Screenshot!

[unmerged(5367)]

Originally posted by Fireblade
I remember that mission on AoE2. I totally kicked his ass

Ah that one.. solved all problems by building a wall between mecka and medina (or which ever those two cities were..). Then tons of trading to finance my war (and buy stone..).

 

[unmerged(8915)]

Originally posted by Fireblade
I remember that mission on AoE2. I totally kicked his ass [/B]

1.
what disappointed me about AOE2 was the fact that in the crusading campaign i had to play saladin..

i mean no offense, but i just couldnt get to it that much. luckily with CK i'll be able to set the score straight and play a good old fashioned crusading host.

one thing though, will i only submit troops to a crusade even if the monarch joins it or will i be able to choose where the army will march, what will it siege etc.? to what extent will i be able to control a ducal army of my realm on a crusade? (i suppose none, but just making sure).


2.
in terms of fortifications, i know its more appealing to have citywalls represent the level of fortifications, but if we are dealing with provinces and not individual cities, wouldnt it be more accurate to have castles instead of city walls to represent the time and enemy army needed to take control of province? fex:

pallisade->1 castle in province
wooden wall->2 castles
etc.

when using castles, the number could be set at around 10-15 meaning all possible locations for a castle were used already. maybe a thought for another game..

 

[Havard]

Let's keep to AoE discussions in OT. OK?

 

[unmerged(485)]

Originally posted by ashbery76
It looks a different map from other E.U games, it look's realistic.

Thank goodness! After staring at Eu and EU II and HOI maps I am certainly ready for a new look. Doesn't even need to be geographically correct as long as it looks different than the previous maps. Nothing wrong with the maps for EU and EU II but I wish the map would have changed a little more for HOI. So with CK a new look is welcome.

 

[unmerged(11620)]

Originally posted by historycaesar
The Crusades where a way for Europe's knights to vent, and get them out of Europe....

That's a misconception. Yeah, sure, Urban II argued that it would be better for the knights to go put their skills to use in the service of the faith in the Holy Land then to kill each other in Europe, but I doubt that was his reason for calling it. For one, neither Urban nor anyone else thought that all, or even most of the knights would stay in the Holy Land; from the outset it was obvious that the knights would come back after they fulfilled their vow. And, it was not clear that there would need to be more fallow-up Crusades at the time.

The Crusades were first and last fought for religious reasons. Some Crusaders went hoping to achieve power or wealth(The Normans mostly). But, the vast majority went because they believed that it was not right that the Holy City of Jerusalem be occupied by enemies of the Faith. They were essentially motivated by the same felling that had motivated Christians from Europe for quite some time, despite the dangers, to visit the Holy places. Pilgrimage was a common act of piety for Christians of the time, it was a frequent penance given to repentant sinners. The Crusades were not much different then a pilgrimage in the medieval mind.

 

[Drakken]

What? I find myself agreeing with the Leper King this time?

I cannot stop myself laughing when I heard this :

"A Pligrim Adventure! Your Priest says : Go! Your Bishop says : Go! Your Pope says : Goooo! A Pilgrimage in Arms! [...] Raymond, count of Toulouse; He hammered the Maurs in Spain, now watch him smash them in the Holy Lands! [...]"

Drakken

 

[Sam Vimes]

Why is the map so blurry (might have been asked a thousand time, if so, sorry...)?

is in order to keep things secret or bcause it's unfinished?

 

[Havard]

Originally posted by Sam Vimes
Why is the map so blurry (might have been asked a thousand time, if so, sorry...)?

is in order to keep things secret or bcause it's unfinished?

It's because it's a doctored verion of this picture:

 

[unmerged(11620)]

Originally posted by Havard
It's because it's a doctored verion of this picture....

Lol That's hilarious. Where is that really?

 

[unmerged(6777)]

Originally posted by The Leper King
Lol That's hilarious. Where is that really?

That's really where it is...in a monastery.

Check out Sergei's Christmas thread for a link to about a dozen pictures from this presentation. This was a little present he left for us to whet our appetites.

Edit: look here

 

[unmerged(11620)]

Originally posted by Drakken
What? I find myself agreeing with the Leper King this time?

Don't worry, it gets easier the more you do it

I cannot stop myself laughing when I heard this :

"A Pligrim Adventure! Your Priest says : Go! Your Bishop says : Go! Your Pope says : Goooo! A Pilgrimage in Arms! [...] Raymond, count of Toulouse; He hammered the Maurs in Spain, now watch him smash them in the Holy Lands! [...]"

Drakken

And count Raymond further brings home my point. He was already a very wealthy noble, who probably lost more money on the adventure then anything (I never have bought the idea that most of the Crusaders were after wealth, the enterprise was prohibitively expensive). And once more he was also quite old (I'm pretty sure he was the oldest of the leaders of the Crusade. Does any one know how old? I forgit), and I think I read somewhere that one of his reasons for going was his desire to finish his life in the Holy Land; which is the kind of reason you might think a pilgrim would have.

 

[Havard]

Originally posted by The Leper King

And count Raymond further brings home my point. He was already a very wealthy noble, who probably lost more money on the adventure then anything (I never have bought the idea that most of the Crusaders were after wealth, the enterprise was prohibitively expensive). And once more he was also quite old (I'm pretty sure he was the oldest of the leaders of the Crusade. Does any one know how old? I forgit), and I think I read somewhere that one of his reasons for going was his desire to finish his life in the Holy Land; which is the kind of reason you might think a pilgrim would have.

AFAIK he was in his mid-fifties when he left home. An old man by the time...

And I totally agree with you on the motivation of the crusaders. It is pretty unanimous among modern scholars on the crusades to look on them as a religious calling first and most.

Sure - there were a few whoset out with a goal of conquest and booty (like e.g. Bohemond and his Norman followers) but IMO these were very few in the crowd.
Sure - it was a way of venting the aggression of some nobles, but not a very effective one then. The numbers of crusaders who left Europe is microscopic compared to the numbers who stayed behind...
Sure - it could be a way for a younger son of a noble to win glory and riches, but not a very effective one then. The cost of financing one crusader was staggering, and entire families could be seen put themself in debt to send a man on piligrimage, selling land, pawning away everything they owned. And I dare to claim: None of them came back with enough in their pockets to pay the debts!

 

[Sam Vimes]

The screeni looks even more beautifull on the picture!

I just can't wait.

 

[unmerged(6160)]

Well If you look at the good points and the bad points of the crusades.
Bad Points = Thousands of Innocent Jews and Muslims where killed, Crusade of 1204 destroyed Byzantium beyond recovery, many people died, and nothing was really accomplished, oh yeah we got Jerusalem for 50 years, go us...


So all that together shows that the crusades where just a waste, except that Islamic ideas of architechture,(living in a cold castle is not my cup of tea), algebra(gee though most knights couldn't read, silly fools), the translation of Aristole(and they thought the bible had all the answers ), and other Islamic ideas where brought back to Europe.

 

[unmerged(8913)]

Originally posted by historycaesar
So all that together shows that the crusades where just a waste, except that Islamic ideas of architechture,(living in a cold castle is not my cup of tea), algebra(gee though most knights couldn't read, silly fools), the translation of Aristole(and they thought the bible had all the answers ), and other Islamic ideas where brought back to Europe.

Well . . . actually, many of these ideas filtered in from Spain after the reconquesta, especially the science, philosophy, and translations of ancient Greek and Roman writers.

 

[unmerged(6160)]

True, but many did come directly from the East via the Crusades.

 

[unmerged(9428)]

Originally posted by The Leper King
The Crusades were not much different then a pilgrimage in the medieval mind.

I think it was the combination of both, firstly to show that one was indeed a pious person and secondly to get into some bloody fights, something no self respecting Frank could resist (the fact that they could dismember some muslems instead of christians was just the cherry on the cake). For many Flemish young knights a crusade (holy land, eastern europe or spain, eastern europe was most popular) was a rite of passage. Even though one was knighted he was only considered a "true" knight once he took up the cross.
I also don't believe too many crusaders were out on profit. Just look at the success of the orders (even though the orders made big profits 99% of the members didn't). I dare say the only ones that made a big profit out of it were the Italian trading cities.

 

[Syt]

I can see Holstein!

Oh, and... "It's full of stars...."

 

[unmerged(739)]

I thought that it said: I buried Sergei...

Oh and I can also make out 4 provinces along the coast of southern Norway opposite Northern Denmark.

 

[unmerged(5206)]

Here's a blown up version of the minimap. I don't think Mecca is going to be included. Medina has a good chance though. Or am I wrong? Sergei ?