• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Sep 29, 2003
552
0
Visit site
Ok, I'm actually a game designer myself, with over 20 years of experience going back the board game industry. I don't normally discuss anything related to game design, because I've got to be the most plagurized person in the history of the industry and I long ago tired of the soulless, talentless hacks always waiting for me to speak so they can run off make another decent game instead of using their own worthless ideas. But I can't stop playing this game, because of what it could be it interests me greatly. But I've about had it with the sliders so I am going to break my usual silence and offer some rare advice.

You are only a few steps away from solving your micromagement problem with the sliders. This is a "band aid and string" solution, but the whole game is held together with band aids and string, so it fits right in:)

Step 1: Combine the "Supply" slider with the "Consumer Goods" slider.

Step 2: Add checkboxes next to all sliders except the consumer goods slider (do not add a checkbox to the Consumer Goods slider, if you think you should you aren't getting it). These checkboxes "auto-balance" the checked slider, and all excess IC is always directed to Consumer Goods where, at the very least, your unused IC is producing supplys, money, and reducing dissent. You can still uncheck the production slider to waste IC (and save resources) if you want. Nothing is lost, there is one less slider, and the sliders now mostly take care of themselves. It's not perfect, but it eliminates 90% of the endless fiddling with sliders. In fact, if the producton slider were checked, you wouldn't even need to adjust it yourself when you added new builds, it would happen all by itself!

Step 3: Problem solved, never tinker with sliders again unless you need to change them for a reason.
 
Upvote 0
Sep 29, 2003
552
0
Visit site
Joshua22 said:
You're so right about this, Civ's first true rival. This game just has it, only some minor things have to be taken care for. The GUI, one of the things to be improved are the sliders. Double click and the slider will go to 100%, or a check box where it always does 100% (as long as you want it). An other big thing is the graphics. Of the sprites, the resolution, the map.
A more difficult thing would be the AI, then again, the AI is a lot better then most other games. It does do some strange things though... :wacko:


Actually it's nowhere close too that. Only HoI3 could get it there, no amount of patching ever will. And they would also need a real game designer to do it. It has potential, but it's never going to get there without someone as talented as Sid to bring it there.
 
Sep 29, 2003
552
0
Visit site
... and Pmanling still doesn't even understand it:-(

Good bye, everyone.
 

Slargos

High Jerkness
53 Badges
Dec 24, 1999
10.838
319
www.paradoxplaza.com
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • PDXCon 2019 "Baron"
  • PDXCON 2017 Gold Ticket holder
Kavik Kang said:
... and Pmanling still doesn't even understand it:-(

Good bye, everyone.

Being the game-designing god that you are, why should you care wether some dork at a board understands or not? :wacko:

----

On another matter, I just had another idea on how to solve this.

Perhaps sliders could be balanced not by percentages of total available IC but by percentages of demand with one slider (supplies or production?) still balanced on total IC.

Eh? Eh? Think about it.
 

unmerged(37820)

Second Lieutenant
Jan 12, 2005
130
0
Slargos said:
Being the game-designing god that you are, why should you care wether some dork at a board understands or not? :wacko:
Are you calling me a "dork", good sir? :eek:

Slargos said:
Perhaps sliders could be balanced not by percentages of total available IC but by percentages of demand with one slider (supplies or production?) still balanced on total IC.

Eh? Eh? Think about it.
I think it would just make the slider display confusing. Think about it: let's say you have production, reinforcements and upgrades on this scale, all set to 100% and locked. CG remains like it is now (as it should be) and then your supply slider will jump up and down like crazy. Then, eventually, demand would spike and there would be insufficient IC to meet the settings from P/R/U. In the end, that means sliders would have to come unlocked (or at least move and stay locked) by themselves!

The very good reason for keeping the sliders relative to your available IC is that that way the slider setting will always be valid. If you set them relative to demand, OTOH, the setting will be invalid/impossible if demand increases too much.
 

unmerged(15260)

First Lieutenant
Mar 3, 2003
219
0
Visit site
Comeon guys u are getting ahead of yourselves on this subject...
First analyze what you need.
The sliders really need differenent solutions for each one.
1. GC needs to be fixed at a percentage as this is the way that GC is calculated, the more IC the more GC need.
2. The production slider needs to be fixed to a certain number, if you want to avoid having a slush fund build que. This would enable ALL productions to be at 100% and eliminate loss of gearing etc.
However this number could be set to less than the total need.
3. Supply is actually the only slider that can act as a buffer slider. If one builds up a modest stockpile this can be crancked from 0 to all excess IC without problems
4. Reinforcement and upgrades are similar in that they have a very erratic behaviour. A good way to do this would be to have a max ammount (in IC or % of IC). The AI could autoadjust up to this value. The easiest way to do this is dump the not needed IC into supplies, but a more refined solution could also put it into prod.

read my long post higher up for a more carefull analysis
 

unmerged(4273)

Colonel
Jun 6, 2001
918
0
Visit site
Man Bullfrog... the talk of the original HoI slider situation brings to mind the carpal tunnel nightmare that the 1.0 version of the game was for me (mainly because of adjusting those sliders, and re-adjusting, ad nauseum! :) )

I just love the fact that in HoI2, I can right click on the sliders and have them lock the slider at precisely the value that I have chosen (as opposed to the grossly imperfect double-click method... *sigh* :D)... this might've been around before HoI2, but this game is the first time that I actually noticed it. I love it! :rofl:
 

unmerged(25996)

Second Lieutenant
Feb 20, 2004
103
0
I think the OP was a reasonable approach to the slider problem. I have a variation on this theme.

Keep the same sliders as we have now. Keep supplies and cash/dissent distinct. In addition to the ability to lock a slider have a checkbox for each each slider to autoadjust each day. The slider can be locked or auto adjust, but not both. Have a check to make sure at least one slider can float.

During peace time, I would keep upgrade on auto adjust each day, reinforcements locked at zero, cash/dissent locked in one spot depending on my dissent situation, supplies locked at some number to maintain a buildup over time and let production float. I use a rocket site or reactor to absorb the float. When I have a situation where my supplies are adequate, I can let supplies auto adjust too. Or I can let production auto adjust and let supplies float.

To me the big advantage of this scheme is the ability to snap a slider to an obvious value. If I have upgrade locked at zero and I research an upgrade, I can unlock, snap the upgrade slotter to the new value by checking the auto adjust box, the re lock at the new position. If I get an event or a diplo slider change which affects consumer demand, I can snap the slider to its new value. If I am keeping production at exactly what I need, I can snap that slider to the new value.

The value of the OP's suggestion, in my opinion, is not in how you take advantage of it to deal with day to day fluctuation in supply or reinforcement needs, it is the ability to set my slider to the obvious break even value with a single click instead of trying to get close and then holding the left click button for 30 seconds to get there.

The beauty of the OP's suggestion, absent the combining of the 2 sliders into 1, is that you don't have to use it if you don't want to. For those who like the current scheme, you can keep doing what you do now. Those of us who dislike the time involved in getting a slider to a certain value can take advantage of it.

The responder who requested the ability to type in a number has proposed a reasonable solution to the problem too, though not as good as the auto adjust check box in my opinion.
 

Ramses

Corporal
7 Badges
Feb 24, 2005
45
0
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Magicka
  • Semper Fi
  • 500k Club
  • Stellaris Sign-up
I'm still clever enough to master the slider activity.

And I find it interesting that there can be a thing to optimize and survey, some bugger part of life that can suddenly go wrong if you forget too long about it. Just like real life.

In fact there are bigger malfunctions I'l like to see solved first, and don't think slider tweakings will change the game dramaticaly
 

unmerged(39735)

Colonel
Feb 9, 2005
831
0
Easy solution, just add a button to each slider called "MAX". As long as need < whatever IC you have available (minus any IC from locked sliders), it would set your IC for that slider to exactly match the needed amount.