Resource transport using convoys

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kviiri

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If there's a ground route available, will resources needing transport always take it instead of shipping through the ocean using convoys - even if the ground route would be impractically long? (Say, around the Mediterranean instead of through)
 
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LordOfWar16

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Atleast during the streams, if the german player bought stuff from the soviet union, romania and/or italy it didnt require convoys according to the trade window. That might of course be an display bug, but as far as i know there was landtrade in HoI III aswell. I can imagine tho, that you have to have an direct connection to their country for that of course.
 

Maizel

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I wonder how this will be factored in, in the game.

in HOI 3, whenever a convoy got sunk, you just lost an amount of resources.

In HOI IV I imagine that for that given day, you get less resources, being available for construction from the one you traded, or imported from your colonies, having many convoys sunk being a bit of a drain to your construction. Though it seems to be way more minor from HOI3 . But this is all my conjecture.
 

LordOfWar16

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I wonder how this will be factored in, in the game.

in HOI 3, whenever a convoy got sunk, you just lost an amount of resources.

In HOI IV I imagine that for that given day, you get less resources, being available for construction from the one you traded, or imported from your colonies, having many convoys sunk being a bit of a drain to your construction. Though it seems to be way more minor from HOI3 . But this is all my conjecture.
convoy raiding will decrease the amount of resources passing through an area "flowing" through an area. It doesnt only affect trade aswell. Resources generated in oversea colonies need to be shipped via convoys to the homeland in order to be useable. In theory you could cut off the UK from their colonial resources completly, rendering them useless for them.

Singapore alone generates 850 rubber, 308 tungsten and 32 steel for them, so cutting that off is an very good idea.
1e1326de051a329c85206128d34675f8.jpg
 
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Maizel

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convoy raiding will decrease the amount of resources passing through an area "flowing" through an area. It doesnt only affect trade aswell. Resources generated in oversea colonies need to be shipped via convoys to the homeland in order to be useable. In theory you could cut off the UK from their colonial resources completly, rendering them useless for them.

Singapore alone generates 850 rubber, 308 tungsten and 32 steel for them, so cutting that off is an very good idea.
1e1326de051a329c85206128d34675f8.jpg
Right, thank you.

The amount of convoys needed, appears to need some splitting. I assume it takes 413 convoys to ship all the resources. Not 413 to ship all individual resources,


Also. When a convoy gets sunk, does it means resources lost for that day ( or whatever length of time) or only one convoy lost from your stockpile of convoys? In other terms, as long as you have spare convoys, no amount of raiding will cause you to lose available resources to pump into your industries? Other than the resources spent to build replacement convoys.
 

kviiri

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Atleast during the streams, if the german player bought stuff from the soviet union, romania and/or italy it didnt require convoys according to the trade window. That might of course be an display bug, but as far as i know there was landtrade in HoI III aswell. I can imagine tho, that you have to have an direct connection to their country for that of course.


Yeah I know land trade exists, I was wondering whether land routes are uses when it would be insanely inpractical. One thing I hate about EU4 is how it portrays walking around the Mediterranean as easy (no Local Authority penalty) while anyone sane would just sail through in a few days.
 

LordOfWar16

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Right, thank you.

The amount of convoys needed, appears to need some splitting. I assume it takes 413 convoys to ship all the resources. Not 413 to ship all individual resources,


Also. When a convoy gets sunk, does it means resources lost for that day ( or whatever length of time) or only one convoy lost from your stockpile of convoys? In other terms, as long as you have spare convoys, no amount of raiding will cause you to lose available resources to pump into your industries? Other than the resources spent to build replacement convoys.
you will loose the resources for that day if the convoy is sunk. Resources are calculated on an daily throughput.
 
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BeauNiddle

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you will loose the resources for that day if the convoy is sunk. Resources are calculated on an daily throughput.

There is actually a hidden stockpile in the background to smooth things out. I think it's the average supplies delivered over the last 7 days or something similar.

This is to stop constant massive spikes in the resource calculations.
 

LordOfWar16

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There is actually a hidden stockpile in the background to smooth things out. I think it's the average supplies delivered over the last 7 days or something similar.

This is to stop constant massive spikes in the resource calculations.
that are still no stockpiles. That is just an mechanic that smooths it out. You still lack the ressource regardless but the effect of it will gradiually get worse. Just like with the out-of-supply effect, which will gradiually get worse and reaches its peak after 30 days once your units run out of supply.
 

potski

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Atleast during the streams, if the german player bought stuff from the soviet union, romania and/or italy it didnt require convoys according to the trade window. That might of course be an display bug, but as far as i know there was landtrade in HoI III aswell. I can imagine tho, that you have to have an direct connection to their country for that of course.
There was overland trade in HOI3, and the lack of convoys in those windows is not a display bug, but an indication that the same rules apply. If your capital is on the same continent as the seller's capital, then the resources you trade come to you overland without convoys. So Germany can trade with Soviet Union, Romania and Italy overland.

This always produced some odd results. Germany could trade with Portugal overland, and this still applied even when there was a war with France and the only possible way to travel would have been through a hostile country and pass through the frontlines.

UK and Japan could trade with other countries overland, even without land connections to the rest of their respective continents. And Japan could trade with Tibet and have it's resources pass through China while at war.

Despite these oddities, the rules work quite well to allow the Axis countries in Europe to trade amongst themselves, without sending convoys through the English Channel and/or getting blocked at Gibraltar.

There are no concerns over the length of the route overland, where it might be quicker by sea - distance is not taken into account in the overland trade. The resources basically teleport from one capital to another. I guess it's abstracted that they travel by train, river barge and maybe even by coastal ships to get where they need to.

Another slightly odd result is that before war with the Allies, Japan can't get Rubber from Malaya nor oil from DEI. The colonies always ship their resources by convoy back to London and Amsterdam. Then Japan has to send convoys to get them from Europe. But it wasn't a biggie, given that this only really happened at peace when those convoys wouldn't be sunk.

There are two small changes which affect how this all works in HOI4. Firstly, I'm pretty sure there was simply an Asia continent, and Japan could trade with Iran and Iraq overland. Now there is a Middle East continent shown on the trade and diplomatic screens. That would require Japan to use convoys, so if during the war Iran or Iraq go fascist, Japan gets no easy oil. It can trade with them, but would have to send convoys that would be attacked.

Secondly, India is no longer just a colony, so the requirements to ship all resources back to London no longer applies. British Raj can trade directly with other countries. And specifically this means China can trade overland with British Raj, so there is a sort of Burma Road that Japan cannot blockade. But it's not OP because China still can't get oil from the Middle East, and therefore will always struggle to mechanise it's army or build a decent air force.

It's a couple of small, but important, changes that make the war over resources in Asia better.
 
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