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Velorian

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It depends on what I want out of the specific game, sometimes I'll savescum to ensure one really good ruler to get my dynasty going early, but generally I like the challenge from things turning bad. I definitely consider save scumming to be a form of cheating though (an exploit really, but I don't really see much of a difference), but I'll often use console cheats in my games anyways (pretty much always to strengthen certain AI dynasties, but occasionally to correct what I view as bugs).

I learned long ago how to cheat/mod games and how pointless it is to do so for your own benefit, the game is rarely difficult as is, no reason to cheat unless to guide the story in a direction you had already decided it should go. Most of the best game experiences are gained by playing through hardships, perhaps even intentionally hampering yourself with various "house rules" like avoiding save scumming.

I've sometimes loaded when overly beneficial events happened as well, like when the Seljuks are defeated by the Byzantine Empire from the beginning, in a game where I want to start small and reform the empire.
 

XRW

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It's not cheating. We're not competing against each other. If this were the civfanatics forum and we were all doing the game of the month it's cheating. That said scumming to much can ruin the game.
 

Federalist girl

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Yeah, the game can have hilarious results if you just play on. And I start new games often enough that "winning" is irrelevant.
 

Gball

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Honestly, I have played CK2 to death. Most of my games consist of impossible crap that I set to myself as goals, like create the empire of Iceland, or something. So yeah, I will savescum pretty often, but I don't really care since it is for the personal amusements.

Now, when we play MP 20 of us together...that is a different story entirely ;)
 

Jorlaan

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I do it sometimes for the same reasons as many, rulers dieing way too young for no good reason way too often; my strong, soldier king dies in the first 2 seconds of battle (sorry but he NOT gonna be up there on front line so not accepting it). The sillyness of the AI sometimes just gets to me. I've had situations where there were 2 genious parents giving 7 non-genious children, the main heir married to a genious, 6 more non's, main heir married to yet another genious, 4 more non's...or the strong parents have weak children, then it presists for multiple generations DESPITE throwing more strong spouses in there, it gets old and tiring fast. So I make up for it by not letting that ruler die in battle like a moron once in a while.
 

Alexander Seil

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Wat. Of course savescumming is cheating. You're biasing the RNG. It's no different than opening up the console and manipulating the game directly to give yourself more gold, better traits or whatever, it's just that savescumming is a less efficient way of cheating.

As for those who say they do it to reduce variability - unless you tell me you also savescum when your heir grows up to be a 40 Diplomacy, Attractive, Genius Elusive Shadow, you're still blatantly cheating.
 

A_Dane

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Wat. Of course savescumming is cheating. You're biasing the RNG. It's no different than opening up the console and manipulating the game directly to give yourself more gold, better traits or whatever, it's just that savescumming is a less efficient way of cheating.

As for those who say they do it to reduce variability - unless you tell me you also savescum when your heir grows up to be a 40 Diplomacy, Attractive, Genius Elusive Shadow, you're still blatantly cheating.

Does it count if you reload when your imbecil heir becomes Midas touched? xD
 

Merci357

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In my view it's no cheating - everyone can play the game the way they like, either by modding, console commands, reloading - or none of those. If you like winning a game by rerolling the dice until you get only a 6 as result, and don't accept any lesser result, that's fine. I play neither with you nor against you, so why should I care. For me it's quite simple, bad things happen, and overcoming those odds feels more rewarding then simply not accepting the bad roll or the bad choice. But that's just me, feel free to disagree - after all we play a game for our enjoyment, nothing more.
 

Persiani

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I hate cheating lol i never do it. Like right now I had the great Irish kingdom. (lost half when my king died) because of wars. but what can you do I keep going! My Persian Ireland will not fall (yed modified the duchy of connacht in the beginning making the king persian :p Now I got a Persian Queen controlling Ireland haha
 

tormos

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I feel like the best parts of CKII are when you lose a bunch of land/mess something up and have to spend 40 years fixing your mistake. I haven't save scummed since my very first game. I recommend that everyone play like this, it is much more fun.
 

Kaiser Ludwig

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The bigger question is...

Why do we need to call it 'save scumming' now, when 'reloading' has worked just fine as a label for like 30 years?

As I understand it, 'save scumming' is reloading constantly until you get the desired and optimal result, whilst just reloading is avoiding a particularly nasty result.
 

unmerged(600321)

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It depends. There is no right or wrong way to play (other than cheating, but hey even that is really up to the person). I have reloaded games a few times here and there in the past, but I generally don't bother to anymore. With proper gameplay you can easily get to a 2000+ holding empire before the game ends no matter what you start as and no matter how bad your traits are. Plus, I generally dislike those games where I have the perfect ruler and 2000+ holdings because those games play really slow due to so many things to deal with (talking about an Empire that holds 50-100% of the map as the 2000 holding mark is roughly half the map, maybe a bit more depending on what you take).

Again, do what you find fun. I don't find reloading fun and I tend to find smaller games fun nowadays. Basically, I avoid being too aggressive with my claim fabrication and growth and stay small for as long as possible and even participate in some of those useless holy war campaigns called for by the Pope (instead of backstabbing my King for his Kingdom right when he is weakened during or right after a war).
 

Tuerai

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  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
I have been scumming like a fiend lately with faction revolts. But it's not really even scumming, it's just using an exploit with how you're notified about faction revolts. Since nothing happens until you click one of the buttons to choose to give in to their demands or to declare war, if you just save and reload, the decision box is gone when you reload, and it's like nothing happened. Only using it because I find it ridiculous that every single kingdom and about 20 duchies really want to secede from the Roman Empire when they all have positive relations with me.