Should Paradox ever make a modern age game?

[FerdinandVeblen]

i'd say end it at 2001 at the absolute latest. enough time to account for for changes, without going into the war on terror.

I don't see why we need to cut the game off as it's approaching today: If you start the game in 1946 or even somewhere like 1962 (that's when I'd start it, so Africa is mostly newly decolonized - like how Victoria II starts soon after Latin American independence), the world of 2015 is going to bear little resemblance to that of today. How often does your Victoria game in 1885 look like the real 1885? Putting in scripted events for things like 9/11 or the Arab Spring would be as silly as putting in a Franco-Prussian War scripted event in Victoria II - Paradox doesn't make its games that way anymore.

If I were in charge, the game would go 1962-2100, and have a general pattern something like Victoria II. A first phase of sorting out the problems left over from the last war, revolutionary upheaveals, then the game settles down for a bit. But then automation starts breaking down the industrial system, nations in the "Third World" begins to catch up and rise to Great Power status, global warming and resource shortages start to bite, and by 2100 you're playing a totally different game than in 1962, just like with Victoria. I'd get a little silly with new ideologies and technological shifts.

 

[Celtic Emporer]

There are a lot of problems with modern day games. Do you make ISIS a playable nation? Is Taiwan a nation or a state under China? How do you portray Venezuela's government? Not to mention events IG get dated really quickly. Let's say paradox came out with a game like this today. Would they have to patch in major world events as they occurred?

Nazi Germany is playable in HOI. Thtas my answer to iSIS.
Introduce an actual "independance recognition" mechanic for situations such as Taiwan, because, like it or not, Taiwan IS independant, they just arent recognized internationally as such. Also Taiwan should have cores on the mainland, but CCP only having claims on Taiwan.
Venezuala... Im not sure, cuz I dunno much aboutbtheir current govt....
Every year or so, majprnevents should be patched in, in my opinion...not every month or patch.

 

[aruon]

Nazi Germany is playable in HOI. Thtas my answer to ISIS.

the flaw with that thinking is that the nazis as a threat to everything and everyone have been dead for 70 years. ISIS is still a very active entity committing crimes against humanity like its going out of style. and with how tech savvy ISIS has shown itself to be for the past few years, any kind of mod in any game in which you could play as them would quite possibly run the risk of being used BY THEM as propaganda- which then in the eyes of world governments technically makes the creators and contributers to that mod terrorist sympathisers and enablers. and while that may sound ridiculous or stretched... well lets just say many countries don't need a warrant or solid reasons when it comes to that.

 

[Augustus93]

The Cold war? Yes.
Modern era? No.

 

[Augustus93]

Since the end of the Cold War, the world has never been safer or more boring. Great news for humanity. Awful news for grand strategy game designers.

Sure, all of those revolutions, ISIS, terrorism and so on are just peace parades. Nothing to worry about...

 

[GFW]

the flaw with that thinking is that the nazis as a threat to everything and everyone have been dead for 70 years. ISIS is still a very active entity committing crimes against humanity like its going out of style. and with how tech savvy ISIS has shown itself to be for the past few years, any kind of mod in any game in which you could play as them would quite possibly run the risk of being used BY THEM as propaganda- which then in the eyes of world governments technically makes the creators and contributers to that mod terrorist sympathisers and enablers. and while that may sound ridiculous or stretched... well lets just say many countries don't need a warrant or solid reasons when it comes to that.

Remember when ISIS used a V2 modded game to show their Caliphate? Had Austria Hungary and all.

 

[aruon]

Remember when ISIS used a V2 modded game to show their Caliphate? Had Austria Hungary and all.

yep. i even made and posted a demotivational poster on my deviantart account:

 

[Alliegorical]

Sure, all of those revolutions, ISIS, terrorism and so on are just peace parades. Nothing to worry about...

Revolutions? You mean all the practically bloodless ones?

Terrorism? In every year but 1995 (the year Timothy McVeigh bombed the federal office building in Oklahoma City) and 2001, more Americans were killed by lightning, deer, peanut allergies, bee stings, and ‘ignition or melting of nightwear’ than by terrorist attacks.

As for ISIL, yeah, it's pretty bad. In fact, my attitude toward ISIL couldn't possibly be more hawkish: the first candidate to end a speech with "Furthermore, I consider that ISIL must be destroyed," will get my vote next year. I want it wiped out like Cato wanted Carthage. But if you just look at the numbers, and compare it to human conflicts of the 20th century, it's a drop in the ocean.

Every century since the dark ages has been far less bloody than the last. Even the 20th, despite getting off to a bad start, managed to catch up in the second half.

 

[aruon]

Every century since the dark ages has been far less bloody than the last. Even the 20th, despite getting off to a bad start, managed to catch up in the second half.

this is true. between 1927 (when humanity hit 2 billion) and 1960 (3 billion) you had WWII which by even the most extreme end of statistics puts 85+ million dead pertaining in some way to the war and it still took only 33 years to add a third onto the total number of humanity. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_population_milestones

 

[MWSampson]

I think there is scope for a good, in depth strategy game based on politics and intrigue. But would it feel like a paradox game? Probably not.

If they decided to do a 'peacetime strategy game' then I'm sure they'd do it well, but I'm sure it's not on the top of the list.

 

[Kurospidey]

The key is not making it about map painting, but customizing your country... taking it in different directions according to your plans. Each country should have an initial condition that resembles reality, but you should be able to grow tall depending of what you want.

This would be very complex and at the same time compelling. For example, you should be able to decide your education, defense, diplomatic stance, religious ideology, etc. You should also be able to turn a country into comunism, dictatorship, outside the UN, OTAN, etc. You should act as a 'guardian angel' of the country, rather than the current government, thus provoking coup's d'etats when necessary, or bad things in order to achieve other long term goals.

The grow tall thing is the key part. It has to be lots and lots of different ways of achieving domination. From a scientific, technological way, from a cultural way, from a militaristic perspective, corporate-wise (maybe extend your corporations throughout the world and dominate economically).

It's very complicated to develop, but eventually a game like that will be done. I don't know if Paradox will do it or other company.

 

[Lemont Elwood]

Victoria 2 sort of fills the niche but it's still a different era. Any start date between 1946 and 2000 could work. But there are many things in the modern world that wouldn't fit in as just an extension of Vicky 2. (UN, NAFTA, NATO, NSA, War on terror, War on communism/capitalism, War on drugs. )

I don't expect this to happen but I think it would be pretty cool how about you guys?
I would imagine its clothing to most closely resemble Victoria 2 but with key differences.

This could be an extension of the cold war game pds always wanted.
But turning Nigeria in to a superpower while fighting a terrorist civil war could be pretty badass (no offense nigerians I know it's serious).

I just think it would be really interesting to play, and I wonder how things like Americas Imperialish amount of army bases in other countries would be worked out.

Yes, we need a good Cold War game (though I will say that East vs West was not shaping up to be what I wanted) and a good modern-to-future one.

Preferably, you could play everything from the beginning of civilization to the end of it (in Stellaris).

 

[aruon]

Preferably, you could play everything from the beginning of civilization to the end of it (in Stellaris).

well in the first stellaris DD doomdark did say:

Now, as you may know, our ambition is to eventually cover the entire "human timeline" with our games... including the future.

so hey a cold war and MW game may be more than a hopeful dream.

 

[mestermagyar]

The best way of modern-day paradox game would be: lets make a cold-war starting date, then make technology till around 2050. There will be no modern political controversies, but the game will dinamically form, so you wont have to debate about current problems. Modders will still be able to realize almost anything from 1900 to 2100.

It should be a rather EU4 experience with a lots of victoria mechanics, so instead of thousands of events, there would be a dynamic mechanism for everything so it would not be predetermined which could even result in censorship. However, mods can still do anything as they wish. From shooting migrants to ISIS.

 

[MCBC6]

Well, like all pds games, you don't railroad it, IE 9/11 or Soviet Union collapsing. You simply start the world in 1945 or maybe 1967 as an alternative. Then you design systems regarding spreading your ideology or something like that. In the 80s and 90s, you begin having events modeling terrorists (and terrorists in general, not Muslim, the description would just be something along the lines of terrorists have attacked such and such) and let the game sandbox into say... 2060, allowing a conversion into stellaris

 

[Person012345]

Since the end of the Cold War, the world has never been safer or more boring. Great news for humanity. Awful news for grand strategy game designers.

Not really. Things have just changed from open imperialism to influence based. Sure you wouldn't be able to have a game based on warring like EUIV, but that opens the way for more interesting mechanics. It's not like history has to play out the same way either, a lot of things in the world could have turned into more open conflicts under more aggressive leadership.

 

[Lemont Elwood]

Nazi Germany is playable in HOI. Thtas my answer to iSIS.
Introduce an actual "independance recognition" mechanic for situations such as Taiwan, because, like it or not, Taiwan IS independant, they just arent recognized internationally as such. Also Taiwan should have cores on the mainland, but CCP only having claims on Taiwan.
Venezuala... Im not sure, cuz I dunno much aboutbtheir current govt....
Every year or so, majprnevents should be patched in, in my opinion...not every month or patch.

I don't think that's what he was getting at. I think what he meant is how you treat de facto states that aren't real countries.

The answer seems obvious to me. If the rebellion has held territory for a reliable period of time and/or managed diplomacy, you treat it like a state; that's how it's always been done in Paradox games (like the Spanish Civil War in HOI3 and the American Civil War in Vicky II), and if it hasn't, it's treated as rebels.

 

[petertel123]

it could possibly be an interesting game, but it would need very indepth politics and international relations, with war and expansion being less important

 

[TheDungen]

I don't know a cold war game could be awesome, With the doomsday clock right in the middle of the upper toolbar, if it ever reaches midnight... game over.

you cut to a cutscene with the earth seen from orbit and mushrom cloud cropping up one after the other and the words.

"Congratulation, you've reached the end, ten millenia of human civilisation has been whiped from the face of the earth it's doubtful if life itself will ever recover. Mankind certainly will not."

fade into view and then out of view again. Judas Priests cathedral spires playing the background.
"So devourer or devoured, time to rise up and retire, watching as a world expires... from up amongst the clouds."

Jokes aside, it would be pretty cool it would finally be a game that showed how horrible war is not just the happy merry map painter that is the other paradox games.
To quote crimson tide:

"In the nuclear world, the true enemy is war itself."
of course that was true long before the nuclear world, and is something that I'd like se see more represented in all paradox games.

 

[aruon]

I don't know a cold war game could be awesome, With the doomsday clock right in the middle of the upper toolbar, if it ever reaches midnight... game over.

you cut to a cutscene with the earth seen from orbit and mushrom cloud cropping up one after the other and the words.

"Congratulation, you've reached the end, ten millenia of human civilisation has been whiped from the face of the earth it's doubtful if life itself will ever recover. Mankind certainly will not."

fade into view and then out of view again. Judas Priests cathedral spires playing the background.
"So devourer or devoured, time to rise up and retire, watching as a world expires... from up amongst the clouds."

Jokes aside, it would be pretty cool it would finally be a game that showed how horrible war is not just the happy merry map painter that is the other paradox games.
To quote crimson tide:

"In the nuclear world, the true enemy is war itself."
of course that was true long before the nuclear world, and is something that I'd like se see more represented in all paradox games.

nah. the world would end, you'de game over, and then you'd get to export your save to After the End in CK2