Sectors Freeing All Slaves

[mostballerwizard]

And if the devs can't manage that, then the default should be to stop the AI from managing slaves as the default setting, because it causes the least damage to slave-owning empire management. Right now, a slaver empire is literally unmanageable unless you mod out sectors completely.

I'm just as frustrated as you are, but let's try to avoid the hyperbole - collectivist slaver empires are working fine. The specific problem is xeno slavery in xenophobic conquest-oriented empires. You can be Space Marx and enslave the proletariat all you want, you just can't be Space Hitler.

 

[Silfae]

I'm just as frustrated as you are, but let's try to avoid the hyperbole - collectivist slaver empires are working fine. The specific problem is xeno slavery in xenophobic conquest-oriented empires. You can be Space Marx and enslave the proletariat all you want, you just can't be Space Hitler.

That still remains pretty limiting. You can't be space Roman Empire, you can't be space Spanish Empire, you can't be space Ottoman Empire and so forth for what concerns enslavement policies. The current setup for slavery makes it so either you have it in a 1984-esque "all people are owned by the State" way or not at all.

 

[Zenicetus]

I'm just as frustrated as you are, but let's try to avoid the hyperbole - collectivist slaver empires are working fine. The specific problem is xeno slavery in xenophobic conquest-oriented empires. You can be Space Marx and enslave the proletariat all you want, you just can't be Space Hitler.

I used the specific term "slaver empire," which I don't think describes Space Marx.

Semantics aside, do you disagree that the default for sector AI should be not to emancipate because it causes the least amount of trouble? That should work pretty well for Space Marx as well as Space Hitler.

 

[Lady Lacroix]

It wasn't enough that sectors exist but they seem to have been expanded.

I honestly cannot recall the last time a game actively interfered with my playing it this much.

it makes me not want to play the game anymore. and that really sucks.

 

[mostballerwizard]

I used the specific term "slaver empire," which I don't think describes Space Marx.

Semantics aside, do you disagree that the default for sector AI should be not to emancipate because it causes the least amount of trouble? That should work pretty well for Space Marx as well as Space Hitler.

Er yeah I just meant Collectivist slavery is working fine, and saying 'everything is broken' when it's not is a good way for the dev reading the bug report to think 'I fixed that already' which inhibits progress on the actual bug.

As to what the default sector AI should be...I dunno. If you enslave a sector pop on a mineral tile, but later on you set that sector to research, and a research station gets built over the mineral tile, I think the pop should get freed. That is a moderate corner case, but goes to show that the issue is complicated. I haven't thought deeply about how I would constrain sector AI vis-a-vis slavery, and I personally find it more helpful when users point out problems rather than suggest fixes anyway.

Factions are another problem - the sector should probably pay attention to 'whoa there are a hojillion malcontent slaves on this planet and no defensive armies, maybe I should free some folk' and that's a hard problem, because the goal of sectors avoiding tons of micromanagement is good and laudable but off the top of my head I can't think of how sectors should handle slavery with respect to factions in a way that doesn't cause the player a bunch of tedious clicking. You could have a button for 'sectors allow slaves' and maybe another one for 'I'm not afraid of slave revolts' but the second button is inelegant and only the first button causes the faction micro problem. Tough spot.

 

[seanguy68]

I have to agree i love playing this game but this "feature" is breaking the game.

All the devs need to do is add a button that stops/allows enslavement/emancipation of slaves, This would make everybody happy and would be EXTREMELY easy to add in and fix a game breaking bug.

 

[Timson]

This truly is a game breaking bug for anyone who started as as aggressive empire.
You conquer a state - you enslave all the Pops - you are forced to create a sector - and BAM! all slaves are emancipated with 0 happines, food production (and all production) goes to negative and there is starvation.
Nice job Sector AI that players are forced to use by game mechanics!

Xeno slavery is absolutely BROKEN and there is no point in playing xenophobe ethics as for 1.2.2. version of the game.

 

[Migthy]

I've had that problem too. I had to abolish slavery in the end. Imagine my species as decadent and collectivists without slaves.
I started purges tho..

 

[Draguss]

merni is currently working on a toggle option that will let us tell sectors to never emancipate (and possibly never enslave) slaves, so slaver empires should be fun to play again soon.

 

[gdj]

merni is currently working on a toggle option that will let us tell sectors to never emancipate (and possibly never enslave) slaves, so slaver empires should be fun to play again soon.

If the toggle does not prevent enslavement as well, it is pointless. I hope Merni understands this too (i presume he does).

 

[Draguss]

I think she said she was adding a toggle to have sectors not mess with slaves at all either way, so we should be good. I'm just excited for the completion of the new button and hope it comes in time for (or before) the next patch.

 

[Zenicetus]

Thinking some more about that toggle for sector AI managing slavery...

It's definitely a short-term fix we need, but I wonder how that balances with what the other AI factions in the game are doing?

If the AI factions with a slavery ethos/policy are constantly flipping their pops back and forth from slavery to emancipated based on most efficient use of tiles (and I would assume that alien factions are basically working like our Sector AI's), then will they keep doing that, even if the player sets the toggle to stop their Sector AI from doing it? That might give the AI a major advantage relative to the player.

Or does what the player sets for Sector AI (wrt slavery) also force every AI in the game not to flip their pops back and forth into slavery also? I would hope it works this way... I think... although maybe there is an argument for giving them free rein.

 

[Agamemnic]

Sector AI is truly the bane of my existence. Every playthrough I find myself having to spend hours re-arranging my strategies just to accomodate the sectors.

Sector rebuilds over my modules, hogs energy and minerals, leaves multiple buildings undeveloped, can't share strategic resources...and now this.

Glad the devs are working on this specific problem but we need way more buttons for sector behaviours

 

[HenkieDePost]

I'd say that sectors should be designed as handy tools to reduce micromanagement when you don't want it. This means that sectors should atleast have an option to NEVER make the hard decisions like when to enslave or emancipate pops and leave it to the player. (I'd rather they just don't interfere with it at all but having an option will be friendlier towards people who don't really mind what sectors do). In fact, To add on this I also think that you should be able to override sectors and build stuff on their planets without having to remove the planet from the sector, build what you want and add it again, but that's kinda a topic for another thread. I just don't really understand why sectors, which should be 'helpful' tools to add onto your own management, are constantly forcing things through like this without you having a say in it. Kinda ruins the entire idea of sectors for me to be honest. It can be that I just misunderstood what sectors should be, but at the moment it seems sectors are not just tools which reduce micro. They remove micro and management alltogether.

 

[Silfae]

That is more of a question of the lack of a Centralization mechanic, which could justify and make interesting a lack of control over sectors in general or specific sectors in certain circumstances. A client state that has just been assimilated and turned into a sector, which still has different ethics and possibly a different governor, could just keep going on its own way, funding research rather than mining efforts or keeping a soft stance on slavery, unless the empire becomes centralized enough to strictly impose its policies on all sectors from above.
But that is an entirely different matter, the current setup is just bugged.

 

[seanguy68]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=730314636


Mod that fixes this bug.

 

[Agamemnic]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=730314636


Mod that fixes this bug.

Many thanks for this. Been using your mod for a few hours and it works perfectly.

 

[Draguss]

Nice mod! Very grateful to its author. It should help a little bit in the meantime.

Has there been any word on the new sector toggle button yet that keeps the sector from interfering with who we choose to enslave?

 

[Person012345]

It is also that.

It is not the other thing. In any empire I would run, ENSLAVING CITIZENS would be a top-level decision, not something a planetary governor could just decide to do on a whim. Allowing sector AI to control slavery makes slavery entirely useless to me and I think it was an idiotic decision.

 

[Draguss]

The problem will be resolved as soon as we get our new button to toggle the sectors being able to emancipate any of our slaves. I'm still hoping we get some word on that soon (perhaps it being present in the next patch) after the very well-deserved vacation comes to a close.

I've been occasionally peeking through these threads with the subject matter to see if we have any word of when the button might be added to the game.