1-12.
It is literally whatever accuracy they assign divided by 12. So 7 Acc is 7/12 is 58% CTH. Experience is 1 star = +1 Acc. Suppression levels are -1 Acc so a 2 star BEF Panther is a 75% CTH.
Shermans vs. Panthers
- Thread starter Tank Girl
- Start date
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
1-12.
It is literally whatever accuracy they assign divided by 12. So 7 Acc is 7/12 is 58% CTH. Experience is 1 star = +1 Acc. Suppression levels are -1 Acc so a 2 star BEF Panther is a 75% CTH.
Ah, so not 2d6 distribution, just flat. That's even better. Do we know the effects of range?
Excellent, thank you so much! I should have a more sophisticated model in a few days.
This is not meant as a rant, I just want to know what I am supposed to expect:
I just fielded 8 Panthers including 2 Befehlspanther vs. like a dozen Sherman M4 including 3 Sherman Jumbo.
The fun thing is:
I got like 40 hits on the Jumbo, with no effect.
2 Panthers even got at 500 metres and shot point blank. But only after 3-4 hits the Jumbo finally bailed out.
The only way I could advance my attack is by making the jumbos fall back, because I could not destroy them ever.
At the same time ofc my panthers died to several lucky hits from the other shermans.
In the end I just wanted to know it and pushed too far, getting flanking fire by AT guns and died. But well.
What my problem is, 1 Jumbo held back my advance, even tho I had 4 Panthers and had destroyed all other shermans. The jumbo just slowed me down so much, I had constant pain at my flanks because the allies had the time to bring even more cheap shermans there.
My impression is:
Jumbo is beyond the game with its armor. It didnt even get a crit, only a drive knocked out once.
And from what I understand only the Jumbo turret was actuall reinforced?!
Also, the 280 pts panthers seem to manage 180 pts shermans quite poorly.
In Red Dragon usually 10-20 pts difference meant, that the cheaper tanks get obliterated.
But here, even 4 Panthers firing at the same time at calm do nothing to a single sherman (non jumbo) and sometimes need 2 salvos to even make it fall back.
So?!
I m not asking what I am doing wrong btw. so you are free to tell me which better unit I could bring against the jumbo (apart from planes) but basically I just want to know:
1. Wtf Jumbo?
2. Is the 100 pts difference from sherman m4 to panther justified?
Smack it a few times with medium rockets or tank busters. When the meter is full, press the advantage. You don't have to attack from the front. Artillery strike on the side and attack from there or you can just push where the jumbo isn't around. They only get 1 jumbo and it can't cover the whole map.
too much armor on 75 76 shermans they were only a bit better armored than m4a1. reduce cost or something Shermans shouldnt have same armor as Panther D
That means that a Bef. Panther at 900m will have 100% acc.? Also were can i find these accuracy/penetration charts?
What's the armor difference in game?
Standard Early production M4A1 cast armor resisted upwards of 15%, to even 20%, less well than its thickness would imply. The United States accepted the lower ballistic quality of cast armor when manufacturing the M4A1, relying on a little extra thickness and the rounded corners to make up for the essential weakness of the armor material. The net effect was that the later versions of M4A1 Sherman were less well protected than the later versions of RHA Shermans. One unit which had both, the 743rd Battalion, kept their cast hull Shermans out of combat, a lesson apparently learned the hard way.
An M4A3 (75)w should have much better ballistic resistance on the front plate tha 75-mm armed M4A1, since they are from different production runs and have greatly different armor layouts. I'm not even taking into account the elimination of the weak spots near the hatches in the late production run.
M4a1 = 63mm hull 76 turret = 9 armor
Panzer 4H = 80mm hull 50 turret = 8 armor
seems legit pz4h armor slightly worse difference abt 9mm
m4a3 = 63mm hull 88 turret = 11 armor(wut?? its only a bit better (12mm) than m4a1 but already 2 points)
panther D = 80 hull 100 turret = 12 armor (wuuut?? its much better (29mm) than m4a3 but only 1 point better)
panther G = 80 120! turret = 13 armor (so for 20mm armor increase on G panther got 1 point, but on 12mm increase M4A3 got 2!! points)
JUMBO = 100 177 = 21armor (by logic with panther G jumbo should get 17 armor but instead it got 21!!)
All shermans exept m4a1 have better armor than they should dont know why. I makes some tanks (like pz3) worse against shermans than they should be. Better reduce armor + reduce cost. Dunno maybe balancing says so.
Is the M4A1 a (76)w or a stock tank? If stock, then it should not have a 60+-mm hull.
I've seen this replicated, but this is the original source I've been using
https://www.reddit.com/r/Steel_Division/comments/64suxv/penetration_chance_table_ap_vs_av/
The accuracy table, as suggested above, is straightforward to replicate in google sheets/excel: 1 = 1/12, 2=2/12 ...11=11/12, 12=12/12.
And because I found it on reddit not five minutes ago, here's a table of optics tests.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kMbYZe30_PAWR97Bmp55RsrPKz4fBM-awwLX481FIh0/edit#gid=0
Sherman hull armor is sloped at 30 degrees (I think) I know that whatever angle it is it makes the 2" effectively 3.6". also, they went from cast to rha.
in the grand scheme of things I don't think the Germans will have trouble dealing with anything short of a jumbo with anything that shoots ap rounds so the m4a3 arguments are sort of irrelevant. Germans having issues with Jumbo isn't that big of a deal either. It's not like the thing shoots a high velocity 75mm or 88mm. It has a medium velocity 75.
basically I say to wehraboos crying about jumbo armor..... QQ. its not like the thing can actually kill anything. just wait. you'll have tigers, king tigers, and jagdpanthers soon enough and even the jumbo wont slow you down.
Shermans had really bad cast armor in the beginning, i would drop m4a1 armor to 8. This armor could be penetrated by armor piercing ammo ricocheting off ground as the soviet shermans reported lol. And of course the later shermans only deserve like 10 armor tops. I wish the devs played war thunder more, they would know better 
.
There is a world of difirence between the shermans and the panthers because the panthers are immune to any 76 mm or 85 mm to the upper hull plate. Shermans can be penetrated wtih these guns pretty much anywhere. Also, the same with the Jumbo sherman. It doesnt deserve armor of a king tiger because KT will resist its own long 88mm but the Jumbo will easily be destroyed by a long 88mm.
.There is a world of difirence between the shermans and the panthers because the panthers are immune to any 76 mm or 85 mm to the upper hull plate. Shermans can be penetrated wtih these guns pretty much anywhere. Also, the same with the Jumbo sherman. It doesnt deserve armor of a king tiger because KT will resist its own long 88mm but the Jumbo will easily be destroyed by a long 88mm.
Interesting, especially considering that the Soviet Union never received an M4A1.
American early cast armor was bad. But no need to go making shit up.
No. War Thunder devs probably don't know what balance even is.I wish the devs played war thunder more, they would know better
Shermans had really bad cast armor in the beginning, i would drop m4a1 armor to 8. This armor could be penetrated by armor piercing ammo ricocheting off ground as the soviet shermans reported lol. And of course the later shermans only deserve like 10 armor tops. I wish the devs played war thunder more, they would know better
There is a world of difirence between the shermans and the panthers because the panthers are immune to any 76 mm or 85 mm to the upper hull plate. Shermans can be penetrated wtih these guns pretty much anywhere. Also, the same with the Jumbo sherman. It doesnt deserve armor of a king tiger because KT will resist its own long 88mm but the Jumbo will easily be destroyed by a long 88mm.
Not to mention the later ballistic cap versions of the Soviet 100 and 122 would disintegrate a Jumbo but had no chance to pen the upper hull of a KT.
(inb4 archive awareness KT shot 150 times)