I am playing as the HRE. What should one do with king titles? Give them out to claimaints? dynasty members? or keep them yourself? or not make them at all?
Should an emperor give out king titles or keep it himself?
- Thread starter Gunnarr
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A king title is essentially just a larger version of a Duke.
Rather than dealing with a huge conglomerate of Dukes, and Counts who are unruly, you can put them all under the banner of one guy, who keeps them in line for you. So rather than having to maintain good relations with a dozen characters, you can focus on making just one guy happy. The flipside is that he's a very powerful ruler if he rebels against you, so it's a bit of a double-edged sword. King titles do add a lot to your prestige though.
Generally I won't create them unless I have an area that is difficult to administer because of geography, or cultural/religious differences (i.e. Sicily + Southern Italy when I play the Byzantines, I'll create a Kingdom of Sicily). I'll often only create one Kingdom as an Empire, and will pass that Kingdom to my heir. That way I don't have to worry too much about him rebelling, and when he succeeds I am able to readminister the Kingdom as I like before passing it on to the new heir.
Rather than dealing with a huge conglomerate of Dukes, and Counts who are unruly, you can put them all under the banner of one guy, who keeps them in line for you. So rather than having to maintain good relations with a dozen characters, you can focus on making just one guy happy. The flipside is that he's a very powerful ruler if he rebels against you, so it's a bit of a double-edged sword. King titles do add a lot to your prestige though.
Generally I won't create them unless I have an area that is difficult to administer because of geography, or cultural/religious differences (i.e. Sicily + Southern Italy when I play the Byzantines, I'll create a Kingdom of Sicily). I'll often only create one Kingdom as an Empire, and will pass that Kingdom to my heir. That way I don't have to worry too much about him rebelling, and when he succeeds I am able to readminister the Kingdom as I like before passing it on to the new heir.
ah okay, thank you!
I forgot to ask though,
what should I do if vassal dukes create a king title (or can they?)
I am afraid that the duke of bohemia might create the king of bohemia title, i mean he has 5/8 of the de jure counties so will he try to make the title if he has enough money and such?
I forgot to ask though,
what should I do if vassal dukes create a king title (or can they?)
I am afraid that the duke of bohemia might create the king of bohemia title, i mean he has 5/8 of the de jure counties so will he try to make the title if he has enough money and such?
I'm pretty sure you need to be independent to create a King title.
But if it so happens that you have an unwanted King in your realm, you could imprison him and revoke his King title, and then destroy it.
But if it so happens that you have an unwanted King in your realm, you could imprison him and revoke his King title, and then destroy it.
There is probably an optimal way to play, but mostly it depends on your playstyle. Pre 1.07 technially it was better to keep all your vassals small, but with factions grouping your vassals under a stronger vassal can effectively weaken them - if you have 6 counts they will have acces to more levies to challenge you with than if you group them under two or three dukes, and if you then group those dukes under a king he will have less levies than the dukes individually. Of course it means you will get less levies and taxes, but you will have more power compared to those vassals who can tise up against you, and less people to keep happy.
You can't create a title of the same rank as your liege. Bohemia is under an Emperor, so a Kingdom is kosher.
I like doing this as the Byzantine Emperor because they are usually strong enough to launch Holy Wars by themselves, thus expanding your realm without any cost to you.
I've had a lot of success making kingdoms as HRE. It's a lot fewer headaches from just a management perspective.
As someone mentioned, it helps with factions because they are easier to keep tabs of, they are weaker than the same number of dukes combined in a faction, you can imprison one person easier if you need to, and you can increase relations (bribe, chancellor, etc) easier if it's one person.
I even like that with levies, I can raise them all from one place. This especially helps with ships.
The biggest downside is that it will probably cost you some income, but it's well worth it IMO.
As someone mentioned, it helps with factions because they are easier to keep tabs of, they are weaker than the same number of dukes combined in a faction, you can imprison one person easier if you need to, and you can increase relations (bribe, chancellor, etc) easier if it's one person.
I even like that with levies, I can raise them all from one place. This especially helps with ships.
The biggest downside is that it will probably cost you some income, but it's well worth it IMO.
I have been wondering the same thing myself. In my current game I've acquired quite a large amount of King titles and I'm thinking about giving at least a few away. I don't want to just not create them as I like trying to get the highest score as possible.
The fact that a King / Queen's levy raises all in one spot is very nice. One of the most tedious things about the game is gathering up your massive army, especially when you have holdings on opposite sides of the map. This speeds things up a lot, even more so if their capital is by the sea. Less vassals to manage also makes things easier but I don't really mind managing a lot of vassals.
The main thing that puts me off giving away Kingdoms is that a faction can suddenly become very powerful with a King or Queen in it. What if several Kings all join the same faction? I can imagine that would be very hard to deal with. I wish you could give away Kingdoms to Bishops. Bishop vassals are so much easier to keep happy.
The fact that a King / Queen's levy raises all in one spot is very nice. One of the most tedious things about the game is gathering up your massive army, especially when you have holdings on opposite sides of the map. This speeds things up a lot, even more so if their capital is by the sea. Less vassals to manage also makes things easier but I don't really mind managing a lot of vassals.
The main thing that puts me off giving away Kingdoms is that a faction can suddenly become very powerful with a King or Queen in it. What if several Kings all join the same faction? I can imagine that would be very hard to deal with. I wish you could give away Kingdoms to Bishops. Bishop vassals are so much easier to keep happy.
You can give away kingdoms to bishops, I think. You definitely can give them to republics anyway, so I don't see why not bishops.
The option wasn't there last I checked. I think the only way to make King-Bishops is to push a claim to a Kingdom for a character that is already a Bishop.
Depends what you want really.
Holding the titles is better for you , but requires more work. You have to maintain relations with more direct vassals.
But you get more prestige and more stability. The titles are worth a lot , and if you keep them , vassal de jures will tend to remain small (as the ai doesn't often expand outside of its de jure).
Holding the titles is better for you , but requires more work. You have to maintain relations with more direct vassals.
But you get more prestige and more stability. The titles are worth a lot , and if you keep them , vassal de jures will tend to remain small (as the ai doesn't often expand outside of its de jure).