Should The Isle of Man and the Channel Islands get there own provinces?

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grommile

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gronak

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I'm going to have to call you out on that. In my most recent game, it's a Breton colony.

I'll have you know it was a Castillian colony originally, then when Fance inherited the throne of Castile in 1583, France got control of the East Coast - making it a Castillian-French colony.
 
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ywxiao

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hong kong ... maybe??
but the others NO! they are waay to small tehn u can start add all the douzends of dutch and german islands ...

Hong Kong would be a 1/1/1 Fish province, it had barely 7000 population in 1841, and that's V2. Ming has many other places that's larger than most Europeans capitals not on the map, Hongkong is of no consequence.
 
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Grand Historian

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For someone who calls himself "grand historian" you are offensively ignorant. The original culture of Jersey is Norman and the National Anthem (even technically to this day) is "My Normandy". Jersey was traditionally Norman and not Anglo at all. That England became Anglo-Norman over time does not make Jersey English any more than it makes it French.

But please, do continue to tell me how well represented I am by a totally different country with a completely different culture.

EDIT: Both quotes didn't appear, but I am talking (obviously) to Grand Historian here as well.

You call me "offensively ignorant" and yet you didn't even seem to get the point of my post; how many people are clamoring for Man or the Channel Islands because they want to play as them (and, for that matter, what tag would the Channel Islands even use? There was no independent nation there, and if its a feudal title than that would give carte blanch to just balkanize England with feudal-inspired tags)?

Furthermore, it's not as if their lack of inclusion somehow makes Britain unplayable. I'm actually indifferent to Man being added somewhere down the road, but currently there are more places in need of attention than a handful of islands with questionable importance. Take Epirus, for example; it was actually an independent nation in 1444, controlling the southern half of Epirus province in-game, and yet it's only a releasable core because Epirus is still a single province. There are plenty of other examples across the EU4 map of areas that could use more focus and dev time than Man or the Channel Islands.

Truly. If the Channel Islands were included, if the Balkan arguments are anything to go by, people would be clamouring for Jersey and Guernsey to be separate provinces...

There are far more pressing issues with the map than the Isle of Man. I think that we, of all people, know where they are, GH.

Absolutely.

Though I'm guessing at this point it's an inside joke with the devs to see how long they can delay any expansion of Japan.
 
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neondt

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(and, for that matter, what tag would the Channel Islands even use? There was no independent nation there, and if its a feudal title than that would give carte blanch to just balkanize England with feudal-inspired tags)?

This is actually fairly easy to resolve. It's a feudal title, but that title is Duke of Normandy. If it were to be added as a province, it'd be Norman culture with a Norman core, owned by England. A "Jersey" tag would just be silly.
 
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Grand Historian

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This is actually fairly easy to resolve. It's a feudal title, but that title is Duke of Normandy. If it were to be added as a province, it'd be Norman culture with a Norman core, owned by England. A "Jersey" tag would just be silly.

Yes, that's my point; the Channel Islands don't even have the 'obscure releasable nation I can conquer the world with' appeal that Man does, and so claiming that there are people who would want to play as Jersey because it's "their own country" is beyond ridiculous. (Furthermore, they're acting that somehow makes Britain unplayable.)
 
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Pellucid

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Speaking as a Channel Islander, no. What benefit does a 1/1/1 fish (later grain, arguably) province in the Channel have for gameplay? Jersey had strategic significance, but it's not something the game can model in its current state. Unless Mare Nostrum is going to have some sort of naval fort mechanic, all it adds is the potential for a gamey method of trapping English/French AI armies. I'd like to see the Channel Islands in the game one day, but what we've seen so far of Mare Nostrum doesn't give us any reason to suspect that we're in a position where it'd be a good idea yet.

Man would be even more pointless.
Both would be excellent launching points for Ideas Guy games. That alone might warrant inclusion.
 
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Grand Historian

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Both would be excellent launching points for Ideas Guy games. That alone might warrant inclusion.

Sandwiching yourself between England and France would make an excellent launching point for an Idea Guys game?
 

grommile

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With both having cores would be very exciting...if short lived.
Assigning a province to a custom nation erases everyone else's cores on it.
 
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Sandwiching yourself between England and France would make an excellent launching point for an Idea Guys game?
Uh, hell yeah? I pretty much only play starts like that anyway. I was really sad when they made the Riga/Livonian Order start so easy with the last expo. It would be like starting as KNI, but getting to play more of the Europe game and less of the "eat everything because I don't care how angry the Muslims get at me as a Christian" Arabia game.
 

generalolaf

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The Isle of Man, yes. The others no. Hong Kong Island had about 3000 people in the period EU4 is set in. The Channel Islands may actually make more sense.
 

Incompetent

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The Channel Islands as something separate from mainland Normandy are a quirk of history that is unlikely to happen in-game, and if they have the same ruler as Normandy, they're not really contributing anything to the game. It would be on a par with giving Ibiza or Minorca their own provinces on the off-chance they end up with a different ruler from Majorca.

With Mann, I think you can make more of a case for cultural distinctiveness as of 1444, and it could be a battleground between Scotland and England for instance. Putting more minor islands around there could be perilous for the AI, however.
 
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petertel123

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"Pandering to a certain crowd"? You mean the unbelievably vast majority who play their own country if able?

I can't play my home country because the province it's located in doesn't exist. This product excludes me even though it's leading advertisement tag line is along the lines of "lead your historical nation to victory... blah blah blah."

Of course, my country is almost entirely composed of white people, so I can't even play the excluded minority card to get the basic features that everyone else enjoys.
So paradox has to add every insignificant island in the entire world or risk upsetting nationalists? I hope they use more rational criteria for adding provinces
 
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