Ship build times way too short?

[unmerged(43252)]

Is it just me or are the building time for ships way way WAY too short? I mean, I can build a Scharnhorst class BC in under a year, while in reality it took like three. I realize stuff might get pushed back in the queue and thus take longer, and maybe in reality those ships were not built with a top priority, but still it seems very very short to me...
And I am wondering whether other items suffer from something similar?
I am considering doubling my ship build-times across the board, but wondering whether I should also cut in half the IC reqs so the total stays the same?

 

[Amallric]

Try core mod for Arma, they have shipbuilding times of like 5 years :wacko:

 

[Mjarr]

They are quite short in general, it was the case in prior HoI games aswell. My guess is sort of gameplay approach as not alot people have patience for long ship buildtimes.

I modded them myself that IC cost varies around 3-5 per each capital ships ships for 400 days (heavy cruiser minimium) to 1400 (SHBB), average buildtime would be around 900 days in general (not taking account slider modifiers), and to limit spam of carriers I increased CAG supply consumption by about 4x compared to the original values - and in general oil consumption has been also increased for all ship types. So far they've been quite functional.

 

[Balesir]

This was a deliberate decision to increase playability - "real" ship build times caused an outcry among HoI players!

In a future version, we have on the wishlist an "Options" toggle where you can set the build times for all military units (or just ships?) to "Realistic" (half IC cost, double time), "Normal" (what it says on the tin ) or "Turbo" (double IC cost and half the build time).

 

[Tegetthoff]

This was a deliberate decision to increase playability - "real" ship build times caused an outcry among HoI players!

In a future version, we have on the wishlist an "Options" toggle where you can set the build times for all military units (or just ships?) to "Realistic" (half IC cost, double time), "Normal" (what it says on the tin ) or "Turbo" (double IC cost and half the build time).

Actually with current AoD technology you can set them at "realistic" intervals and use the speed-up buttons to get them to "normal" and "turbo".

And check any web source on naval build times to verify that CORE has it right

 

[Balesir]

I know what the real build times are pretty well - I did months of research to get the fleet setups right for AoD with the 'ship brigades' in place. But "market testing" indicated that real life build times were, let's say, unwelcome in several quarters. If you want realistic times you could mod the unit files to double time and half cost (close enough) - but an option toggle would be more elegant, no?

 

[deadmeat1471]

But "market testing" indicated that real life build times were, let's say, unwelcome in several quarters.

Pussies. :rofl:

 

[Simon1397]

I know what the real build times are pretty well - I did months of research to get the fleet setups right for AoD with the 'ship brigades' in place. But "market testing" indicated that real life build times were, let's say, unwelcome in several quarters. If you want realistic times you could mod the unit files to double time and half cost (close enough) - but an option toggle would be more elegant, no?

This I think is the right approach as it needs to be balanced so that the medium powers (Fra/Ita/Jpn) can actually build some capitals.

Try, for instance building the three capital ships and several light cruisers in the queue for France in 1936 and see what else (inf, arm or int's) you can build. In fact you can't even build those BC/BB with the available IC in the specified time.

 

[wright1331]

I like the way it is now.
History goes out the window when playability can be improved

 

[Mjarr]

In a future version, we have on the wishlist an "Options" toggle where you can set the build times for all military units (or just ships?) to "Realistic" (half IC cost, double time), "Normal" (what it says on the tin ) or "Turbo" (double IC cost and half the build time).

How about making it adjustable that it in options you can setup buildtimes for each unit types, so E.G. land units have their own setting, naval units have their own setting and air units have their own for extra ability to customize?

That probably doesn't save from some modifications someone wants to do, but atleast it could satisfy most people without the need to modify anything

 

[Sernaton]

I like the way it is now.
History goes out the window when playability can be improved

-1

The more historical, the more fun for me. Which proves that each of us has a different opinion, so the idea of an option sounds great to me

 

[unmerged(13058)]

How about making it adjustable that it in options you can setup buildtimes for each unit types, so E.G. land units have their own setting, naval units have their own setting and air units have their own for extra ability to customize?

That probably doesn't save from some modifications someone wants to do, but atleast it could satisfy most people without the need to modify anything

I would agree that you should allow the option for each type (land, naval, air, province), rather than an across the board option. If I had this choice, I personally would choose the option when playing to leave everything the same but make ships build faster at a higher IC cost. It just seems to take so long to get them built in playability terms.

The current normal/fast/fastest option in the production screen is not the same as what we are alking about above. Paying double or triple the IC cost does not give the equivalent speed in production.

 

[BritNavFan]

If you want realistic times you could mod the unit files to double time and half cost (close enough) - but an option toggle would be more elegant, no?

Sounds great . Note that the current setup means that ships that are more than half complete (in the build queue) at the start of a scenario cost twice as much as they should.

 

[unmerged(74599)]

This was a deliberate decision to increase playability - "real" ship build times caused an outcry among HoI players!

Did you take a poll? My experience is that all kinds of things will get vocal opposition from some people, at some point in time. As well, my experience is also that people will often oppose things in theory, then when faced with the reality, people don't mind so much.

For example, when I removed fighters from the EIR mod for HOI IIArama, there was a lot of opposition, but hardly anyone really complained when it was instituted.

 

[Syntalynder]

This was a deliberate decision to increase playability - "real" ship build times caused an outcry among HoI players!

I don't mind super-long build times -I'll mod this myself.
Where can we find the 'unmodded' realistic build times?

 

[crusadertsar]

Did you take a poll? My experience is that all kinds of things will get vocal opposition from some people, at some point in time. As well, my experience is also that people will often oppose things in theory, then when faced with the reality, people don't mind so much.

Keep your hands of my battleships. "Realistic" ship build times would basically kill the variety in my German game as I would stop building fleets all together. So I would mind it very much.

You people are crazy . Who would want to wait for 5 years for that cool SHBB to be build. That's like enough time to conquer the world or get bored with the game (Don't get me wrong I'm for realistic historical gameplay too but there have to be limits for the game to remain playable). Masochists :wacko:.

 

[unmerged(74599)]

Exactly. Why would Germany do such a thing? They didn't because most of their enemies were land powers.

 

[nymet260]

That's the beauty of realistic ship building times, it makes ship battles far more decisive. If for example without realistic build times your playing as Japan and lost most of your carriers in one battle, you can easily replace them in a year to continue combating the Americans with realitivly little lost in the pacific, with realistic build times if you lost most of your carriers in one battle you will lose control of the seas for quite a while which can have devastating effects on ones pacific campaign.

Oh and sure why not, im all for options to adjust production based on my mood of play, sometimes one gets the feeling of a quick fun game over a long realistic one while other times one searches for a more realistic mood.

 

[kiahoga]

Yes the build times are a litlte short but it is well known that especially in America they could build ships in almost unheard of times. For example the Essex class carriers. Essex her self was layed down in April of 41 launched in may of 42, and commisioned in decembar of 42. She was commisioned 15 months ahead of schedual. The fletcher class destroyers 175 were build in 32 months. And lets not forget the Liberty ship that by the end of the war it was only taking 44 days to build one. So it could be done but as some one else pointed out the AoD can simulate that by throwing the extra IC to speed build something which realistcally only the industrial superpowers like US and Soviets could do on a large scale.

 

[Syntalynder]

So what are the realistic build times mentioned previously? Anyone?