Serialkeys

[jordarkelf]

As long as it is done like with Diplomacy, I don't mind it. It makes sense to keep the extra content and online play for those with a registered copy.

But I really hate CD checks. They serve no purpose other than irritating the legal buyers, pirates use patches to avoid them anyway.

 

[Gaute65]

A serial key is OK as long you don't need to have the CD in the CD rom. That you have to register to get patches is ok. That you need to register for reading bug/ tech forums is not a good idea. But you need to be register to post in these forums.

 

[Johan]

Yeah, and guys like me - people who actually pay for your games and tries to contribute to the forum. Oh well. I've had my say. It's obviously up to you. If keeping pirates out is more important than keeping a few "annoying" customers in, so be it.

As one little story... Back when we kept track of ip's downloading patches...

We had about 500 sold copies in one fairly rich western european country for eu1. We had 5,000 unique ip's from that country downloading each patch for that territory, during the first few days of release of a patch.

Considering we pay for bandwidth, its not that fun to pay people to pirate your games.

As I view it.. registering a game is the best option, as I am fervently against cd-protections, since they fuck the users over. I personally refuse to buy games which are copy-protected like that.

 

[jordarkelf]

As for tech support only for registered users, is anyone else reading Michael Russel's blog at romsteady.net? The guy does support for Remedy Games, and has some really interesting posts on piracy. The Hidden Cost of Piracy is a great insight in just what pirates cost a company.

"For the last five weeks, support requests for the pirated version of the game outnumbered support requests from legitimate purchasers. Last week, the pirates outnumbered the true customers by almost five to one."

This blows the argument that software piracy hurts no-one since nothing is really being stolen out of the water.

Registering a game to be eligible for support (and bonus content?) is the only method which doesn't hurt any paying customer. If you steal a game, you don't deserve support, and a company certainly shouldn't lose any support time for you.

 

[Brownbeard]

Btw. I really like how patches work on Gamersgate. Once its out(ie. V:R patch), its added to the files you can download and install. Its even better than hunting down the patch on www.paradoxplaza.com.

As for cereal keys, I really dont mind those, since you only gotta type them in once... although their effectivity is questionable.

Speaking of which, none of these issues really tackle the Gamersgate version, since its got a decryption mechanism of its own. Whatever copy protection the cd version features, it does not concern me one way or the other, cause I'm getting Gamersgate version on day 1.

 

[smn_]

As I view it.. registering a game is the best option, as I am fervently against cd-protections, since they fuck the users over. I personally refuse to buy games which are copy-protected like that.

I still remember my old laptop and the "copy protection" on the original EU2 CD (Pan Vision or whatever the nordic publisher is). The copy protection was so flawed that my laptop didn't recognize the CD at all. So the only way to install and play was to get a portable PCMCIA CD-ROM drive to plug in the laptop. I still have it somewhere around .. Now that was what I call fucking users over.

I'm so glad the later patches removed the CD check.

 

[unmerged(37697)]

That's nothing. Try Superpower 2, or Star Wars: Empire at War.

Took me about three days to get them working, and that's without trying to make backups!

 

[Mr. G]

As one little story... Back when we kept track of ip's downloading patches...

We had about 500 sold copies in one fairly rich western european country for eu1. We had 5,000 unique ip's from that country downloading each patch for that territory, during the first few days of release of a patch.
Considering we pay for bandwidth, its not that fun to pay people to pirate your games.

I completly agree to that. The pirates should be prevented to downloaded it form paradox.

I am fervently against cd-protections, since they fuck the users over. I personally refuse to buy games which are copy-protected like that.

That's very good to hear, since what's the point of develop a copy protection that "destroys" the computer, and that's cracked only some hours after release (or at glance some days...)?
Besides, I have at least two games that I have bought, whose copy protections isn't compatible with windows XP. So that's also an aspect to think about...

But still I would be happy to get an awnser on my question pleas; "Will I need two keys to play only in lan? Or is that not yet decided?"
Thankful for answers!

 

[ComradeOm]

I have no problem with serial keys. I've used them before and never had any issues. All it means is that you type in a certain number during installation. Simple, no?

So while I sympathise with the OP who may, or may not, be able to play with his brother without buying another copy; the tone of some of the posters here has surprised me. Are you not able to input a simple number on the installation screen? This is not a major task.

 

[Lord Martin]

I would like to go back to the time when you had to look in the manual and write the second word in the third pharagraph on page 45 to continue playing. Like in old good Kings Quest... hmm.. V i think, and probably in some older games I´m to young to have played.

I wonder how many "I need a pdf version of the manual because my mum throwed away / the dog eat / my little brother thrashed / my original manual" threads that would come up?

 

[Ganso]

I wonder how many "I need a pdf version of the manual because my mum throwed away / the dog eat / my little brother thrashed / my original manual" threads that would come up?

NOt many I guess; pirates and the entire network connected to them would evolve to adapt, as well as you have sites providing serials and cracks you would have sites providing those codes too.

Eh, reminds me of the security code used in Indiana Jones Atlantis, they had a round-card that you had to spin according to the indications at start, hilarious!

Anyway, regarding the topic, I don't really care what protection they put as long as it's not Starforce or the like; why not use the same model they have been using so far, seems to have worked pretty well.

 

[Grosshaus]

Secondly, I'd like to see the bug/support forum of any game before I buy it. Gives me an idea of how bug-riddled the game is, what problems are users out there experiencing, will it work on my machine, will Castellon be handling the support questions, etc.

Thirdly, I think this will hurt the forum and Paradox as a company. The availabilty of the forums has always been the strength of Paradox games - just look at the number of mods there are for Eu2! By making it more unaccessible I think they stand to lose alot of that unpaid, grunt work this forum supplies.

I think a good compromise between ease of access and fighting the costs of piracy is to have tech support and bug forums that are visible for all, but only people who have registered their games can post there.

But in HoI2 Paradox did neither. There customers were asked to report bugs via e-mail directly to Paradox instead of a forum. Not a bad choice, since the forum would collapse if saved games needed to fix many bugs were attached there.

All should be able to see the modding forum, but without owning the game there is really no need for anybody to post there anything.

 

[Jolt]

I still remember a time one of my online WOW friends said she had bought a game (I can't recall which was. Baldur's Gate or something Gate) and she had broken her game cd in an accident, and she thought that legitimatly gave her permission to go into eMule and just download it. I tried to argue against it since she it was a breaking of Intelectual Propriety (I think she was a Law Student) but she was telling me that since she had already payed for the IP of the game, she wouldn't buy it again, and that she couldn't even be sued. Oh well, we argued for some half an hour until I had to leave. I'm no Law genius, but I'm fairly certain she couldn't download the game like that. Although it would suck if I'd break a CD and download the game again. But the easiness of getting a game in the internet simply crumbles most honesty in the gaming industry. Just simply going to google and typing "game x torrent" will most likely get you what you want in a matter of days. I actually support Steam very much since it's the only functional (Even if it's only for online game-play) anti-piracy system that works.

 

[Registered]

I still remember a time one of my online WOW friends said she had bought a game (I can't recall which was. Baldur's Gate or something Gate) and she had broken her game cd in an accident, and she thought that legitimatly gave her permission to go into eMule and just download it. I tried to argue against it since she it was a breaking of Intelectual Propriety (I think she was a Law Student) but she was telling me that since she had already payed for the IP of the game, she wouldn't buy it again, and that she couldn't even be sued. Oh well, we argued for some half an hour until I had to leave. I'm no Law genius, but I'm fairly certain she couldn't download the game like that. Although it would suck if I'd break a CD and download the game again. But the easiness of getting a game in the internet simply crumbles most honesty in the gaming industry. Just simply going to google and typing "game x torrent" will most likely get you what you want in a matter of days. I actually support Steam very much since it's the only functional (Even if it's only for online game-play) anti-piracy system that works.

If she paid for it i see no reason why she should not be able to download it if the CD was broken. It's not dissimilar from creating a backup of your game, which is legal (at least it is over here). Certainly i see no moral problem with it.

 

[unmerged(37697)]

If she paid for it i see no reason why she should not be able to download it if the CD was broken. It's not dissimilar from creating a backup of your game, which is legal (at least it is over here). Certainly i see no moral problem with it.

I agree. For me, it is a moral, and not a legal, argument.

 

[ComradeOm]

If she paid for it i see no reason why she should not be able to download it if the CD was broken. It's not dissimilar from creating a backup of your game, which is legal (at least it is over here). Certainly i see no moral problem with it.

Because in legal terms downloding games without paying is well... illegal. Personally I feel that the friend in this case was morally justified but its impossible to avoid the fact that she obtained a copy of a game without paying for it.

 

[Registered]

Because in legal terms downloding games without paying is well... illegal. Personally I feel that the friend in this case was morally justified but its impossible to avoid the fact that she obtained a copy of a game without paying for it.

I'm fairly sure that downloading a game you already own (have already paid for) is legal here. Certainly it works that way with music.

 

[ComradeOm]

I'm fairly sure that downloading a game you already own (have already paid for) is legal here. Certainly it works that way with music.

I would be extremely surprised if that were the case.

Downloading a replacement from a developer (a la GG) is one thing but its hard to imagine that downloading a ripped copy of a game from a P2P service is in anyway legal.

 

[Mr. G]

I would be extremely surprised if that were the case.

Downloading a replacement from a developer (a la GG) is one thing but its hard to imagine that downloading a ripped copy of a game from a P2P service is in anyway legal.

When discussing these; think about that different countries has different laws.

 

[Belissarius]

As one little story... Back when we kept track of ip's downloading patches...

We had about 500 sold copies in one fairly rich western european country for eu1. We had 5,000 unique ip's from that country downloading each patch for that territory, during the first few days of release of a patch.

Considering we pay for bandwidth, its not that fun to pay people to pirate your games.

As I view it.. registering a game is the best option, as I am fervently against cd-protections, since they fuck the users over. I personally refuse to buy games which are copy-protected like that.

Um so is the key tied to IP addresses?

I have downloaded patches from multiple ip addresses to get the readme file of the patch. While I can read the patch over the net at work I dont like to be seen viewing a gaming forum but reading the readme file in word makes it look like I'm working. So I look like a pirate even though I have bought the copy. I also have moved and patched the game thus yet another ip address is added. Changed ISP and yet another IP address is added. Granted that doesnt account for the 10 times factor. But I am on a floating IP address as it is meaning my ISP doesnt guarentee my IP address, so if this key is tied to IP addresses I could find myself classed as a pirate just because my IP address changed? Its very common for ISP to have floating IP addresses at least with my high-band cable internet service providers in canada. I couldnt find one that doesnt do this unless you pay an extremely high fee.

Also how do you stop people from just getting a patch from their friends who have a legal copy? And not everyone has complet accesss to the net. You might be able to get patches downloaded through a computer at work or a friend but dont actually have internet service at home.

Also I never like registering as quite frankly I dont want my personal information out there. Privacy is getting rarer and rarer.