Screenshot 020910

[unmerged(7996)]

Thanks for the screenie Patric. It looks great.

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Question about trade: How hard will the AI be to deal with? I am thinking back to negotiating peace with the Mameluks vs. negotiating peace with the Golden Horde in EUII. The Horde would give you everything in a peace deal and the Mams would give you provinces as if you were pulling teeth.

Will trading be the same? Can you only trade with your allies? How will the AI neutrals treat your offers? Will they be reasonable?

Basically I think this is a cool feature and am looking forward to playing the game even more now to find out the answers to my own questions.

 

[Vandelay]

Just on resources will the Synthetic oil plants in Germany be represented?

Doomdark confirmed in the recent MGO interview that there will be a tech representing making synthetic oil in the game.

Cheers,
Vandelay

 

[unmerged(3360)]

Like most people on the board I´m somewhat pleased with the possibility to trade goods, but I am disappointet that there is no money(gold) present.

It was said that lend lease is in. Do I as the USA have to give the Brits everything for good?

And, as was also already said, what about minors/neutrals without much raw materials?

One last note: When I as germany buy some steel from sweden, do I have to ship it to one of my ports or do the swedes have to do that? When will I have to ´pay´ it? When I can pick it up in sweden or when it has arrived savely at one of my ports?

In other words: who takes the risks of the transport the buyer or the seller?

 

[pcongre]

Thanks for the screenie Patric, I'm glad Norrköping is in

Next week please give us a spanish screenshot, so we can start complaining about the provinces before the map is hardcoded(pretty please with sugar and tofee and such er sweets on top?)

pcongre da pole

PS: When did sweden get Åland? And which are those norwegian-border oddly shaped provinces?

 

[Smiffus]

Originally posted by zsolo


GOLD mines + initial gold stocks could be a very good compromise. I don't think that it is too late for putting one more resource in.

You mean you hope it's not too late?

 

[Keynes]

Originally posted by King


But the UK didn't need Gold to build destroyers it could just print money, it needed gold to import destroyers.

Thats not quite right - it didnt need gold, it needed dollars. Gold was one way to get those dollars but not the only one. Historically, the most important way to get the dollars was simply borrowing them from the United States. The second most important was by liquidating the susbtantial British=held assets in the United States. Gold is only a small part of the picture.

If your are going to model this properly, you'd need to model the entire international monetary system which is pretty complicated 1936 - 1947, plus stocks of precious metals (including gold), plus worldwide capital flows, plus national monetary policies (again widely variant mechanisms)- including in the case of Britain the complex economic and monetary arrangements with the CW countries. This would be very good and I'd love to see it, but it doesnt seem likely to happen and I suspect most gamers woldnt care for detailed modelling of such things. Using "gold" as a kind of universal solvent to stand in for all these elements could be a possible second best solution. but Im not sure its more desirable than simply abstacting out of the monetary economy altogether.

 

[King]

Originally posted by Keynes

Thats not quite right - it didnt need gold, it needed dollars. Gold was one way to get those dollars but not the only one. Historically, the most important way to get the dollars was simply borrowing them from the United States. The second most important was by liquidating the susbtantial British=held assets in the United States. Gold is only a small part of the picture.

If your are going to model this properly, you'd need to model the entire international monetary system which is pretty complicated 1936 - 1947, plus stocks of precious metals (including gold), plus worldwide capital flows, plus national monetary policies (again widely variant mechanisms)- including in the case of Britain the complex economic and monetary arrangements with the CW countries. This would be very good and I'd love to see it, but it doesnt seem likely to happen and I suspect most gamers woldnt care for detailed modelling of such things. Using "gold" as a kind of universal solvent to stand in for all these elements could be a possible second best solution. but Im not sure its more desirable than simply abstacting out of the monetary economy altogether.

I have to agree here. However to model the global monetary system is may be a bit complicated but to do it in a real time system would probably leave you with a game that requires a massive spec and doesn't do anything else.

 

[Thanak]

In the end, if you want to build something, you need tools (industry), know how (technology), and resources (workers and material). That's it.

Currency in itself is just a convinience to facilitate the transactions. Pay the workers with dollard, deutch marks, francs, food stamps, "volkswagen when the war is over".... in the end it wont matter.

 

[unmerged(7996)]

One last note: When I as germany buy some steel from sweden, do I have to ship it to one of my ports or do the swedes have to do that? When will I have to ´pay´ it? When I can pick it up in sweden or when it has arrived savely at one of my ports?

In other words: who takes the risks of the transport the buyer or the seller?

Good question. Do you need to have an open supply line between the country you trade with? Can I as Germany buy/trade with Mexico? I would think the US would try to stop that.

 

[Winkelried]

Originally posted by Backpack


Good question. Do you need to have an open supply line between the country you trade with? Can I as Germany buy/trade with Mexico? I would think the US would try to stop that.

Another question. If Germany who is at war buys something from neutrals, can it require/ask the neutrals to transport the goods to German ports to prevent the allies from sinking the ships/goods?

 

[Emren]

And how frequently do nations add to their stockpiles from own resources? How often does one then need to trade? Every month, week or day? How quick can you spend your ressources?

So many questions.....

 

[unmerged(1972)]

Originally posted by pcongre
PS: When did sweden get Åland? And which are those norwegian-border oddly shaped provinces?

Why do you think Åland belongs to Sweden in the game? There are no national borders indicated, and there are no troops shown on the Mariehamn province. The reason the sea province is visible is probably because there are ships in the "Stockholm" harbor.

As for those border provinces, they are probably part of Norway, to allow whoever holds Norway a better chance to defend himself from invasion from the sea.

 

[Duritz]

So many questions with so few answers.

I can just see Patric sitting in his little cubicle chuckling at all the confusion the latest screenie has caused.

"NAY! Reject it, tis' a Trojan Horse!" I say........

No more screenies unless they come attached with the relevant part of the manual, otherwise half your audience will go crazy and kill themselves before it's even released!!!

Duritz.

P.S. Anyone have an idea when it will be released downunder? I think Ubisoft are the distributor but the game doesn't even show on their website (and neither does the Australian wing of the company!!! ).

 

[Paradox Interactive]

Chuckling, me? Nah....

 

[unmerged(4848)]

Originally posted by Smiffus


You mean you hope it's not too late?

What can I do apart from hoping...?

 

[unmerged(10761)]

good argument.

this simplified example is a good argument to have 'gold' as an intermediator in the game.
Otherwise you may simply not be able to obtain a certain trade.

Originally posted by jacob-Lundgren
ok here it comes
country a has few resources but a little extra coal and badly needs oil. country b only needs coal but doesnt have extra oil.
country c has both but little steel.
now country a trades coal to b for gold and trades that gold to c for oil who uses that gold for steel and uk uses that gold to buy 5 destroyers. works for me

How is it with the trade embargos (e.g. Japan and oil from the western nations ! no Helium for the Nazis!..though not in this game)..can Japan for instance buy oil indirectly from a country like Uruguay that has bought it from Turkey and that has bought it from the Dutch east indies ??
Can you as an oil selling nation put a complete(direct & 'indirect') trade embargo on a certain country ?

 

[unmerged(5588)]

What about continous trade and ownership of resources?
As far as I know the Japanese imported large amounts of oil from the US before the embargo started. It didn't necessarily buy it from the country of USA though, but from companies in the US who sold to the highest bidder.

So as the USA, I would in real life have to proclaim an embargo (huge diplomatic sign of disapproval), but not otherwise be able stop the flow of oil owned by private companies to other countries. In the HoI system, I'd be able to just not care about the offers Japan makes to the world market, thereby stopping the Japanese advance in Manchuria (Manchuko ) in 1936 without diplomatic penalty.

The only way I can imagine this to be addressed is in some kind of diplomatical penalty if a country does not sell its resources to the highest bidder among neutral countries (however this would be modelled). What about using "auctions" when trading resources?

Regarding gold:
I think one way of modelling the importance of gold would be to give vps for the size of national gold reserves. A neutral country would want to get gold because it would gain vps, while a country at war could gain more vps for using resources to achieve military gains. Ideally this would happen:

A country entering the war would have a gold reserve (set from the beginning of the game + whatever traded). It would use gold to buy supplies necessary for the war (and just as important: other countries would want to buy it as long as they have the goods available). As the war progresses, a country would use more gold, and would use all if it's fighting a desperate battle.

 

[unmerged(9938)]

So if I understand it correctly, in this game you will be abel to lend your allies war material, but you may not trade it. This makes it less interesting playing a minor, but I guess this is also the point. After all they always said it would be major nation game.

I will miss the economic model in a grand strategy game like this, but there will surly be plenty of other things to enjoy. Less interesting to build up your economy, more fun planning war. Hmmm...

 

[pcongre]

Originally posted by 17028
Why do you think Åland belongs to Sweden in the game? There are no national borders indicated, and there are no troops shown on the Mariehamn province. The reason the sea province is visible is probably because there are ships in the "Stockholm" harbor.

sorry I was just shocked that somehow nowadays sweden has got that archipelago and not in 36, if they havent been in a war since er 1750? as I thought..

 

[unmerged(1972)]

Originally posted by pcongre

sorry I was just shocked that somehow nowadays sweden has got that archipelago and not in 36, if they havent been in a war since er 1750? as I thought..

I don't quite understand what you mean. Sweden doesn't have Åland. It was considered permanently Finnish after the residents of the islands held a referendum in 1921, I believe. The people speak Swedish though.