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Red Cesar

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((I guess I'll get more into it with discussions once the primaries start, since we haven't really reached that point.))
 

hoi2geek

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How many people would have to join before we can start our own parties(with your permission, of course)
 

ThunderHawk3

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How many people would have to join before we can start our own parties(with your permission, of course)
Rough numbers, I'd say at least 20, so I'd wait a few days and maybe at least one electoral cycle. Your party also sounds like it should be part of some broader reactionary movement. Historically, there were royalists in southern Chile, so I do feel that they should be represented in AAR somehow. Their stance was a bit different from yours, of course.
 

Red Cesar

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I, General Cesar Roseno, urge the members of the Senate to pass the Peru-Bolivia act. Without it, our military could very well be crippled. Without a substantial military, we are likely open to invasion, an act that would desecrate our sacred Chile.
 

zagoroth

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You would have us cripple the economy, and become a less attractive place for immigration. Let the economy grow, and then rebuild the military.
 

Red Cesar

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There will be a deficit either way, which can be repaired over time. On the other hand, the minute our military is reduced and scraped down, we will face the hand of our greedy neighbors.
 

Devotist

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I agree with Senator Badajoz. It is is a luxury we cannot afford.
 

Soulstrider

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Name: Gonzalo Fernandez Pereira
Date of Birth: 1794
Background: Born from a low middle class family, Gonzalo excelled at academics
leading to his family investing the money they had to send him to study in the Spanish Universities. Once the Independence war broke out in Chile he returned to his home to join his compatriots in the fight for freedom, reaching the rank of colonel.
During the civil war he took no sides due to to his father being struck by a terrible illness, though Gonzalo's best efforts to treat him he eventually succumbed to it. Since them he dedicated himself to politics.

Ney to Peru-Bolivia act.


"The country has been devastated by several terrible wars, it's time to put our best efforts to rebuild it. Our neighbours are also in similar situations so I doubt they will attempt anything and even if they did, surely the Chilean people will rise to the ocasion "
 
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Pallen

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Name: Eduardo Emilio Romano
Date of Birth: 1806
Occupation: Senator of Los Lagos
Party Affliation: Conservadores
Ideology: Conservativism
Background: His family the Romano's are a long line of aristocrats, and after the Independance War of Chile, his family managed to keep most of their wealth. Eduardo is an aristocrat and own much land in the state of Los Lagos, in Chile. He rents out most of the land to peasents, farmers, who in turn pay a portion of their earning and rent to him. He also owns several gold and a few diamond mines, which have been the primal source of his family income. In a young age he delved into politics, and his success is a consequence of a rich background with a rich family.

Candidate for the Convervadores

NAY To the Peru-Bolivia act.

"I also agree with Senator Badajoz. If this Act is approved then we will simply delay the inevitable, which will result in poverty beyond measure, and a country in economical and social ruin. It is our duty, to secure the nation's economic stabiliy, which in turn will secure our social security, in the name of our children and grandchildren. I for one, can not die of old age in peace, knowing that my children may live in such conditions."
 
Last edited:

ThunderHawk3

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Here's the current totals. Keep joining and voting!

Liberales Candidates:
Michael Badajoz

Conservadores Candidates:
Francisco Rivera
Eduardo Emilio Romano

Meanwhile, the Peru-Bolivia Act's current count
Yes: 3
No: 5
 

unmerged(339449)

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Name: Armando de Vasces
Date of Birth: 1796
Occupation: Mayor of Maipú
Party Affiliation: Conservadores
Background: Born from a native mother and a Spanish father, Armando was sent to England in early life to receive education and to hide his fathers shame. He returned to Chile during the war for independence, and purchased an officers commission. However, he never rose above the rank of Captain. After the war he became involved in politics, with strong Pro-European ideology, particularly Pro-British. His political thoughts include the Upper-Classes defending and protecting the lower classes from oppression, including from the Upper-Class itself. He strives for the "Europeanizaton" of Chile, and is pro-industrialist and pro-military.

Yay to Peru-Bolivia Act

A nation's strength is determined by it's production power and it's ability to impose it's will upon other nations. If we wish to become a nation that can become a dominant force in South America, then we must have the military force to defend ourselves and take our rightful land.
 

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Name: General Braulio Silva
Born: 1785
Party: Partido Nacionale (whatever the Reactionary Party is. ;) )
Background: Silva was born to a small, middle class family near Iquique, the family was all military, and Braulio's father of the same name was a Cavalry Commander for the Conservators, but his grandfather, whom Braulio took after, was reactionary, and did not believe in either the Chilean Republic and it's constitution, nor in the liberals. As such, Silva is a staunch supporter of an autocratic presidency in Chile. Silva is prepared to assert his views military if others don't listen, though he would rather fight with words.

"The issues that plague us today, such as war, are far too important for the short-sighted people of Chile, who are unable to see the big picture. It is up to us, the politicians and generals of Chile to guide them as a father guides his son."

Yay to the Peru-Bolivia Act
 

Devotist

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How can a nation struggling to ensure solvency wage war upon others? How can a nation unable to maintain its government maintain a hungry array of vultures? Keep your beasts caged, or watch as they shred us apart and leave our children to starve.
 

DisgruntledLemming

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And how can a nation that does not assert it's right to land that is rightfully it's own seek to survive? To quote a wise Roman Ruler, "To conquer is to endure". The Bolivians hold lands that rightfully belongs to Chile, and as such, we should do everything in our power to get that land back, should we not? When the Bolivians insult us, how should we respond? By letting them keep it? Hah! Foolishness I tell you. You want us to sit in our homes and twiddle our thumbs while the rest of the Latin States fight for supremacy? Where's the honor in that? The glory? Will the people of America del Norte and Europa look upon us favorably for that? No! They will think us weak! As will our own immediate neighbors, and war will be declared on us. If we are to fight a war, I for one would rather be on the offensive.
 

tamius23

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Name: Witold Tamiuszski
Born: 1801, Krakow
Party: None yet
Background: Tamiuszski was born in Krakow to a family of Polish blood. When he was twenty years old, he moved to seek his fortune in the Tierra del Fuego of southern Chile. He built himself a house in the town of Punta Arenas and scratched out a living with help from the natives in the area. Over the next few years the small town began to grow with settlers. Most of them are cattle herders.

He is still a young man of 35, and has designs on getting himself into power. For now he is the officially-appointed governor of the Tierra del Fuego. It's a start on the long road of politics. He imagines the ideal Chile to be one under a king or monarch.

Yes to Peru-Bolivia Act

((OOC Punta Arenas was not officially founded until 1841 but that's just details ;)))
 

Red Cesar

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We can not maintain public order without an avid fighting force, or deter our vultures neighbors. The economy will recover over time, declining the creation of this bill will not make much of a difference. You politicians would have us fight a war with sticks and stones so we could end the deficit a year earlier?
 

Pallen

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"General Braulio Silva I ask you to reconsider. A tax of 75% is simply too harsh, on the people of Chile. Even so we still face a defecit in the state treasury, and considering we face no immidiate threats from abraod, then we have to prioritise the economy above the military for the time being. A Roman Ruler might have said so, but the Roman Empire did not endure. I impore everyone who considers to pass this bill to reconsider, such a high tax will only strangle Chile from within and then we shall we truely vurnable. I suggest - if the General is truely concerned of foreign affairs, that we create peace and security through diplomacy rather than bury ourselfves in Arms and Artillery. Once our economy is flourishing again, then we will be able to increase our military spending and modernize our equipment."

- Eduardo Emilio Romano, Senator of Los lagos.
 

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And how can a nation that does not assert it's right to land that is rightfully it's own seek to survive? To quote a wise Roman Ruler, "To conquer is to endure". The Bolivians hold lands that rightfully belongs to Chile, and as such, we should do everything in our power to get that land back, should we not? When the Bolivians insult us, how should we respond? By letting them keep it? Hah! Foolishness I tell you. You want us to sit in our homes and twiddle our thumbs while the rest of the Latin States fight for supremacy? Where's the honor in that? The glory? Will the people of America del Norte and Europa look upon us favorably for that? No! They will think us weak! As will our own immediate neighbors, and war will be declared on us. If we are to fight a war, I for one would rather be on the offensive.
A bankrupt nation will only be weaker, impetuous hawk. An army cannot be sustained if its arms cannot be purchased, its ranks paid, and its manpower replenished. We have neither money nor men, only your hawkish tendencies. Tell me, what will we look like if all we care about is an army, not the public welfare? A corrupt military regime, that is what! When creditors swarm our government and our institutions, will you be satisfied that we have achieved your precious lands in Bolivia, at the cost of our treasury and our fiscal sovereignty? Do not let this piece of beef make your eyes stray away from the entire herd of cattle, General. "Glory"? The humiliation of national bankruptcy is no glory, sir! What honor shall we have when our treasury lays empty, our army in a state of mutiny due to a lack of money either way, our people suffering the cruel repressions of our financial deficiencies? What voice shall we command when the powers of Europe look upon our shores and see nothing but desolate Chileans who have no gold to offer and only a voice to whimper? They will think us both weak and inept! You may command your glory, but leave us to our own devices. Our present system must provide a gentler means of redressing your hatred towards Bolivia, your vainglorious demeanor. My dear Senate you must not adopt this evil measure! It is the work of the devil! Leave it for happier times, when we can afford to put ourselves on the fiery path of total destruction: never!

Fortunately, my fellow Senators maintain a higher regard for a peace well-suited to our current circumstances. Let those petty little Bolivians, those revanchist Peruvians, those backward Brazilians, those radical Argentinians, and those extravagant European powers estrange themselves from each other by allowing the fermentation of a path towards perpetual war, while our country prospers as the merchant of the high seas, miner of God's domain! Profit from their dissent, but never tamper with their conflict. While they will weaken each other, we will grow. While they engage in the same reckless policies as our dear General would suggest, calmer sentiment will ensure Chile is protected from the influences of the Devil. The General's livelihood depends on war, the army's livelihood depends on war, but we have no war to offer them, nor the money if they shall demand the current military environment in peacetime settings. Severe your ties immediately if you are dissatisfied with sensible caution in procedure, but please let us enjoy peace and prosperity. Why should we crush our people in exchange for the army's prosperity? The army is not Chile's future, it is the people! Disturbing the peace for no good reason except for the army's interests, wasting money we do not have and men we can not afford to lose, and for what? Land of almost no value? Europe may squabble over honor and the tiniest of border adjustments, but we cannot, General! You dream that we are like our former mother country hundreds of years ago, or Great Britain at the present time. Separate dreams from reality and we shall find common ground.
 
Last edited:

Soulstrider

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Except Senõr Braulio Silva, none here is saying that we should be quiet, let the other countries rule over South America and relinquish our military. Our nation has been devastated by several wars, we need to fortify the country and the people, we need to modernize and expand our industries, an healthy country is necessary for a strong army, immediately investing in the army before straightening the economy and healing the scars of war will only lead to ruin.
Let the other South American countries fight their petty wars, we shall bid our time, a strong economy and industry will allows us to field stronger army and to achieve supremacy in this region.
 
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unmerged(339449)

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Senator Romano, war has never been good for a nations economy, and if we do not keep our military strong, the Argentinians and the Bolivians will attack. Why do you think the powers of Europe all have strong armies? They know the power that military force provides, and they know that they must have it. If we must loose money then so be it, debt can be paid off, loosing territory and people can not. Education, industry, and military power are vital for a nation to prosper. Anything beyond that must take a backseat.