Sectors Freeing All Slaves

[gdj]

From the descriptions so far it seems that sector Ai works better with collectivists than with xenpohobes.

But to be more specific, this back and forth enslaving/emancipating 4 times per minute(!) occurs with pops with happiness of 10-20% when free. That´s at least what i observed so far.

 

[grommile]

But to be more specific, this back and forth enslaving/emancipating 4 times per minute(!) occurs with pops with happiness of 10-20% when free. That´s at least what i observed so far.

Flipflopping assignments is obviously a bug. You should file a bug report with an attached save.

 

[Zenicetus]

Because it's an aspect of controlling a planet's administration.

So if the player is running a slaver empire where the policy is to never emancipate xeno slaves -- like say, role-playing the Kzin Patriarchy -- then that gets taken away whenever you put planets in a sector? That's ridiculous. The Patriarch would have that sector governor's head on a pike outside the city gates, if he tried it.

There should either be a setting to allow sector AI to emancipate or not. Or else just stop the AI from doing it, and let the player suffer whatever consequences result from inefficient use of the slaves.

 

[Anschau]

I think there needs to be a button on keep pops free or enslaved.

 

[Artannon]

Removing slavery tolerance from Divine Mandate also means all races with Decadent need to be collectivist -- Xenophobes won't cut it by default.

 

[Adrogund]

Damn straight. I'm playin a good ol Human Star Empire (militaristic, fanatic xenophobe) that goes around and conquers and enslaves all filthy xenos. Half of my population are enslaved xenos. Now all of a sudden that half my Empire is revolting against me because the damn sectors keep freeing 100% of all the xenos. I'll re-enslave them, and then 2-3 days later the sectors will emancipate them again. And more revolts.

Give us a button that does not allow sectors to emancipate slaves. Slavery is no longer a viable option in this patch. It might as well not even be in the game.

 

[Silfae]

Removing slavery tolerance from Divine Mandate also means all races with Decadent need to be collectivist -- Xenophobes won't cut it by default.

Yes, but that's just wrong. It removes a lot of possibilities, already it seems weird to me that individualists cannot take alien slaves (of course they shouldn't be able to enslave their own, but not to be barred entirely). A decadent race should not need to be collectivist to enslave xenos (it shouldn't be spiritual either, but that's another matter); the concept of "decadence" in itself is, from what I see, very self-centered, opposed to collectivism.

Anyway, as said above, this is not something that sector AI of the player's empire should do in the first place, neither enslaving nor emancipating. It is the player's decision who gets what treatment; there could be circumstances where a species that usually enslaves populations wants to give special treatment to a particular enemy, or a species that usually doesn't wants to make an example over another.

 

[gdj]

Any ideas how/where to mod this out?

 

[drake546]

I think there needs to be a button on keep pops free or enslaved.

Sectors need a ton more control in general. We should be able to set their budgets for what they spend their income on as well. Why the hell are my sectors wasting their money on pointless defense troops and starbase upgrades I don't want?

I don't mind the idea of Sectors, the implementation simply needs to allow us more control over their behavior.

 

[Red Death]

One solution: never let the AI enslave or emancipate based on what building the pop is working. Instead, let players do the emancipating/enslaving, and have the sector AI just try to make sure slaves are working mines and not labs whenever possible. I think that would go quite a long way to making this work better. After all, since pops can be moved around, the building they are currently working is not relevant with regards to the decision of enslaving them or not.

 

[grommile]

Any ideas how/where to mod this out?

Set core system limit to ten thousand.

Most of the behaviour of the Sector AI is - as far as I can see - entirely embedded in the executable and thus unmoddable. (The sector type definitions in common/sector_types control production targets, ship type construction, whether sector AI will build military stations, and the relative weights of the sector types for AI choice).

 

[GC13]

My sectors in my Fanatic Collectivist, Spiritualist empire enslaves pretty much anyone on a mineral or food tile that doesn't put them into the malcontent faction. Haven't noticed any constant back and forth enslaving/emancipation in 1.2 as of yet.

I haven't been watching my sector governor closely, but as soon as I made my first sector it enslaved a bunch of people—the only problem was that they were recently conquered aliens who weren't collectivist yet. Then, to make it worse, I check back later and there are a bunch of very unhappy free Pops who had been recently enslaved. I had to ban slavery so my sector governor didn't ruin my ethos drift efforts (which is going a lot slower than I'd have thought it would for a fanatically spiritualist Divine Mandate with a mausoleum and reeducation campaigns on the planet).

 

[solops]

This is inexcusable. The sector AI has no business mucking with stuff like slaves. Sector AIs should not be able to set or change policy. At least get it out of the emancipation business.

 

[Zenicetus]

Uh oh... we just got the 1.2 hotfix and I don't see anything about this being fixed. And now they'll go on vacation for a month?

Maybe it was fixed and just didn't make it into the patch notes. Otherwise it means modding out the sector cap, and hand-managing all planets to avoid rogue AI emancipation.

 

[rudders10]

Yeah don't see anything there. Major bug so you would think it would be sorted.

 

[Theodotus1]

This is inexcusable. The sector AI has no business mucking with stuff like slaves. Sector AIs should not be able to set or change policy. At least get it out of the emancipation business.

When the game was first released, the sector AI didn't enslave or emancipate. And people complained. And so they changed it. And still people are unhappy.

I wouldn't call this "inexcusable." I'd say people should be careful what they ask for.

 

[grommile]

I wouldn't call this "inexcusable." I'd say people should be careful what they ask for.

I'd say that different people asked for different things - and also that some of the reported Sector AI behaviour regarding emancipation/enslavement in 1.2 was very obviously buggy.

 

[rudders10]

Yeah I don't have a preference of the sector doing or me doing it. However off the sector is doing it they need to do it correctly. Lack of communication around this which would be fine if we don't have to wait 5 weeks for someone to look at it again.

 

[Theodotus1]

I'd say that different people asked for different things - and also that some of the reported Sector AI behaviour regarding emancipation/enslavement in 1.2 was very obviously buggy.

It's either buggy or operating in a fashion that has not been explained clearly. Assuming it hasn't been addressed yet, it needs to be cleared up.

But the level of emotion seems a bit overblown.

 

[Zenicetus]

When the game was first released, the sector AI didn't enslave or emancipate. And people complained. And so they changed it. And still people are unhappy.

I wouldn't call this "inexcusable." I'd say people should be careful what they ask for.

I don't think that's the issue here. The central problem is that the devs have introduced two features in this game -- slavery and AI sector management -- without proper design and testing to make the two ideas compatible.

It's reasonable for players to want the sector AI to manage slaves in some situations, like if you're running a "soft slavery" style of empire. It's also reasonable to want the opposite in other situations where slavery is total and emancipation doesn't exist (you're role-playing the Kzin).

All it needs is a setting labeled "Sector AI allowed to enslave and emancipate?" in the setup menus.

And if the devs can't manage that, then the default should be to stop the AI from managing slaves as the default setting, because it causes the least damage to slave-owning empire management. Right now, a slaver empire is literally unmanageable unless you mod out sectors completely.