• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

nicholas2000

Second Lieutenant
76 Badges
Aug 2, 2011
161
2
  • Sengoku
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Supreme Ruler: Cold War
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
To begin with, there has been much talk since the launch of Crusader Kings 2 about the possibility of playing as a theocracy. Generally, it has been noted that the point of the game is advancing one's dynasty...which is rather hard to accomplish while being a priest that is forbidden to marry. I have, however, crafted a suggestion that I can only hope will be noticed by Paradox (or a modder with ample free time on his/her hands, if such a thing was possible for this), and hopefully implemented someday.

The first issue that needs to be addressed is the problem of advancing one's dynasty while being an unmarried member of the clergy. All said and done, I think this is the least of the problems at hand, with the addition of an ecclesiastical dynasty. How it works is relatively simple: the head of the dynasty is the unmarried member of the clergy that the player plays as. His exact title is relatively unimportant for the suggestion, but I suppose he could be a "Bishop". He has a holding that exists "outside" the world, in a somewhat similar fashion to how the palaces of the merchant families work. I propose calling it a "church" or a "palace", but the name is relatively insignificant for my current purposes.

The player, although unmarried, still runs the family. The player has to run the family well, because he relies on his relatives to produce a son that will be set aside as the heir to the ecclesiastical dynasty's holding "outside" of the world, and thus become the new leader of the dynasty. My suggestion on this front is that it works somewhat similar to how successors are chosen in merchant families, although with one caveat: the oldest unmarried man is the heir, but the player is allowed to designate an heir if the oldest unmarried man is not to his or her liking.

As such, it is absolutely vital that every ecclesiastical dynasty start off with at least one leader (the player) and a male family member that can be married, so you can start him working on producing you a successor. Children can be the leaders of your family, but they can't be elected to any offices (to be explained later on).

The next problem inherent in designing a system is what the player does, and this part involves a near-complete reworking of how the Roman Catholic Church operates in this game. My idea is to add Episcopal Sees, as an entity that exist alongside de jure duchies. So, for example, you could have the "Duchy of Flanders", and within the same de jure territory, you have the "Episcopal See of Flanders". Within the "Episcopal See of Flanders" (which would ideally have its own tab for an ecclesiastical dynasty), much like inside of a Republic, are the various ecclesiastical dynasties that you would be competing with. My suggestion is up to one ecclesiastical dynasty per county that has a church in it. Much like the heads of merchant families compete to become the leader of the Republic, the heads of the ecclesiastical dynasties compete to become the Archbishop of their Episcopal See. The method of deciding the next Archbishop when the previous one dies would depend on the relevant crown laws of the area: if there is Papal Investiture, the next Archbishop is determined by things such as piety, the opinion of the Pope in Rome, campaign fund, etc. If there is Free Investiture, the next Archbishop is determined by the same thing, only replacing the opinion of the Pope in Rome with the opinion of the highest-ranking secular lord in the area.

If an Archbishopric is divided between two independent nations and there is Free Investiture, the opinions of both secular lords are taken into account, with a weighting system according to how much of the Archbishopric is controlled.

Following this, if you are the Archbishop in an area that is independent, you can compete with the other Archbishops in the independent country to be named the Primate of your area. The selection process would mirror the selection of an Archbishop. If there is only one Archbishop in an independent country, he is automatically the Primate for that area.

But, what do you get for being elected an Archbishop or a Primate? You don't inherit any land with the title, but you do get prestige, power and tax money. If a local Bishop likes his Archbishop more than his count, he will pay his taxes to his Archbishop. If an Archbishop likes his Primate more than his secular lord, he will pay his taxes to his Primate. If a Primate likes the Pope more than his secular lord, he will pay his taxes to the Pope. As for more power, that will be detailed below.


So, what do all of these fancy things let you do in a game? It involves another reworking of how the Roman Catholic Church works. Rather than every request for funds, divorces, or excommunications, going directly to the Pope in Rome, the secular authorities have to work their way up the hierarchy. For example, a count would first have to ask whichever Bishop owns the Church holding in his demesne (could be the head of an ecclesiastical dynasty, could be a randomly-generated Bishop). Depending on how much the Bishop likes him, how much he likes the person being targeted, and how much he recognizes the power of the count, he either approves the request (and gets a plus to relations) or denies the request (and gets a negative hit to relations). If he denies the request-that's the end of it. If, however, he approves the request, it is sent to the local Archbishop, where the same process happens again. If it gets beyond the Archbishop, then it goes to the Primate (if the Archbishop and the Primate are different), and if approved by the Primate, it then finally goes to the Pope in Rome for final approval. If a Duke asks, it goes first to the Archbishop, then the Primate, then the Pope. If a King/independent ruler asks, it goes to the Primate and then to the Pope.

Of course, the clergy might not be fond of the secular lord whose requests they are handling, but they might be convinced to let a request slip by if a donation was made to the local church. *wink wink*



And what of your ecclesiastical dynasty? How is its power spread? After all, this is a family-based game, it should be possible to gradually make your family more and more powerful. I propose that this be accomplished through the selection system. For any previous member of your dynasty that has had a certain office (excluding the Papacy), you get more points in your favor. While your dynasty is more likely to maintain control over an Archbishopric or a Primacy, it is not guaranteed. So, theoretically, it would be possible for your family to eventually be virtually guaranteed to be the Primate of your country.

But how do you acquire more holdings? Surely you can't just be expected to have a church that exists "outside" of the world, an Archbishopric, and a Primacy? That would be quite silly indeed. So, while you are still a Bishop, you can petition your local Archbishop to grant you the rights to a landed church that is not owned by the leader of an ecclesiastical dynasty. You then acquire the church through one of two ways: the current Bishop dies, or you raise an army and take it by force. Even if you die before the other Bishop dies, it will still come into your family one way or the other. It will be retained by your ecclesiastical dynasty, unless in situations where you are elected to be the next Pope and it is now filled by a random character.

Under this system, the College of Cardinals and the election to the Papacy remains untouched. If you want to get elected Pope, you have to work your way into the College of Cardinals and get elected Pope (possibly with the help of your secular liege in the form of campaign fund donations).

When you rise to become an Archbishop, you retain any churches or counties that you might hold within the Archbishopric, but you are not allowed to expand outside of your Archbishopric. When you rise to become a Primate, this simply moves you up the hierarchy and grants you access to more funds, and more control over fund requests, divorces, and excommunications. When you rise to become the Pope, however, you have to relinquish your Archbishopric, and your Primacy (if you have one), in addition to any counties or landed churches you own, but retain the family "church" that exists "outside" of the world. But you get the Papal lands to compensate.


That was a lot, and I thank everyone who was able to get through all of it. I hope it makes coherent sense, and that you are ready and willing to critique it. I welcome criticism, and would like very much to see a system implemented to play as a theocracy, being one of the only kinds of governments or characters that are not yet playable. So bring on the questions/comments/concerns! Before it is asked, I don't have any ideas on non-Catholic theocracies. Sorry.

The rest of this post is going to be an example of how this might be played in a game, enjoy. For the sake of space, I've put it in spoilers.

You start a game in the Old Gods start date. You pick an ecclesiastical dynasty located in the Archbishopric of Toulouse that has no holdings. Let's call this dynasty the de Toulouse dynasty.

At the beginning, you have a church that exists "outside" of the world, and you are one of the six ecclesiastical dynasties that exist within the Archbishopric of Toulouse. At the moment, you have a modest income, and don't really have much to do. But you have a brother, and you arrange a marriage for him. You have also begun to save money to put towards your...advancement. You've only got a limited lifespan, and don't want to die a simple Bishop. The very thought makes you sick.

So you take your stack of gold that you've accumulated through money gained from your one church, and send a gift to the local Archbishop. This is followed by a request for the church in Foix: it's not owned by an ecclesiastical dynasty, and you would very much like to own it.

The Archbishop grants your request, and you now have a right to that landed church. So, you begin to plot the assassination of that church's Bishop, and within a year, you get the church.

From here, you set your eyes on fabricating a claim on the county that the church is in. Surely no secular ruler can resist a claim from Holy Mother Church that she should rule over this county, right? It takes a few years, but you acquire the rights to the county. You are now free to assemble an army and conquer it, forcing that upstart count to become a mere baron, and be a vassal to your proud dynasty.

That upstart baron wants to excommunicate his rival, though, and he needs your help in doing so. Since you are doing him a service in a serious church matter, you can ask him for a "donation" to help you overlook some of his faults. He is dead-set on this excommunication, and has enough gold to pay your modest bribe, so he gives you the cash and you send the request up the hierarchy to the Archbishop of Toulouse. The Archbishop likes you and is relatively neutral about the baron, so he approves of it. The Primate approves of it, but the Pope wants a donation made that the baron simply can't afford. Oh well, looks like he doesn't get to excommunicate his rival.

Unfortunately, this has taken a somewhat long time, thanks to your rather unskilled Chancellor. But fortunately your nephew has just recently turned 16, and is ready to take on the mantle of leading your ecclesiastical dynasty, should you die. Knowing this...you die, and he takes over. He inherits the two churches, and the landed one comes with a county attached to it.

From here, your nephew (now referred to as Ruler 2 sets his eyes on becoming the Archbishop of Toulouse. He is relatively well-liked by the King of Aquitaine, who has made Free Investiture the law of the land, and with some help from a campaign fund, and the very timely death of the old Archbishop, Ruler 2 has become the next Archbishop of Toulouse. Being generally more liked among the Bishops of Toulouse than the Duke of Toulouse, most of them send their taxes to you.

Now, you can participate in the ecclesiastical affairs of Aquitaine as a whole: after all, there's a Primate of Aquitaine, and it isn't you. This problem needs to be fixed. This also gives you a place to negotiate from with the Duke of Toulouse-you can deny his every request, or you can squeeze him for as much as you can get. Or you can just decide to be nice and let the requests through. All you know is you want to be proclaimed the Primate of Aquitaine.

As previously mentioned, Ruler 2 has good relations with the King of Aquitaine, is a very pious man, and he has managed to save up some gold in his campaign fund. The poor old Primate, the Archbishop of Bourbon, had an unfortunate accident while on a carriage ride, and Ruler 2 has secured being named the Primate of Aquitaine.

Except, Karling politics being what they are, the King of Aquitaine has died and his crown was left to the King of West Francia. As the Primate of West Francia, the Archbishop of Normandy gloats, you are no longer the Primate of Aquitaine. Oh well, easy come easy go. You can now target his job, and then he won't be so giddy.

But, you decide to go on a different route. With your wealth, you realize that you could fund your own campaign to be selected as the next Cardinal in Rome. Being the Pope would be a nice change-you would have to surrender control of all your holdings outside of the family church...but you want to do it. For the honor of de Toulouse, you make it your mission to become the next Cardinal.

After a generous campaign fund donation and a few hired thugs, an elderly drunk of a Cardinal has unfortunately died, leaving the perfect place for you! The Pope names you the newest Cardinal, and everything is going well. You're still only the Archbishop of Toulouse, but you now have a say in who becomes the next Pope. Good news for you, you're so well-liked by the other Cardinals that you're the Preferatus! There is only one thing standing in the way between you and the Chair of Saint Peter...that pesky Pope. He dies of an unfortunate accidental snake bite, and you now find yourself the Bishop of Rome, the Pope. You've surrendered your church+county in Toulouse (to a randomly generated character), and have inherited the Papal holdings.

You are the final decider on all matters related to the Roman Catholic Church. Primates who like you more than their secular liege send their taxes to you, and boy, are they a lucrative source of funds, in addition to the funds provided by the Papal holdings. There is that King of England who has established an Antipope...but he is about to be killed by Norse pagans anyways, so you're not too concerned. England can be reclaimed for Christ at a later date.

You've been managing your family well, and you have a prime candidate picked out from several choices, to lead the dynasty in the unfortunate event of your death. Shortly after designating this unmarried young man your heir, you pass away.

Now, your new heir, Ruler 3 starts in a similar position that your first ruler did. Only, the dynasty is more prestigious, and the home church is certainly more spruced up than it was before. You also are more likely to be elected the next Archbishop of Toulouse. Who knows, maybe the current Archbishop will have an unfortunate accident...

This next spoiler is some technical notes that are suggestions of mine, feel free to skip them if you want:

*Treasuries are not passed from Archbishop to Archbishop or from Primate to Primate, they remain in the ecclesiastical dynasty. However, I don't think this should be the case for the Papal Treasury-it should be passed from Pope to Pope. So when Ruler 2 dies and passes on leadership of the ecclesiastical dynasty to Ruler 3, Ruler 3 starts off with a relatively small amount of gold, but if Ruler 2 worked on upgrading the dynasty's home church, he should have a nice income and modest troop levels.

*Personally, I don't think ecclesiastical dynasties should be able to move. So, in the above situation, your dynasty is going to be tied to the Archbishopric of Toulouse as long as catholic characters hold onto the land within the Archbishopric. If you get taken out in a Jihad, game over.

*If the Ducal title (such as the Duke of Toulouse) gets attached to, or taken by, the Archbishop of Toulouse, then he would simply be the Prince-Archbishop of Toulouse, and would fill the role of both the Duke of Toulouse and the Archbishop of Toulouse

*It goes without saying that members of ecclesiastical dynasties should be forbidden from holding titles in a Republic or holding feudal titles-anyone who marries into an ecclesiastical dynasty gives up their claims and cannot inherit titles. This prevents a fair amount of...funkiness.

EDIT 1: Assume that requests for indulgences goes through the normal channels outlined above. Requests for claims and invasions should (imo) go through the Pope
 
Last edited:

Alblaka

Foresightful Flag-Choser
101 Badges
Apr 12, 2013
4.016
1.665
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Sengoku
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Magicka 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Victoria 2
I would support and buy this DLC. This doesn't sound unrealistic, albeit I'm not sure whether it was close to this in the original medieval times... Maybe ecclesticaly dynastys can be connected to bloodline dynasties? Because I'm sure there was the one or other dynasty that was cooperating and supporting their own line of bishops and similar stuff.
 

nicholas2000

Second Lieutenant
76 Badges
Aug 2, 2011
161
2
  • Sengoku
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Supreme Ruler: Cold War
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
I would support and buy this DLC. This doesn't sound unrealistic, albeit I'm not sure whether it was close to this in the original medieval times...

If the existence of the Cardinal-nephew is anything to go by, this type of set-up seems (relatively speaking) to be in-line with what one could expect to be going on at the time.

Maybe ecclesticaly dynastys can be connected to bloodline dynasties? Because I'm sure there was the one or other dynasty that was cooperating and supporting their own line of bishops and similar stuff.

I considered it as a possibility, and it is certainly a choice, but I thought that in terms of game play it would help make everything a bit smoother, so I'm personally willing to sacrifice that cooperation for the sake of game play.
 

Dr Pearceson

Captain
46 Badges
Dec 20, 2012
314
48
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Prison Architect
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
I really like this idea. In fact it's probably the best idea for playable theocracies i've ever seen.

Also, shouldn't the Archbishops hold titular duchies, just so when you expand you don't outrank your liege. Sorry if you already mentioned this but i don't remember reading it.

Another point: Maybe when you become Pope, you family's heir gets you county/s so they can boost their money and prestige. Also it makes sure you don't lose your hard work
 

Gunnarr

Field Marshal
37 Badges
Mar 5, 2012
2.941
414
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
I think they will not go back they already did this dlc Sorry they wont do two religious dlcs and I am sure they debated quite awhile about having playable theocracies while drunk in a bar
 

Chevaresqye

General
18 Badges
Dec 19, 2012
2.193
15
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
I think they will not go back they already did this dlc Sorry they wont do two religious dlcs and I am sure they debated quite awhile about having playable theocracies while drunk in a bar

SoA is a religious DLC. ToG is a religious DLC. SoA is a religious DLC. Theocracy can be the fourth religous DLC.
 

Carbon

The Tiger
66 Badges
Apr 7, 2007
1.060
16
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
Some good ideas here. Playable theocracies are a must and something I would really like to see, they are certainly not completely incompatible with dynastic play.
 

Alblaka

Foresightful Flag-Choser
101 Badges
Apr 12, 2013
4.016
1.665
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Sengoku
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Magicka 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Victoria 2
I considered it as a possibility, and it is certainly a choice, but I thought that in terms of game play it would help make everything a bit smoother, so I'm personally willing to sacrifice that cooperation for the sake of game play.

Yes, but if we want this as a DLC, Paradox needs an incentive to do so. The suggested changes would barely alter the gameplay of other partys (Fudal Lords, Republics, etc), whereas f.e. the Republic DLC added trade posts boosting economy, embargo wars... That's why I suggested the possibility of a feudal dynasty 'sponsoring' a ecclestial dynasty for a non-theologist player to still have an direct interaction with the DLC's content ^^
 

unmerged(205402)

Major
4 Badges
Apr 30, 2010
591
0
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Heir to the Throne
People was send to clergy if they was dont want by senior in they dynasty to heir anything. So clergy dude who rule dynasty is unlogic to medieval times. But why dont give posibility to give clergyman a concubine or lover? It was normal for that times, many bishops had more than 10 kids.

And from new clergy option you can make some options to give one of your bastards claim to inherit what he got from church lands. :p

Or other idea, just abandon the dynasty here - and in theocracy mode you play only as elected or choocen person. So you must fight somehow with your king to not set his candidate who can be weak, or try to influence best candidate to have next bishop with awsome stats.
 

unmerged(189294)

Sergeant
4 Badges
Jan 6, 2010
96
1
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
That's very well thought through. Would the higher ranks also be able to create new ecclesiastical dynasties through creating a new title in some holdings? And Might you also have plots to gain landed churches from other ecclesiastical families?

Perhaps Synods could be incorporated as plot decisions where the Primate of a Kingdom (or Archbishop of an independent Duchy?) can convene a Synod based on one of several situations. Each would take the form of 'hold Synod-> make decision-> present petition to King'. In general a motion would pass if the majority of the Bishops and Archbishops of the Kingdom have a high enough relationship with the Primate (and possibly some other factors such as relationship with the King, piety, zealousness etc.), and failure would give a prestige hit to the Primate. Refusing the petition would also give a prestige hit and relationship malus between King and Primate.

1. If in an aggressive Holy War and the Primate has a good relation with the King, a Synod can be called to grant higher liege levies from the church lands than the Crown Laws would ordinarily permit in return for giving the titles to some land (probably in the new lands) to the Primate.

2. If the King is of another religion/heresy to the Primate, the Synod can demand his conversion- refusal of the petition here could lead to a rebellion.

3. If the King is excommunicated, and has very high relations with the Primate and most Bishops (through long reign etc.), the Synod could petition the Pope for the excommunication to be lifted- refusal here might lead to the Primate declaring himself antipope in favour of the excommunicated ruler.

4. If there are counties where the populace and ruler are of another religion/heresy, then the Synod could demand that a title is transferred to the Church in return for a period of increased conversion chance.

5. If bordering a potential Holy War target that is weaker than the Kingdom, the Synod could demand that war be declared in return for higher troop numbers and some initial morale buffs.

6. If a Crusade has been called, the Synod could call for the King to join the Crusade in return for gold (i.e. the Primate is giving a donation to the war chest for mercenaries)

7. For Free Investiture when the Primate likes the Pope more than the King, then the Synod could demand the imposition of Papal Investiture (insert Thomas Becket event chain here).

Obviously some of these might be a bit OP and would need testing, but I think the last one especially should be in there, and in general it can give a ruler an interesting choice (appease the church but gradually grow more dependent on it, or oppose the church and try and break the power of a strong Primate).
 

Me_

Myself
82 Badges
Jan 14, 2011
9.555
12.061
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sengoku
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Victoria 2
I'm glad that Doomdark is still the project lead, as he said a few times that he has no intention of making theocracies playable.
 

nicholas2000

Second Lieutenant
76 Badges
Aug 2, 2011
161
2
  • Sengoku
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Supreme Ruler: Cold War
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
Yes, but if we want this as a DLC, Paradox needs an incentive to do so. The suggested changes would barely alter the gameplay of other partys (Fudal Lords, Republics, etc), whereas f.e. the Republic DLC added trade posts boosting economy, embargo wars... That's why I suggested the possibility of a feudal dynasty 'sponsoring' a ecclestial dynasty for a non-theologist player to still have an direct interaction with the DLC's content ^^

It would certainly change the gameplay of other parties. Feudal lords and merchant families would have to navigate through the hierarchy of the Church if they wanted anything done by them, meaning that they would have to work to get on good terms with the clergy, or have the money to pay them off. In addition, there are many possibilities for more interaction through heresies and the creation of an anti-Pope.

Also, shouldn't the Archbishops hold titular duchies, just so when you expand you don't outrank your liege. Sorry if you already mentioned this but i don't remember reading it.

Personally, my line of thinking was that the game of the clergy isn't so much about expansion as it is about working you way up through the hierarchy of the Church. The notion being that you can only expand within your own Archbishopric. So I wasn't quite envisioning an Archbishop being able to conquer more than one Archbishopric-because that notion seemed a bit OP given the nature of how easy it would be to pass on titles to your heir.

Another point: Maybe when you become Pope, you family's heir gets you county/s so they can boost their money and prestige. Also it makes sure you don't lose your hard work

It is certainly a possibility, but I saw that as being too easy to exploit by the player. I was thinking that, really, the only thing that should be able to pass from you to your heir would be an Archbishopric. Passing on a Primacy to your heir, or even the Papacy, would be too easy to game, and wouldn't reflect the historic reality of clergy still having to work their way up through the hierarchy. Given the power and wealth of the Pope and that the Primates would have, it only seems natural that they would need to be staggered.
That's very well thought through. Would the higher ranks also be able to create new ecclesiastical dynasties through creating a new title in some holdings? And Might you also have plots to gain landed churches from other ecclesiastical families?

Perhaps Synods could be incorporated as plot decisions where the Primate of a Kingdom (or Archbishop of an independent Duchy?) can convene a Synod based on one of several situations. Each would take the form of 'hold Synod-> make decision-> present petition to King'. In general a motion would pass if the majority of the Bishops and Archbishops of the Kingdom have a high enough relationship with the Primate (and possibly some other factors such as relationship with the King, piety, zealousness etc.), and failure would give a prestige hit to the Primate. Refusing the petition would also give a prestige hit and relationship malus between King and Primate.

1. If in an aggressive Holy War and the Primate has a good relation with the King, a Synod can be called to grant higher liege levies from the church lands than the Crown Laws would ordinarily permit in return for giving the titles to some land (probably in the new lands) to the Primate.

2. If the King is of another religion/heresy to the Primate, the Synod can demand his conversion- refusal of the petition here could lead to a rebellion.

3. If the King is excommunicated, and has very high relations with the Primate and most Bishops (through long reign etc.), the Synod could petition the Pope for the excommunication to be lifted- refusal here might lead to the Primate declaring himself antipope in favour of the excommunicated ruler.

4. If there are counties where the populace and ruler are of another religion/heresy, then the Synod could demand that a title is transferred to the Church in return for a period of increased conversion chance.

5. If bordering a potential Holy War target that is weaker than the Kingdom, the Synod could demand that war be declared in return for higher troop numbers and some initial morale buffs.

6. If a Crusade has been called, the Synod could call for the King to join the Crusade in return for gold (i.e. the Primate is giving a donation to the war chest for mercenaries)

7. For Free Investiture when the Primate likes the Pope more than the King, then the Synod could demand the imposition of Papal Investiture (insert Thomas Becket event chain here).

Obviously some of these might be a bit OP and would need testing, but I think the last one especially should be in there, and in general it can give a ruler an interesting choice (appease the church but gradually grow more dependent on it, or oppose the church and try and break the power of a strong Primate).

These sound like great ideas, and would certainly help to bolster interaction between existing game structures and my proposed theocracies. Thank you :)
 

Captain Frakas

Field Marshal
13 Badges
Apr 10, 2002
7.139
3.768
  • Cities in Motion
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • 500k Club
  • Hearts of Iron II: Beta

Sylentwolf8

Sergeant
77 Badges
Jun 29, 2011
56
2
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Cities in Motion
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Dungeonland
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • 500k Club
  • War of the Roses
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • The Showdown Effect
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
Regarding Holy Orders, perhaps something that could be done would be instead of having families and dynasties, the game could have control of the Holy Order fought over between four different factions and the player would control the leader of one of these factions similar to Republics. From there it would be important for the leader of the faction to recruit new and either influential or skillful individuals while at the same time trying to expand influence by building castles and vying for the position of Grand Master. Historically the Knight's Templar at least had it's Grand Masters elected similar to that of the Doge of Venice and some other republics using an electoral college system where the most skillful and influential of the order would be elected. Another alternative would be to have the head of religion for that Holy Order choose the next Grand Master from among the faction leaders by choosing the one with the best skills, along with the best relation with the head of religion.
I'd love to see a DLC where Theocracies and Holy Orders are added.
 

Gunnarr

Field Marshal
37 Badges
Mar 5, 2012
2.941
414
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
SoA is a religious DLC. ToG is a religious DLC. SoA is a religious DLC. Theocracy can be the fourth religous DLC.

no that is not how it works sorry. Any hope for yet another dlc on the catholics is a waste of typing. There is not enough demand for it at all and a waste of company resources. There will not be another byzantine dlc, not another muslim dlc, not another pagan dlc, and not another catholic dlc. ESPECIALLY after one just came out a few weeks ago.
 

Chevaresqye

General
18 Badges
Dec 19, 2012
2.193
15
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
no that is not how it works sorry. Any hope for yet another dlc on the catholics is a waste of typing. There is not enough demand for it at all and a waste of company resources. There will not be another byzantine dlc, not another muslim dlc, not another pagan dlc, and not another catholic dlc. ESPECIALLY after one just came out a few weeks ago.

The DLC has a completely different focus. Just like SoA give improvement to the Muslim,a Theocracy DLC can improve the gameplay of all other religion. You are not a PDS employee, so to be honest, what you say about possibility of future DLC is meaningless.

I have no problem with your expression of lacking of interest in a Theocracy DLC. But making statement about the future development of CKII is not for you to say.
 
Last edited:

Anonymous01

Lt. General
4 Badges
Nov 20, 2013
1.255
1.273
This is wonderful. It bridges the more frequent 'apostolic succession' suggestions with paradox's apparent concern for maintaining the blood-relation element. If paradox won't do this, we need to pressure them hard for any modding changes required to do this ourselves.

One addition that comes to mind RE: tying the ecclesiastical game to the feudal game is coronation. Something like, 'can't be emperor of X unless primate of X agrees to anoint you.' A simple relations logic would be fine I guess, but a more fleshed out decision/event chain would be preferred. It could work something like the 'request a title' intrigue menu decision: if the AI/player disagrees, the character gets a Cassius Belli. For coronation requests, the war loss condition could be 'primate abdicates, king Y is crowned emperor of X.'

Again, great job you've done here.

EDIT: wow, sorry, didn't realize how old this was. I'll have to avoid the reply button when skimming through search results.
 

LumberKing

Philosopher
104 Badges
Dec 16, 2013
3.838
480
www.christianforums.com
  • Rome Gold
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Sengoku
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • March of the Eagles
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Cities: Skylines Industries
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Age of Wonders
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Victoria 2
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Magicka 2: Ice, Death and Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
I don't think it needs to be this complex. Instead I think something similar to the Republican Patrician Elective would suffice as well as making it plausible (at least for the Eastern Church).

Though it started to disappear quite early in the Western Church, the concept of a married clergy was widely available and still exists today in the Eastern Church. The whole succession could be based on the Patrician Elective (we'll call it "Divine Elective" or "Episcopal Elective") where instead of relying on prestige, it would instead rely on piety for the most suitable candidate. Make it so that all the candidates are "Priests" (or Cardinals if you make the Papacy playable though that will complicate things), landless barony-level characters like the Patricians. Regarding marriages, allow the Priests to stay married with their current spouse, but disallow any future marriages and once one of them become elected to become a Bishop; instant divorce (in game mechanics, it'll be explained as a "separation" in real-life).

While we're on the topic, the same concept (minus the celibacy) could be used for Jewish characters, where the one who restores the Kingdom of Israel can have a choice to restore it as a theocracy instead where they would be ruled by the "Judges" instead of "Kings" where at the cost of having a sizeable army and a stable dynastic rule, the player can now become the High Priest and thus call the Great Holy War in the name of YHWH.