine.
Somethign needs to change
A couple of us who are addicted to this game were talking about the problems with 1.07 last night, the biggest one being in the games we've been playing the AI is crippled by the tax collector problem.
I have played a few MP games, but mostly play single player, and play that a lot. I've enjoyed almost all of the changes that have been made, and the ones I didn't like were fixed almost instantly. This is one I don't particuarly like, because it makes the game _easier_. The computer isn't handling the situation well, especially the majors. Something needs to change... I'm not a huge advocate of changes being made only to effect the computer (such as giving them census taxes, but not us), but that may ahve to be the solution this time. OR, simply go back to the way it was... I think its funny, people (not me) were asking the tax collectors to go away when you conquered a province... I guess this was there response.
Daniel
A couple of us who are addicted to this game were talking about the problems with 1.07 last night, the biggest one being in the games we've been playing the AI is crippled by the tax collector problem.
I have played a few MP games, but mostly play single player, and play that a lot. I've enjoyed almost all of the changes that have been made, and the ones I didn't like were fixed almost instantly. This is one I don't particuarly like, because it makes the game _easier_. The computer isn't handling the situation well, especially the majors. Something needs to change... I'm not a huge advocate of changes being made only to effect the computer (such as giving them census taxes, but not us), but that may ahve to be the solution this time. OR, simply go back to the way it was... I think its funny, people (not me) were asking the tax collectors to go away when you conquered a province... I guess this was there response.
Daniel
- Dec 14, 1999
- 18.409
- 38.945
Re: Re: Somethign needs to change
Yeah - I thought the TC cahnge didn't make it to 1.07
Yeah - I thought the TC cahnge didn't make it to 1.07
- Dec 14, 1999
- 18.409
- 38.945
Re: Re: Re: Somethign needs to change
Yeah.. pretty hard for them to be in 1.07 since 1.07 was finished and submitted a few days before I coded that.Originally posted by Derek Pullem
Yeah - I thought the TC cahnge didn't make it to 1.07
OOps
Sorry, my bad. I hadn't played it since I put 1.07 on, I'd been keeping up with the betas as soon as they came out and I just kinda assumed the problem was still there.
Sorry...Daniel
Sorry, my bad. I hadn't played it since I put 1.07 on, I'd been keeping up with the betas as soon as they came out and I just kinda assumed the problem was still there.
Sorry...Daniel
I am testing beta patches 1.06.10b and 31March
(I presume that patch 1.06.10b is the same as version 1.07 and patch from March 31 is the same as patch from 1 of April for version 1.07).
My conclusions for the SP:
1. Latest changes regarding inflation are good.
2. AI changes working well.
So, overall this patch is an improvement. But there is the same problem: Yearly income and tax-collectors. For the hyman player and minor countries it is not the issue, because tax-collectors will be promoted ASAP. But this problem is crippling major AI countries and making the game easier for the hyman player.
Before this change major AI promoted tax-collectors when it has the possibility (money) to do so. Now it is doing the same, but it having much less money. As a result major AI is crippled.
It is not doing much colonisation (if any) and could not raise enough soldiers to crush rebellions. England/France/Spain/Turkey become much weaker then before. As a result game became less challenging and historically accurate (no really big countries).
Johan, may be it will be a good idea to make this new rule work for hyman players only or, at least, downplay it for AI ?
(I presume that patch 1.06.10b is the same as version 1.07 and patch from March 31 is the same as patch from 1 of April for version 1.07).
My conclusions for the SP:
1. Latest changes regarding inflation are good.
2. AI changes working well.
So, overall this patch is an improvement. But there is the same problem: Yearly income and tax-collectors. For the hyman player and minor countries it is not the issue, because tax-collectors will be promoted ASAP. But this problem is crippling major AI countries and making the game easier for the hyman player.
Before this change major AI promoted tax-collectors when it has the possibility (money) to do so. Now it is doing the same, but it having much less money. As a result major AI is crippled.
It is not doing much colonisation (if any) and could not raise enough soldiers to crush rebellions. England/France/Spain/Turkey become much weaker then before. As a result game became less challenging and historically accurate (no really big countries).
Johan, may be it will be a good idea to make this new rule work for hyman players only or, at least, downplay it for AI ?
Not sure how the AI works exactly but I am sure Johan will keep tweaking it slightly until the AI can work with the new rules. Its a beta, so its bound to take a few tries.
I think when Johan has run out of tweaks, than maybe start talking about halfing the census tax.
I think when Johan has run out of tweaks, than maybe start talking about halfing the census tax.
There is a limit to how much tweaking will help, when the issue is lack of money.
On an AI related note, I would like to see the AI hire armies up to around their support limit in times of peace in addition to hiring them when needed. That would guarantee that AI nations with substantial manpower would field a substantial army at all times rather than only after wars in which they raised a lot of troops and did not loose them.
Originally posted by Peter Ebbesen
There is a limit to how much tweaking will help, when the issue is lack of money.
On an AI related note, I would like to see the AI hire armies up to around their support limit in times of peace in addition to hiring them when needed. That would guarantee that AI nations with substantial manpower would field a substantial army at all times rather than only after wars in which they raised a lot of troops and did not loose them.
I'd also like to see that, but wouldn't it exacerbate the problem with the lack of money?
Additionally I'd like to see them not exceed their supply limits except in times of war, even disbanding troops if necessary.
I've noticed that if I have a vassal that I'm trying to bribe with gifts the first thing they do with the money is build as many troops as they can. They go way past their supply limit.
Not that I know their supply limit but when my supply limit as a six province country is smaller than my one province vassal's army, I'm fairly sure they've exceeded their supply limit.
I personnaly have the impression that the AI has a tendency to maintain very large armies for single province states like the Italian ones.
The fact that the AI is using this force as large armies to conduct sieges causes him to loose all the extra troops he has been building and maintaining in peacetime in no time. It also causes him to loose a lot of the newly constructed troops during the war before they really see the action.
Is this because the AI never reduces the amount of money going to the treasury to increase research and reduce inflation?
I personally find this a major problem for single player games.
The fact that the AI is using this force as large armies to conduct sieges causes him to loose all the extra troops he has been building and maintaining in peacetime in no time. It also causes him to loose a lot of the newly constructed troops during the war before they really see the action.
Is this because the AI never reduces the amount of money going to the treasury to increase research and reduce inflation?
I personally find this a major problem for single player games.
Not really. For small nations, the AI already does this - maintaining up to about their support limit - (perhaps because of a threat level? You would have to ask Johan, I guess), so it would not exacerbate the problems for them.
The issue is larger nations with substantial manpower. The armies they maintain in peacetime seem to be heavily dependent on what they had left over from the previous war. This means that, quite often, they maintain armies far under their support limits when at peace, though they could easily afford more, which makes it much easier for human players to attack them.
An extreme example is China with my manpower mod, which has a supply limit around 170,000 (something like that, at any rate). With its wealth, it can easily afford to maintain a standing army that large. Instead, sometimes you will see it with 40K armies in peacetime (and it will stay at this limit until attacked, usually), sometimes with 400K.
Hmm, I can't say I've ever really checked this.
I prefer playing European nations so I'm better able to comment on those. In most my games France and Lithuania always seem to have a massive standing armies, Spain and England often don't.
I wonder if something in the AI settings has an effect. I think France has a high aggression, and England a quite low one. I'm not sure about Spain and Lithuania. Spain I would guess has a quite low aggression from experience. Going back to your example I think China would probably have a low aggression setting. Maybe it is related to this.
I would certainly like to see them concentrate on building their armies if they can afford it. I can't see any reason for any nation to ever have less that 50% of their supportable amount.
Maybe the AI's should have a minimum level that they are happy with from 50% for a country with 0 aggression to 100% for a country with 100 aggression. Luckily we don't have to worry about the AI paying through the nose when the exceeding their support limit, so those minor fluctuations wouldn't matter.
If they have more than say 120% of their support limit they should really disband some troops.
Hmm... So, did the tax collector change get axed, or is it being considered for a later patch? If the latter, maybe trying that "amount baillif collects changes with settings" would be good, but there is always the problem of the lower income affecting the AI more than the human. Couldn't the scale be inverted for the AI? What I mean is something like:
Very easy - Without TC human gets 75% census, AI gets 25%
Very hard - without TC human gets 25% census, AI gets 75%
I believe this would make the game easier when it should be easy, harder when it should be hard... So, would this be possible? Desirable?
Very easy - Without TC human gets 75% census, AI gets 25%
Very hard - without TC human gets 25% census, AI gets 75%
I believe this would make the game easier when it should be easy, harder when it should be hard... So, would this be possible? Desirable?